The End Of Christian America

Lorca said:
Well your Founding Fathers did, as they plainly 'declared' in the Dec of Independence. And that was their intent.

So you can judge others as unequal, sinners, lesser, whatever (even tho God declared that's His job) all you want under the premise of you religion. But the govt may not.
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Didn't Thomas Jefferson own slaves?

And to respond to your second statement: How can you legislate laws without a clear definition of morality?
 
Morality is derived from our empathy. It is organized and tested through the use of reason. Religion is not a source of morality. It is a source of moral authority and control.
 
The first amendment.

The establishment clause: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of a religion ...

The free exercise clause: ......... or prohibiting the free exercise there of.
 
philly rabbit said:
With you the government are the people collectively. With you there is no private property, no numerical majorities within the states and no states rights. There is only powerful centralized government and through it's judicial branch the legislation of laws and the granting of rights to the government's agents, the states.

If the numerical majority within any state decides to decorate their state buildings with religious artifacts that are historical in nature or confederate flags which are same, you will support centralized government removing them.
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That is 100% wrong about what I think & believe. You keep writing that crap. You are delusional, I have never written or implied ANY of that.

God hates liars....you are sinning, over and over....by perpetuating lies about me when you know no such things about me.

(That's God, btw. I dont really care what people on the Internet think of me, but it's hard to have a discussion when the other person CANT ASSIMILATE information AT ALL.)
 
philly rabbit said:
Ireland and Poland broke away from their host countries because both had very strong cultural, tribal identities.

So they seceded from their host countries and formed their own culturally established independent nations based on their religious, ethnic, racial backgrounds.
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What is wrong with you....you just bleat the same crap over and over and cant READ? The quote about Ireland, Italy, Poland, was about the fact that this country was BUILT on multiculturalism and mass immigration...which you cried about in an earlier post.
 
Lorca said:
That is 100% wrong about what I think & believe. You keep writing that crap. You are delusional, I have never written or implied ANY of that.

God hates liars....you are sinning, over and over....by perpetuating lies about me when you know no such things about me.

(That's God, btw. I dont really care what people on the Internet think of me, but it's hard to have a discussion when the other person CANT ASSIMILATE information AT ALL.)
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So you're a big states rights advocate?
 
Lorca said:
What is wrong with you....you just bleat the same crap over and over and cant READ? The quote about Ireland, Italy, Poland, was about the fact that this country was BUILT on multiculturalism and mass immigration...which you cried about in an earlier post.
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The country was built with one culture that was born when the Declaration Of Independence was signed.
 
philly rabbit said:
Didn't Thomas Jefferson own slaves?

And to respond to your second statement: How can you legislate laws without a clear definition of morality?
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Unfortunately, many people in Jefferson's era didnt consider blacks as fully human.

Do you agree with that?

Because Jefferson and the Founding Fathers DID believe in and intend for Americans to be EQUAL. Is the Declaration of Independence a lie? Did they fake it?

Today, society recognizes that blacks and women are equal.

Do you prefer keeping society in ignorance and suffering in some misguided attempt at maintaining a Christian majority?

And there are many ways to legislate laws and there are many laws based on morality that the vast majority believe in. Murder, robbery, assault, etc etc etc. The basis is 'infringing on the rights of others.' Not religious beliefs. And the Founding Fathers were pretty clear about rights that should not be infringed (and not establishing ANY state religion.)

We also dont make laws based on every moral transgression: people can lie and cheat, for example, and in many cases it is legal.
 
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philly rabbit said:
So you're a big states rights advocate?
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Yes, pretty much, but no state can undermine the basic rights established in the Constitution. And as such, no state can establish it's own religion or force religious laws on it's citizens. Or make ALL it's citizens pay for religious displays that favor only one religion that they may not believe in. (Just a few examples.)
 
philly rabbit said:
The country was built with one culture that was born when the Declaration Of Independence was signed.
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Really?The country was built and finished, DONE, in the 1700s?

No, the country was ESTABLISHED back then and built and continues to be built over 200 yrs.

But again, if you think we should go back to a culture where slavery and women as property were condoned, please let me know.
 
Not to mention, your only argument against what I said is to label it liberalism and attempt to dismiss it via identity politics.

Not that I see it as an insult, but what I said has nothing to do with liberalism.
 
Professor Baxter said:
Morality is derived from our empathy. It is organized and tested through the use of reason. Religion is not a source of morality. It is a source of moral authority and control.
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Not really, it was derived from expedience, to enable individuals to live together in small bands, then communities, without killing each other, stealing each other's food and women, and to enable working together to protect territory.
 
philly rabbit said:
The first amendment.

The establishment clause: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of a religion ...

The free exercise clause: ......... or prohibiting the free exercise there of.
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How does (falling back on the common theme here) the govt not creating any religious monuments or displays prohibit anyone the free exercise of their religion?
 
Lorca said:
Not really, it was derived from expedience, to enable individuals to live together in small bands, then communities, without killing each other, stealing each other's food and women, and to enable working together to protect territory.
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Yes, really.

We have always lived together in small bands. We have always had a capacity for moral behavior/reasoning. Look into studies on other primates and animals. What we identify as moral action is the result of our ability to empathize and is very much connected to how much a species cares for its young.
 
Professor Baxter said:
Yes, really.

We have always lived together in small bands. We have always had a capacity for moral behavior/reasoning. Look into studies on other primates and animals. What we identify as moral action is the result of our ability to empathize and is very much connected to how much a species cares for its young.
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I lived, ate, and breathed that stuff for a decade. Those 'rules' or 'enforced behaviors' enabled us to live in those small bands from the start. Morality was built on top of the 'acceptable' behaviors.

And the empathy developed from expedience as well.....we developed empathy to safely raise young that require alot of care for many yrs for the overarching (not conscious) goal of survival of our genes.

Matt Ridley and Desmond Morris are fun, layperson reads.
 
Lorca said:
I lived, ate, and breathed that stuff for a decade. Those 'rules' or 'enforced behaviors' enabled us to live in those small bands from the start. Morality was built on top of the 'acceptable' behaviors.

And the empathy developed from expedience as well.....we developed empathy to safely raise young that require alot of care for many yrs for the overarching (not conscious) goal of survival of our genes.

Matt Ridley and Desmond Morris are fun, layperson reads.
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We did not develop empathy from nothing. It was always present. Of course, our understanding and ability to empathize has increased.

I am not sure what point you are arguing now. But I will restate my initial one. Morality starts with empathy.
 
Professor Baxter said:
We did not develop empathy from nothing. It was always present. Of course, our understanding and ability to empathize has increased.

I am not sure what point you are arguing now. But I will restate my initial one. Morality starts with empathy.
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Of course we did develop empathy....it was selected for in our genetic makeup.
 
Lorca said:
Of course we did develop empathy....it was selected for in our genetic makeup.
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We did not acquire it any time recently. It goes way back in our evolutionary line. As I have said, it continues to develop and ours appears to be greater than that of other species.
 
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