The main issue with Christianity

IBDaMann said:
Please explain why. I can't read your mind. Are you saying that a normal, rational adult would somehow not agree with you and would not find what you wrote to be intuitive and reasonable?
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Not asking you to read my mind. Just hoping you would be an adult.

We don't always get our hopes!

Here is the unbolded part: Incorrect. Pull up a chair and I'll explain this one to you. Before I begin, however, I'll acknowledge up front that what you wrote above is what any normal, rational lay adult would find "intuitive."

If you are unable to figure out what I consider to be bullshit there...we'll just have to leave it be a mystery.


Yes, always. That was his theorem. It is what he proved.


It's not my assertion. It's a proven theorem, just as is the Pythagorean theorem.


He did, and you are now denying math.
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I claim bullshit on this. I say he did not prove any such thing.

If you want to argue that Gödel proved that, start a different thread on it. I think you are just attempting more bullshit to avoid dealing with the obvious nature of what I said. I do not mind...nor do I mind that you are stooping to suggesting I am not up to the mental standards of a discussion of this sort.


You have just tipped your king. Let me know when you'd like to reengage.
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I have not tipped my king. I really wish you would not stoop to the kind of bullshit teenagers use in these kinds of discussions.


This is the standard leftist defeat strategy. Upon losing, never admit it, deny the loss through historical revisionism by mischaracterizing what was said and done. I never made any of these assertions. You were simply unable to address the Incompleteness theorem.
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Either present a P1 and P2 that arrive at a C of "Therefore there are no gods"...or acknowledge that it is impossible to do...and that the arguments of Gödel do not relieve you of at least attempting an informal indication of HOW one might establish to any kind of certainty that no gods exist.


The strength of your argument never entered the scenario.
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Okay...but I have raised it now.

I think my argument is a hell of a lot stronger than yours. You obviously do also, because you are dragging other people into it in an attempt to make yours seem reasonable.

It isn't.


All that was being discussed was the ability to argue the position of knowability for the theistic assertion in question. It was you who revealed that your argument wasn't strong enough to stand up to the Incompleteness Theorem. You might want to work on it.
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Why are you making stuff up? I defy you to show where I indicated in any way that my argument was not strong enough to stand up to this Incompleteness Theorem. I DEFY YOU TO DO IT.


You are attacking an argument that was never made because its mere mention makes you feel threatened in some way.
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There is no way I feel threatened by you...and I doubt there ever will be a moment when that would happen. You are not the most formidable opponent I have had on this issue...and by very, very far.


If you express theism in Global Warming or Climate Change, then discussing your beliefs is appropriate.
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I do not express theism in any of those things...and I do not do "believing."


If you simply wish to discuss something that you believe but do not know, then the word "belief" is the appropriate word. You are obviously bothered by the use of the word "belief" in certain situations where it is entirely appropriate. Why?
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I do not do "believing."

If you want to ask me about my opinions, my conjectures, my suppositions, or my guesses...fine. I prefer that you not label my opinions, conjectures, suppositions or guesses "beliefs" because they are better labels as opinions, conjectures, suppositions or guesses.

At some point, I hope most people grok that fact.
 
Frank Apisa said:
Not asking you to read my mind. Just hoping you would be an adult.
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Nope. You are asking me to read your mind.

Frank Apisa said:
If you are unable to figure out what I consider to be bullshit there...we'll just have to leave it be a mystery.
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Then that is what we'll have to do. I don't know what you meant, you won't explain when I ask and you never asked me for any clarification on anything ... so yeah, a mystery it will remain.

Frank Apisa said:
I claim bullshit on this. I say he did not prove any such thing.
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Were you planning on performing any independent research? If not then I guess we're done.

Frank Apisa said:
...nor do I mind that you are stooping to suggesting I am not up to the mental standards of a discussion of this sort.
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I made no such suggestion. Would you mind quoting the text where you believe I said this, or will that remain a mystery as well?

Frank Apisa said:
I have not tipped my king. I really wish you would not stoop to the kind of bullshit teenagers use in these kinds of discussions.
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You tipped your king. This happens when you insist on a logical contradiction and won't undo it. We can't proceed further and you won't correct your error, the latter part of that is you tipping your king.

Frank Apisa said:
Either present a P1 and P2 that arrive at a C of "Therefore there are no gods"...or acknowledge that it is impossible to do
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Sorry, you failed to understand what I claimed could be argued. I'll run through it again for you:

1. P = "there are no gods"
2. You and I both acknowledge that P cannot be proven given our system of infinite statements
3. I mention that P is a true statement about the system that cannot be proven by the system, per the Incompleteness theorem
4. I proceed to explain why P is true
5. You and I discuss/debate the merits of my arguments in #4

At the moment, there is nothing for us to discuss because we aren't having this discussion and I am not making any arguments in #4 for us to discuss/debate, however something about this topic bothers you greatly and makes you willing to deny math for some reason. Obviously you and I would therefore not even be able to have this sort of discussion. As always, you can let me know when you have done some independent research and something changes.

Frank Apisa said:
Okay...but I have raised it now.
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Only after you have shut down any possibility of having this discussion in the first place.

Frank Apisa said:
I think my argument is a hell of a lot stronger than yours.
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I haven't made any argument. You and I never even started. I'd love to have this discussion with you but you need to research the Incompleteness theorem first. Let me know if you have any questions.

Frank Apisa said:
There is no way I feel threatened by you.
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Not me. Math.

Frank Apisa said:
You are not the most formidable opponent I have had on this issue.
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You've never had me as an opponent. I have always been on your side. If we have disagreed, it's because you were wrong.


Frank Apisa said:
I do not express theism in any of those things...and I do not do "believing." I do not do "believing."
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I apologize for the additional cold water but ... right now, you believe that you are fooling me. You are not. Let's confirm.

A. Do you claim that greenhouse gases are increasing the earth's average global temperature beyond that which is caused by the earth's changing distance to the sun and/or fluctuations in solar output?
B. Do you claim that there is a global climate that is changing?


Frank Apisa said:
If you want to ask me about my opinions, my conjectures, my suppositions, or my guesses...fine. I prefer that you not label my opinions, conjectures, suppositions or guesses "beliefs" because they are better labels as opinions, conjectures, suppositions or guesses.
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When referring to what you believe, please use the word "beliefs" because that is the correct word, not "opinions," "conjectures," "suppositions," or "guesses."
 
Quincunx said:
LOL. Says the guy who wants to watch it all burn down. You're hilarious.
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wrong.

i think the whole civil war thing is bullshit.

we clearly have the numbers to change the country within it's legal framework.

dems and the blm/antifa want to burn it down.

you have the facts reversed, dipshit.
 
JesusAI said:
wrong.

i think the whole civil war thing is bullshit.

we clearly have the numbers to change the country within it's legal framework.

dems and the blm/antifa want to burn it down.

you have the facts reversed, dipshit.
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You are so out of your depth on this topic it's actually kinda like watching a special needs kid try to do math. It's so sad to see how uneducated you are. I wish you just knew how AGRICULTURE worked let alone all the other stuff you need on this topic. But sadly you are a Nazi Moron. Why do you hate poor people so much? Is it because they are "beneath" you? Nazi.
 
Taichiliberal said:
I can't say it any better than this.
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You mean you can't PIVOT any better than that and EVADE any more effectively.

Why does her not believing in Christianity somehow empower her to just kill living humans who represent some form of inconvenience for her? Taichiliberal, would you be this enthusiastic about supporting her if she were kill you to make her life more convenient?
 
BartenderElite said:
Is that it's not aptly named.

A good portion - and I'd say most - of the religion are practices, rituals, rules and philosophies that were never spoken by Christ, or endorsed by Christ.

I think there are some sects that are strictly about the teachings of Christ, who I feel was an ascended being and someone whose words matter, but they're not mainstream Christianity.
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My main issue with the Christians is that they are liars. Plain and simple.
 
Quincunx said:
You are so out of your depth on this topic it's actually kinda like watching a special needs kid try to do math. It's so sad to see how uneducated you are. I wish you just knew how AGRICULTURE worked let alone all the other stuff you need on this topic. But sadly you are a Nazi Moron. Why do you hate poor people so much? Is it because they are "beneath" you? Nazi.
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shut your lying shitty mouth-hole, pompous lie fucker.
:truestory:
 
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