The Ethics of Suicide

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IBDaMann said:
I did understand it. I'm not surprised that you did not. I think it would be a waste of time trying in vain to explain it to you so I'm happy with you simply not understanding it. I can understand your frustration at being unable to grasp really easy stuff, but we all have to draw the line somewhere.
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zzzzzzzzz
 
BidenPresident said:
In The Myth of Sisyphus, the 20th century French-Existentialist Albert Camus wrote, “There is but one truly serious philosophical problem, and that is suicide. Judging whether life is or is not worth living amounts to answering the fundamental question of philosophy. All the rest— whether the world has three dimensions, whether the mind has nine or twelve categories—comes afterwards.”

https://www.philosophersmag.com/essays/310-the-ethics-of-suicide
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I don't understand the dilemma. Your life is your life. If you desire to end it in battle against insurmountable odds, suicide by cop, Harikari, smoking/drinking/drugging yourself to death, or via euthanasia should you be fortune enough to live where that is legal -- what business is it of mine or anyone else?
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
I don't understand the dilemma. Your life is your life. If you desire to end it in battle against insurmountable odds, suicide by cop, Harikari, smoking/drinking/drugging yourself to death, or via euthanasia should you be fortune enough to live where that is legal -- what business is it of mine or anyone else?
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I agree. Although I generally agree with Aristotle, he argued that suicide harms the community and is therefore unethical.
 
BidenPresident said:
I agree. Although I generally agree with Aristotle, he argued that suicide harms the community and is therefore unethical.
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That's the Christian -- esp. Catholic -- POV as well. Boils down to "You're here, your job is to do stuff and suffer along with the rest of us." (kind of only joking a bit)

Funny how we honor those who suicide for some 'greater cause' but despise those who opt out as cowards, isn't it?
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
That's the Christian -- esp. Catholic -- POV as well. Boils down to "You're here, your job is to do stuff and suffer along with the rest of us." (kind of only joking a bit)
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St. Thomas built his theology on Aristotle.

But the Christian idea is rather sadistic. They think you are rejecting God's gift of life.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
Suffering here so you can maybe go to Heaven is fucking nuts, but then I'm not a Christian so what do I know? lol

What is your POV on suicide?
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My position is similar to yours, I agreed with your first statement.

States are finally coming around to legalizing assisted suicide. You may be familiar with Dr. Kevorkian.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
I don't understand the dilemma. Your life is your life. If you desire to end it in battle against insurmountable odds, suicide by cop, Harikari, smoking/drinking/drugging yourself to death, or via euthanasia should you be fortune enough to live where that is legal -- what business is it of mine or anyone else?
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There ARE other stakeholders. There really would be no issue if there were no mess left behind, which would be more likely if it were legal and could be properly planned.
 
BidenPresident said:
In The Myth of Sisyphus, the 20th century French-Existentialist Albert Camus wrote, “There is but one truly serious philosophical problem, and that is suicide. Judging whether life is or is not worth living amounts to answering the fundamental question of philosophy. All the rest— whether the world has three dimensions, whether the mind has nine or twelve categories—comes afterwards.”

https://www.philosophersmag.com/essays/310-the-ethics-of-suicide
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I think it's much, much simpler than that.

Are, by your own judgment, the rewards of your life adequate compensation for the travails?
If the answer, using your own benchmarks, is no, then the honest reality is that your life is a net-negative experience.
This net-negative status probably accounts for literally billions of human lives taking place right now.

Step two is to determine whether this net-negative experience is best addressed by terminating it of your own volition
or by dealing with it in another way. In the making of this decision, once again, no other values are relevant but your own.

One thing is for certain. A society that does not sanction humane euthanasia or assisted-suicide is lightyears away from becoming civilized--and that includes ours.

the value of human life is not absolute.
It's to be appraised in qualitative terms like the value of anything else.
 
BidenPresident said:
In The Myth of Sisyphus, the 20th century French-Existentialist Albert Camus wrote, “There is but one truly serious philosophical problem, and that is suicide. Judging whether life is or is not worth living amounts to answering the fundamental question of philosophy. All the rest— whether the world has three dimensions, whether the mind has nine or twelve categories—comes afterwards.”

https://www.philosophersmag.com/essays/310-the-ethics-of-suicide
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Camus was telling you to kill yourself. Funny how when I tell you to do that you complain but when Camus does it you start a thread...trying to look all smart and shit.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
I think it's much, much simpler than that.

Are, by your own judgment, the rewards of your life adequate compensation for the travails?
If the answer, using your own benchmarks, is no, then the honest reality is that your life is a net-negative experience.
This net-negative status probably accounts for literally billions of human lives taking place right now.

Step two is to determine whether this net-negative experience is best addressed by terminating it of your own volition
or by dealing with it in another way. In the making of this decision, once again, no other values are relevant but your own.

One thing is for certain. A society that does not sanction humane euthanasia or assisted-suicide is lightyears away from becoming civilized--and that includes ours.

the value of human life is not absolute.
It's to be appraised in qualitative terms like the value of anything else.
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Well said, Nifty. :hand:
 
If you want to off yourself for WHATEVER REASON...you should be able to do so. And you should be able to do it knowing that it will be as painless and certain as you want. So...it should be legal everywhere for a willing physician to assist.

There is a story (possibly apocryphal) about the suicide of Richard Brautigan (gunshot wound through the mouth out the top of his head) which has him leaving a note saying, "Messy, isn't it?"

It shouldn't be messy...but even more importantly, it shouldn't be illegal, although in some places it actually is.
 
Frank Apisa said:
If you want to off yourself for WHATEVER REASON...you should be able to do so. And you should be able to do it knowing that it will be as painless and certain as you want. So...it should be legal everywhere for a willing physician to assist.

There is a story (possibly apocryphal) about the suicide of Richard Brautigan (gunshot wound through the mouth out the top of his head) which has him leaving a note saying, "Messy, isn't it?"

It shouldn't be messy...but even more importantly, it shouldn't be illegal, although in some places it actually is.
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Heh, always wondered about that illegal thing. What punishment will they come up with for someone who has killed him/herself? Abuse your corpse?
 
Frank Apisa said:
If you want to off yourself for WHATEVER REASON...you should be able to do so. And you should be able to do it knowing that it will be as painless and certain as you want. So...it should be legal everywhere for a willing physician to assist.

There is a story (possibly apocryphal) about the suicide of Richard Brautigan (gunshot wound through the mouth out the top of his head) which has him leaving a note saying, "Messy, isn't it?"

It shouldn't be messy...but even more importantly, it shouldn't be illegal, although in some places it actually is.
Click to expand...

why do you worship the vortex of demonic nihilism?
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
Heh, always wondered about that illegal thing. What punishment will they come up with for someone who has killed him/herself? Abuse your corpse?
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it needs to be illegal so insurance companies don't overprescribe it to carry out their population reduction agenda.
 
I enjoy philosophy and philosophical questions, but sometimes philosophers can get themselves twisted into knots by overthinking things. This, to me, seems to be one of them.

What the essay does do, indirectly, is reinforce the case for why it's immoral to end someone else's life, outside of some imaginary being telling us it's immoral.
 
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