The main issue with Christianity

gfm7175 said:
You're not saying anything of meaning here. You're just slithering away into the shadows...
Click to expand...

I'd also note you seem to have just rolled over Euthyphro with a bulldozer. But again, if you don't understand the topic it's easy enough to do.

Try taking a philosophy class or reading a book.
 
gfm7175 said:
Why all of the insults towards me? You wanted to hold a respectable and intelligent conversation about these matters, right?
Click to expand...


Yes, I do.

You are correct, I should not hurl personal insults. That seems to be the norm here in this forum...and I play along.

I sincerely apologize for the personal insults.

Some of the things I say about the guesses you are making about the nature of gods will seem insulting. I must speak my mind, though, so you will have to tolerate those kinds of things.
 
gfm7175 said:
Hmmmmm... interesting. Is there some sort of belief about what happens after we die here? (not that we'd have any future awareness of it, by the sounds of it)
Click to expand...

My belief is that we keep coming back - many lives, many lessons. Until we finally get it right.

I watch & read a lot of near-death experiences. Those corroborate that idea, for the most part.
 
Frank Apisa said:
You people are nuts.

All sin is...is something that a human does that offends their god.

THAT IS WHAT SIN IS.

It is something that offends your gods.

If your gods are not offended by what you do...it is not a sin.

Sucking up to the god..."worshiping" the god...kissing the god's ass...IS NOT A SIN.

Yanking your dick is only a sin because it offends your gods. Killing other humans is only a sin when it offends your gods. If the killing is done because your gods want you to do it and are not offended...IT IS NOT A SIN.

When you write or quote something like, "God abhors sin"...all you are saying is that your gods do not want to be offended by what you do...but unfortunately, the god is offended by damn near everything you do other than to worship them.

Wake the hell up. Nothing whatever is wrong with guessing there are gods, but for chrissake, guess up some gods that make sense.
Click to expand...

???....what about this doesn't make sense.......yes disobedience is sin, obedience is not.......you say God is offended by "damn near everything other than worship".......yet God is not offended if you do not kill someone.......is not killing "worship"?.......

you think obedience is blind, yet God makes a clear statement of the moral standards he favors.......choices are not made blindly by anyone except those who refuse to examine their options......
 
Frank Apisa said:
You people are nuts.
Click to expand...
Who is "you people"?

Frank Apisa said:
All sin is...is something that a human does that offends their god.

THAT IS WHAT SIN IS.

It is something that offends your gods.

If your gods are not offended by what you do...it is not a sin.

Sucking up to the god..."worshiping" the god...kissing the god's ass...IS NOT A SIN.

Yanking your dick is only a sin because it offends your gods. Killing other humans is only a sin when it offends your gods. If the killing is done because your gods want you to do it and are not offended...IT IS NOT A SIN.

When you write or quote something like, "God abhors sin"...all you are saying is that your gods do not want to be offended by what you do...but unfortunately, the god is offended by damn near everything you do other than to worship them.

Wake the hell up. Nothing whatever is wrong with guessing there are gods, but for chrissake, guess up some gods that make sense.
Click to expand...
All you did here was repeat what you've said before, so to save bandwidth I will simply reference you back to my prior responses.
 
BartenderElite said:
My belief is that we keep coming back - many lives, many lessons. Until we finally get it right.

I watch & read a lot of near-death experiences. Those corroborate that idea, for the most part.
Click to expand...
Gotcha. I was just interested because I wasn't familiar with such belief. Thanks for the responses.
 
gfm7175 said:
Who is "you people"?
Click to expand...

In keeping with my desire to let this discussion develop with a level of respect, I will withdraw that reference.

All you did here was repeat what you've said before, so to save bandwidth I will simply reference you back to my prior responses.
Click to expand...

I can find nothing in your previous responses which mitigates the issue I have mentioned several times.

A sin is (and can only be) something that offends a god.

Christians aver that EVERYONE is a sinner...which means every human does things that offend the Christian god. If that does not say more about the Christian god than it does about humans...there is no clear thinking going on.

Don't worry about the bandwidth...there is plenty to spare.
 
Jesus Christ!
Some people really get into this Christian stuff.
It's a sin that I don't understand the discussion well enough to contribute meaningfully.
 
Frank Apisa said:
In keeping with my desire to let this discussion develop with a level of respect, I will withdraw that reference.
Click to expand...
Withdrawal noted and accepted.

Frank Apisa said:
I can find nothing in your previous responses which mitigates the issue I have mentioned several times.

A sin is (and can only be) something that offends a god.
Click to expand...
In part, yes. I'm not going to pretend that you are completely off base because you are understanding that the end result is that God disapproves of the behavior and is thus offended by it, but I think you're missing some important details beyond the "personal preference" perspective. Your perspective seems to be more personality focused (and focused on God himself) while mine is more design focused (and focused on God's creation).

As I said before, sin is a perversion of the good things that God has made. To put that into other words, sin is the vandalizing of Shalom. (meaning anything that ceases, slows, or otherwise works against God's design for creation (which is universal flourishing and wholeness).

Frank Apisa said:
Christians aver that EVERYONE is a sinner...which means every human does things that offend the Christian god. If that does not say more about the Christian god than it does about humans...there is no clear thinking going on.

Don't worry about the bandwidth...there is plenty to spare.
Click to expand...
Christians assert that everyone is a sinner (besides Jesus Christ) because everyone has, in one way or another, perverted the good and perfect transcendent order that God has created, working against universal flourishing and wholeness.
 
Quincunx said:
OOOOOO a rando on an internet forum decrees a dilemma to be false! STOP THE PRESSES! LOL.

It's clear you have almost no training in any of this topic. LOL. You're funny.
Click to expand...
Do you wish to learn why it is a false dilemma?

If so, then present the dilemma as you understand it (to avoid the response of "you didn't present it correctly") and then I will explain to you why it is false.
 
I liked this response. It got me thinking.

gfm7175 said:
To me, the topic of sin is more of a "quality control" and a "trust" issue than it is a "personal preference" issue. If viewing sin from a "quality control / trust" perspective, then any sin that a person commits thereby renders that person "blemished" and "untrustworthy". IOW, what rational man, who desires to be loved by his wife and be her "one and only", is going to trust her and be happy/satisfied living with her when she regularly cheats on him?

To ask a similar question: Would it be better for a person to live eternally in a state of "sin-induced blemish" or would it be better for a person to live eternally in a state of "restored perfection"?
Click to expand...

So this is the narrative I'm picking up from what you're laying down:

God becomes the first, and only, seven-sigma "black belt" and raises the quality control bar really high, seemingly becoming displeased with every little moral and ethical defect (sin). He knows that tightening the tolerances won't reach perfection, so He calls in His son, Jesus, who specializes in that kind of refurbishment work. Jesus makes his saving services available to all, free of charge, but there is some obligatory legal paperwork involved, e.g. you sign giving Jesus permission to do the work, you acknowledge the risks of later changing your mind, etc...
 
gfm7175 said:
Do you wish to learn why it is a false dilemma?

If so, then present the dilemma as you understand it (to avoid the response of "you didn't present it correctly") and then I will explain to you why it is false.
Click to expand...

I don't play games like this with people who don't understand the topic.
 
gfm7175 said:
I will take this response as an "I Quincunx do not wish to learn why it is a false dilemma".

Thus, I will leave you in your ignorance.
Click to expand...

I will take this as admission that you talk a big game while understanding nothing about the topic. Typical for a highschooler who thinks themselves too smart. One day you'll take some philosophy classes. IF you can get into college.
 
Quincunx said:
I don't play games like this with people who don't understand the topic.
Click to expand...
gfm7175 said:
I will take this response as an "I Quincunx do not wish to learn why it is a false dilemma".
Click to expand...
@gfm7175, you misinterpreted. He recognizes that you thoroughly spanked him and he is simply tipping his king.

giphy.gif


You might not have noticed but that's all he does. He hasn't gotten anything right thus far and now, tipping his king is more of an instinctive reflex for him.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top