The bible

Frank Apisa said:
And even if that actually happened, why would the fulfillment of a prophecy indicate that a GOD exists?
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How exactly to you think Jesus knew what was going to happen 37 years in the future. And this is but one example of fulfillment of prophecy but because you don't actually study the Bible and history you are clueless as to what is going on. Time is ticking away.

Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, even to the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
 
ExpressLane said:
How exactly to you think Jesus knew what was going to happen 37 years in the future. And this is but one example of fulfillment of prophecy but because you don't actually study the Bible and history you are clueless as to what is going on. Time is ticking away.

Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, even to the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
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Jesus H. Christ, EL...are you that dense?

ANYONE in that time could have predicted that Rome would attack any city or province or country...

...and the prophecy would come true.

Rome attacked goddam near everyone. A prophecy that Rome was going to attack someone is like prophesizing that the sun was going to come up next morning.

And your history is fucked up about who succeeded Nero. It was Caligula, not anyone named Tiberius. Claudius succeeded Caligula. Nero succeeded Claudius...and Galba succeeded Nero. Tiberius was the second emperor of Rome...and succeeded Augustus.
 
ExpressLane said:
How exactly to you think Jesus knew what was going to happen 37 years in the future. And this is but one example of fulfillment of prophecy but because you don't actually study the Bible and history you are clueless as to what is going on. Time is ticking away.

Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, even to the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
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If there is a book that was written about ancient Rome...fiction or non-fiction...I have almost certainly read it. I know more about Roman history than you can even imagine. I knew the names of the first ten emperors of Rome while still in grammar school.

And as for the Bible, here is a bibliography of the Bibles in my den right now...the Bibles I have used for discussions starting even before the Internet became what it is:

St. Joseph Edition of The New American Bible; Catholic book Publishing, NY; 1968 (Catholic)

The New American Bible; Thomas Nelson Inc, Nashville; 1971 (Catholic)

The Holy Bible King James Version; Thomas Nelson, Nashville: 1984 (Protestant)

The Holy Bible New International Version; Zondervan Bible Pub. Grand Rapids; 1978 (Non-demoninational)

The Scofield Reference Holy Bible (King James Version); Oxford Univ. Press; NY; 1909 (Protestant)

The Holy Scriptures Masoretic Text; Jewish Publ Society; Philadelphia: 1955 (Jewish)

The Holy Bible, St.Joseph Textbook Edition, Confraternity Version; Catholic book Publ: NY; 1963; (Catholic)

The Holy Bible Revised Berkeley Version; The Gideons Intrl; 1984; (Non-denominational Protestant)

The New American Catholic Edition of The Holy Bible; Benziger Bros, Boston; 1950 (Catholic)

The Old Testament; Guild Press NY; 1965 (Catholic)

The Living Bible; Holman Illustrated Edition: A.J. Holman Co; Philadelphia; 1973 (Protestant)

The Holy Bible; King James Version; The World Publ Co: Cleveland; (no date); (Protestant)

The Old Testament; Hebrew Publishing Co: NY; 1916 (English & Hebrew) (Jewish)

**** Also I use

The Common Catechism of the Christian Faith: Seabury Press;NY 1975 (Protestant)

Catechism of the Catholic Church: Libreria Editrice Vaticana; Urbi et Orbi Comm; 1994 (Catholic)

The New St. Joseph Baltimore Catechism: Catholic Book Publish; NY; 1962 (Catholic)

*****Plus, I have (estimated) 40 - 50 other books dealing with the Bible, religion, and philosophy that I use when posting.

So don't give me that bullshit about not having studied the Bible.
 
Frank Apisa said:
Horse shit. If you know something...it is because it has been proved. If it is based on "faith"...it is not knowledge.

Anyone asserting "There is a GOD" or "There are no gods" is doing nothing more than sharing a blind guess about the REALITY.
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Learn what 'real' and 'reality' mean, dude. These words are defined in a branch of philosophy known as phenomenology.
Knowledge if more than proofs.

Proofs only exist in closed functional systems, such as mathematics or logic. They do not exist in open functional systems, such as religion, science, or philosophy.
 
Frank Apisa said:
Jesus H. Christ, EL...are you that dense?

ANYONE in that time could have predicted that Rome would attack any city or province or country...

...and the prophecy would come true.

Rome attacked goddam near everyone. A prophecy that Rome was going to attack someone is like prophesizing that the sun was going to come up next morning.
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Apparently the Jews didn't!
 
Frank Apisa said:
If there is a book that was written about ancient Rome...fiction or non-fiction...I have almost certainly read it. I know more about Roman history than you can even imagine. I knew the names of the first ten emperors of Rome while still in grammar school.

And as for the Bible, here is a bibliography of the Bibles in my den right now...the Bibles I have used for discussions starting even before the Internet became what it is:

St. Joseph Edition of The New American Bible; Catholic book Publishing, NY; 1968 (Catholic)

The New American Bible; Thomas Nelson Inc, Nashville; 1971 (Catholic)

The Holy Bible King James Version; Thomas Nelson, Nashville: 1984 (Protestant)

The Holy Bible New International Version; Zondervan Bible Pub. Grand Rapids; 1978 (Non-demoninational)

The Scofield Reference Holy Bible (King James Version); Oxford Univ. Press; NY; 1909 (Protestant)

The Holy Scriptures Masoretic Text; Jewish Publ Society; Philadelphia: 1955 (Jewish)

The Holy Bible, St.Joseph Textbook Edition, Confraternity Version; Catholic book Publ: NY; 1963; (Catholic)

The Holy Bible Revised Berkeley Version; The Gideons Intrl; 1984; (Non-denominational Protestant)

The New American Catholic Edition of The Holy Bible; Benziger Bros, Boston; 1950 (Catholic)

The Old Testament; Guild Press NY; 1965 (Catholic)

The Living Bible; Holman Illustrated Edition: A.J. Holman Co; Philadelphia; 1973 (Protestant)

The Holy Bible; King James Version; The World Publ Co: Cleveland; (no date); (Protestant)

The Old Testament; Hebrew Publishing Co: NY; 1916 (English & Hebrew) (Jewish)

**** Also I use

The Common Catechism of the Christian Faith: Seabury Press;NY 1975 (Protestant)

Catechism of the Catholic Church: Libreria Editrice Vaticana; Urbi et Orbi Comm; 1994 (Catholic)

The New St. Joseph Baltimore Catechism: Catholic Book Publish; NY; 1962 (Catholic)

*****Plus, I have (estimated) 40 - 50 other books dealing with the Bible, religion, and philosophy that I use when posting.

So don't give me that bullshit about not having studied the Bible.
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You have not studied the Bible. That's obvious. Listing various printings means nothing. Personally, I think you are just puffing yourself up and making up shit.
 
Frank Apisa said:
Jesus H. Christ, EL...are you that dense?

ANYONE in that time could have predicted that Rome would attack any city or province or country...

...and the prophecy would come true.

Rome attacked goddam near everyone. A prophecy that Rome was going to attack someone is like prophesizing that the sun was going to come up next morning.

And your history is fucked up about who succeeded Nero. It was Caligula, not anyone named Tiberius. Claudius succeeded Caligula. Nero succeeded Claudius...and Galba succeeded Nero. Tiberius was the second emperor of Rome...and succeeded Augustus.
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Frank with your vast knowledge of the Bible and Roman history you should know. Jerusalem was not in revolt Rome had firm control of Jerusalem in 33 AD and had been for more than 100 years. There was no reason to think Rome would be sending armies to siege Jerusalem. The truth is even early Christians realize Jesus prophesied Jerusalem would be destroyed and Christians would have a brief period of time to flee before destruction fell on Jerusalem. And Christ knew members of his audience would be alive to see the siege of Jerusalem.

NIV Luke 20:21 When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near.People that believed his prophecy survived by fleeing to the mountain city of Pella.

Frank you are old you should rethink your position before it is too late.

Frank you are correct about Tiberus it has been a while since I reviewed this. It was Vespasian not Tiberius.

Shortly before the siege of Jerusalem, a civil war broke out in Rome. Vespasian became the new emperor in 69 CE, and Titus, the second in command in the war, took up the reins. The Romans were at the gates of Jerusalem, in 70 CE, besieging the walls.
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https://www.worldhistory.org/article/823/the-great-jewish-revolt-of-66-ce/
 
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Frank Apisa said:
Horse shit. If you know something...it is because it has been proved. If it is based on "faith"...it is not knowledge.

Anyone asserting "There is a GOD" or "There are no gods" is doing nothing more than sharing a blind guess about the REALITY.
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Fine. Give me the reality.
 
Guille said:
Fine. Give me the reality.
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The REALITY Guille is that either there IS at least one GOD...or there ARE no gods.

I do not know which it is. I have seen no evidence whatever than anyone else does either.

That is the REALITY.
 
ExpressLane said:
Frank with your vast knowledge of the Bible and Roman history you should know. Jerusalem was not in revolt Rome had firm control of Jerusalem in 33 AD and had been for more than 100 years. There was no reason to think Rome would be sending armies to siege Jerusalem. The truth is even early Christians realize Jesus prophesied Jerusalem would be destroyed and Christians would have a brief period of time to flee before destruction fell on Jerusalem. And Christ knew members of his audience would be alive to see the siege of Jerusalem.

NIV Luke 20:21 When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near.People that believed his prophecy survived by fleeing to the mountain city of Pella.

Frank you are old you should rethink your position before it is too late.

Frank you are correct about Tiberus it has been a while since I reviewed this. It was Vespasian not Tiberius.

https://www.worldhistory.org/article/823/the-great-jewish-revolt-of-66-ce/
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Anyone who uses a prophecy that Rome was going to invade ANY province or city...as proof that there is a GOD...is a moron.
 
ExpressLane said:
Frank where did Joseph take Jesus after he was born?
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I do not know and neither do you.

If you are asking where the Bible says Joseph took Jesus after Jesus was born...the answer is: To Egypt.

That seems a ludicrous suggestion, but if you buy into the mythology of the Bible...fine.
 
Frank Apisa said:
Anyone who uses a prophecy that Rome was going to invade ANY province or city...as proof that there is a GOD...is a moron.
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Frank Rome was in firm control of Jerusalem in 33 AD. Christ said Jerusalem would be surrounded and destroyed DURING members in His audience lifetimes. Rome had been in stable control of Jerusalem for at least 100 years when he said this. Christ prophesied

1. Jerusalem would be surrounded by armies.

2. People would have time to flee AFTER Jerusalem was surrounded by armies.

3. People in his audience would still be alive to witness this event.

4. Jerusalem which had existed for hundreds of years would be destroyed

5. Jerusalem's inhabitants would be put to the sword or led away captive.

6.. Additionally he prophesied the Temple would be destroyed The temple was built by Nebuchadnezzar in 516 BCE so it had stood for 546 years when Christ made this prophecy.

7. He predicted the massive stones of the Temple would be torn down stone by stone. [note: the wailing wall is a retainer wall and not the temple.]

Mat 24:5 As some of the disciples were remarking how the temple was adorned with beautiful stones and consecrated gifts, Jesus said, 6“As for what you see here, the time will come when not one stone will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”

According to Josephus when Jerusalem was destroyed in 70 Titus was instructed to spare the temple which had stood for 546 years. Jewish zealots retreated into the Temple and were attacking Roman soldiers the Roman soldiers fired flaming projectiles at them and set the Temple on fire. (It had a cedar covered in gold roof on it.) The huge carved stones that made the walls were torn down because the gold that covered the roof and other areas melted. The soldiers tore down the huge stone walls to recover the gold.


Frank your argument that Rome would be likely to destroy the temple and tear it down stone by stone, that Titus was told to preserve, which had stood for 550 years and destroy Jerusalem and put over a million people to death or enslave them in the next 40 to 50 years is laughable.
 
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Frank Apisa said:
I do not know and neither do you.

If you are asking where the Bible says Joseph took Jesus after Jesus was born...the answer is: To Egypt.

That seems a ludicrous suggestion, but if you buy into the mythology of the Bible...fine.
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Hosea was written between 760–720 BC In the Bible Christ has many names, Messiah, Savior, Christ, Jesus, The Word, and Israel.

Hosea 11:1 When Israel was a child, then I loved Him, and called my son out of Egypt.

Mat 2:4 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,
Mat 2:5

And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet,

Mat 2:15

And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son.

So 700 years before the Bible predicted Christ would be taken to Egypt . And 700 years later Jesus as a child was taken to Jerusalem.
 
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