Superdelegate thing is sickening

Damocles said:
Except the theme this year is to not adopt the crazies to run. I don't know what you are hearing, but the platform isn't "upped" and last election it certainly wasn't stripped. Badnarick spent more time talking about how "unconstitutional" Driver's licenses are and why he never had one than he did about any of the real issues of the day. He was a nut, and people like him are what make the L party a joke and why people like RP leave.

The goal isn't to "strip" the platform, it is to put forward people who have more appeal than the nuts.
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The platform isn't "upped" what does that mean? The LP platform was stripped of many planks in Portland 2006.

I agree, Badnarik was a lousy candidate. That's why I did not bother voting in 04. Browne was a good candidate. His positions were radical but he expressed them well.
 
Damocles said:
Active members of the party can easily be overwhelmed by those who feel the process is bad and want to change it.

Excusing it because you don't want to work to change the process and/or are too lazy to pay attention before you suddenly realize the process is "this" and calling it "legitimizing" the process therefore is a weak excuse.

If you are a Democrat and you don't like this, get a group together to work to change the process you want to "delegitimize". At this point the only choice you have is to "not vote" and thus "not legitimize" that process. How many of those people who are complaining are willing to take even that step?
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A process where the ideas and platforms are controlled by the corrupt party machine means all choices suck, and all choices serve the elite.

The process is broken and should be avoided. Tune in, DRop out, Bitch about it.
 
AssHatZombie said:
A process where the ideas and platforms are controlled by the corrupt party machine means all choices suck, and all choices serve the elite.

The process is broken and should be avoided. Tune in, DRop out, Bitch about it.
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That's the opposite of what is needed. Voter participation is already at embarassingly low levels in America, and - prior to this primary season for Dems- has steadily gone done.

Apathy & disinterest, historically, tend to not accomplish that much....
 
Onceler said:
That's the opposite of what is needed. Voter participation is already at embarassingly low levels in America, and - prior to this primary season for Dems- has steadily gone done.

Apathy & disinterest, historically, tend to not accomplish that much....
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Im not disinterested or apathetic. I think the path offered for "change" is ineffective at achieving such. I suggest maximum bitching and outrage.
 
AssHatZombie said:
A process where the ideas and platforms are controlled by the corrupt party machine means all choices suck, and all choices serve the elite.

The process is broken and should be avoided. Tune in, DRop out, Bitch about it.
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Thus you take over the machine with people who want things to not be corrupt.

Whether you believe you can, or cannot change things.... you are right.

The reality is, that the "machine" is run by people who are active, who choose how these things are selected. If you don't like it and become active you and those who believe like you can change it to something you prefer.

Running around going "But, but, but THEY are CORRUPT" is no excuse to do nothing, except to the already defeated.
 
AssHatZombie said:
Im not disinterested or apathetic. I think the path offered for "change" is ineffective at achieving such. I suggest maximum bitching and outrage.
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You prefer to run your life from the "I'm already defeated" platform. I prefer to be more optimistic.
 
Damocles said:
Thus you take over the machine with people who want things to not be corrupt.
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Nice thought. But in making ideological sacrifices, staying off divisive or impolite topics etc, you slowly mutate into the system yourself, adopting a framework of pragmatism to dictate your beliefs.
Whether you believe you can, or cannot change things.... you are right.

The reality is, that the "machine" is run by people who are active, who choose how these things are selected. If you don't like it and become active you and those who believe like you can change it to something you prefer.

Running around going "But, but, but THEY are CORRUPT" is no excuse to do nothing, except to the already defeated.
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I find your framework of pragmatism to be crushingly defeatist in essence as well. So there.
 
AssHatZombie said:
Nice thought. But in making ideological sacrifices, staying off divisive or impolite topics etc, you slowly mutate into the system yourself, adopting a framework of pragmatism to dictate your beliefs.


I find your framework of pragmatism to be crushingly defeatist in essence as well. So there.
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I find everything you say to be only defeat.

Every bit of what you say is an excuse why you cannot do anything to improve the situation.

I do not believe that the only thing we can do is watch as we recognize our own defeat, I think it is weak to believe so.
 
AssHatZombie said:
YEs If I really cared I would pony up and support mccain the shithead. Not quite.
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My questions were more to why you would support somebody who was directly worse to your "core". McCain does not cover what my "core" is, nor does Obama, I won't be supporting either unless they consider a platform that includes those values.
 
Damocles said:
I find everything you say to be only defeat.

Every bit of what you say is an excuse why you cannot do anything to improve the situation.

I do not believe that the only thing we can do is watch as we recognize our own defeat, I think it is weak to believe so.
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Actually useful action depends on an unclouded worldview. The premises the parties insist you adopt just to be ONE OF THEM are already an attack on free thought and actual choice.

Pragmatism, Just Say No.
 
AssHatZombie said:
Actually useful action depends on an unclouded worldview. The premises the parties insist you adopt just to be ONE OF THEM are already an attack on free thought and actual choice.

Pragmatism, Just Say No.
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Standing around and saying, "Look! They are so powerful and made me do this!" is again just an excuse to accept your own defeat. They have you so programmed you believe that there is nothing you can do to fight them. I find that weak. I will continue to tell you so. You are either weak minded, or weak willed as you continue to stand there and preach how much I can't make a difference. You preach their message as you pretend you are an "outsider".

Weakness is accepting defeat before you even attempted to fight.
 
Damocles said:
Standing around and saying, "Look! They are so powerful and made me do this!" is again just an excuse to accept your own defeat. They have you so programmed you believe that there is nothing you can do to fight them. I find that weak. I will continue to tell you so. You are either weak minded, or weak willed as you continue to stand there and preach how much I can't make a difference. You preach their message as you pretend you are an "outsider".

Weakness is accepting defeat before you even attempted to fight.
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WHo has me programmed damo?
WHo's "THEY"? SOunds pretty sinister. I hope this isn't racism, because nobody is ridiculed as much as a perceived racist.
 
If there was a voter turnout of 95% + in America, it would be among the most significant revolutions in history. Our political landscape would change in a very dramatic way.

If voter turnout keeps going down, we'll get what we've been getting.

It's a no brainer to me.
 
AssHatZombie said:
WHo has me programmed damo?
WHo's "THEY"? SOunds pretty sinister. I hope this isn't racism, because nobody is ridiculed as much as a perceived racist.
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You are programmed as you constantly tell me that defeat is the only option. Your message is that I should give up, let it be as it is, that there is "nothing that I can do".

Yes, you are programmed into a belief in your own ineffectiveness and defeat. I feel sorry for people like you.
 
It's no wonder you find consolation in conspiracy theories. It helps solidify your belief that "they" are so powerful and you "so weak" that there is nothing you really can do...
 
Onceler said:
If there was a voter turnout of 95% + in America, it would be among the most significant revolutions in history. Our political landscape would change in a very dramatic way.

If voter turnout keeps going down, we'll get what we've been getting.

It's a no brainer to me.
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I completely disagree. As the morale goes lower and lower and the meaningless enthusiasm for the relatively minor issues presented as "The Party Platforms" dissipates, the elite and the people will be standing face to face in silence, with the awful truth raging all around.
 
AssHatZombie said:
I completely disagree. As the morale goes lower and lower and the meaningless enthusiasm for the relatively minor issues presented as "The Party Platforms" dissipates, the elite and the people will be standing face to face in silence, with the awful truth raging all around.
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And what truth is that? Our inevitable powerlessness and defeat? That we can "do nothing"? That change is impossible because they "make us believe" things?

That isn't truth, that is your programming talking.
 
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