Trump’s Boxes and Clinton’s Sock Drawer

[Dutch Uncle]

If you believe that is how it works, you are truly stupid.

44 U.S.C. 2202

...or too much HCQ snorting has blown holes in his brain.

The fact remains this will be settled by law and apply to all Presidents. A fact a melon-picking charlatan won't be able to comprehend.

 

[Bigdog]

Based on that reading of the law and Constitution, if the CiC can just think and poof documents are no longer classified then the reverse must also be true, the CiC can just think and poof documents are classified. If Biden had a such a thought then it would make Trump guilty of retaining classified documents since Biden can make any document held by Trump classified.

Yeah, pretty much. Except you can't reclassify a declassified doc.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Yeah, pretty much. Except you can't reclassify a declassified doc.

That's not quite correct, pup. There are a few different ways material is classified. One way is to take a bunch of unclassified material and compile it into a report that makes it classified.

If you redact a classified report and it becomes declassified it can become reclassified should material be added or circumstances change.

 

[QP!]

Yes, when I quote from an article I give attribution. Don't you?

I do but why do you not.

Please cite the quote you made as i want to read the citation.

 

[QP!]

The science is "settled", the law is "settled", ... these are not arguments, they are symptomatic of tantrums.

To you and Qpi, this is the final summary from the ABA ...

" As the new ABA Legal Fact Check notes, the extent of a president’s legal authority to unilaterally declassify materials — without following formal procedures — has yet to be challenged in court."

Oops you accidentally forgot this part from the ABA notes you are quoting. Interesting how you end your quote right before this part...


...In all cases, however, a formal procedure is required so governmental agencies know with certainty what has been declassified and decisions memorialized. A federal appeals court in a 2020 Freedom of Information Act case, New York Times v. CIA, underscored that point: “Declassification cannot occur unless designated officials follow specified procedures,” the court said.

 

[QP!]

Being CIC of the military is a power granted by the Constitution to the president. I didn't see any limiting of that authority in article 2 section 2. Maybe YOU can find it.

Yes i can find lots of limits on the POTUS in A2S2. His power is NOT absolute and with check and balance in that section.

What Constitution did you read?

Oh wait... the right does not read. I keep forgetting that. What did FOx News tell you?

 

[Taichiliberal]

Everyone blames Fauci - but Fauci DID HIS JOB. His job was making sure lives were protected. There were a dozen other considerations for how we should have approached every aspect of COVID, and he should have had a REAL task force, with experts on education, childhood development, senior health, business, technology, et al., to formulate a comprehensive plan and address COVID more effectively and intelligently.

Instead, he sent mixed messages on everything, downplayed the virus repeatedly (by his own admission), and gave confusing messaging on everything from distancing to masks to the shutdowns. The country was all over the place and no one knew what to believe because he could not provide a coherent vision for the country to understand and follow.

The proof is in the pudding. Many of his own supporters will still not get the vaccine his efforts helped to accelerate - something that could have been a real accomplishment for him, but he blew it by spreading doubt about everything.

He was a mess. It was like a clinic in how NOT to lead.

Just to side bar from the OP:

Fauci did indeed do his job...which entailed perpetuating the FALSE narrative of using the PCR test to determine viral cause of current illness in a patient. Made a HELL of a lot of money for pharma companies, made medical careers (like his).

It was a false narrative when he did the SAME thing regarding HIV nearly 40 years ago. The man who INVENTED the process and won a Nobel Prize for it, the late Dr. Mullis, spent YEARS explaining to peer reviewed colleagues and medical academics just that. He routinely challenged Fauci to debate the issue among such...Fauci never did with him or anyone else.

That's just for starters.....Fauci's false claims and misleading narratives regarding Covid have been well documented. THIS contributed to the death rate. Period.

Now, back to the Orange Oaf and his document BS.

 

[Taichiliberal]

Okay, once more for the cheap seats:


Michael Bekesha, the ‘Clinton sock drawer’ lawyer, misses the distinction between agency records and presidential records.



To repeat, that case did not involve agency records — much less classified reporting by the government’s intelligence agencies. It involved nonclassified tape recordings that President Clinton made with historian Taylor Branch in anticipation of compiling a history of his presidency.




https://www.nationalreview.com/2023/06/where-judicial-watchs-defense-of-trump-goes-wrong/

Bump.

 

[martin]

Actually PRA would. Hunter is far more likely to sell them to Xi though.

Sure, instead of a boring debate on the law, you call in bold face for a school yard argument over which person would do the bad thing.

Such is Trumpworld.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Sure, instead of a boring debate on the law, you call in bold face for a school yard argument over which person would do the bad thing.

Such is Trumpworld.

TrumpWorld is Old America, the one which was murdered.

 

[martin]

TrumpWorld is Old America, the one which was murdered.

A man part pig, part shyster in Old America might have fooled enough voters to get elected but once exposed for what he was he would have fallen big time.

 

[Hawkeye10]

A man part pig, part shyster in Old America might have fooled enough voters to get elected but once exposed for what he was he would have fallen big time.

Look at you.

YUK.

 

[martin]

Look at you.

YUK.

Yeah, fallen here with everyone else still in bed on a Sunday morning. Yuk is right.

 

[Bigdog]

Yes i can find lots of limits on the POTUS in A2S2. His power is NOT absolute and with check and balance in that section.

What Constitution did you read?

Oh wait... the right does not read. I keep forgetting that. What did FOx News tell you?

Good. I'm sure you will post the quotes you found in A2S2 here for all to see, right?

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

Nope.

Fauci shut down lab leak theory despite scientists lending it credence, emails show
Jerry Dunleavy, Washington Examiner Jan 11, 2022

Fauci shut down lab leak theory despite scientists lending it credence, emails show

Scientists consulting with the U.S. government early in the pandemic believed COVID-19 originating from a lab in Wuhan, China, was possible or even likely, but Dr. Anthony Fauci and Dr. Francis Collins worked to shut the hypothesis down, according to several emails.

The emails were revealed Tuesday in a letter from Republican Rep. Jim Jordan, the ranking member on House Judiciary Committee, and GOP Rep. James Comer, the ranking member on House Oversight Committee. Some of the emails included notes from a Feb. 1, 2020, conference call in which at least 11 scientists theorized about the virus's origin, with many leaning toward the lab leak theory.

"[The emails] reveal that Dr. Fauci was warned of two things: (1) the potential that COVID-19 leaked from the Wuhan Institute Virology (WIV) and (2) the possibility that the virus was intentionally genetically manipulated," the lawmakers said.

Republicans said the Department of Health and Human Services made the unredacted versions of the emails available only behind closed doors, and so, committee staff hand-copied them. The emails appear to show that although Collins, the now-former head of the National Institutes of Health, and Fauci, the head of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, worked behind the scenes to cast down on the lab leak possibility, they had good reason to believe it was plausible.

Dr. Jeremy Farrar, the director of the Wellcome Trust, sent an email to Collins, Fauci, and Lawrence Tabak (then the principal deputy director of the NIH and now its acting director) on Feb. 2, 2020, summarizing the conference call and indicating that some of the scientists believed the lab leak theory was viable. Farrar noted, for example, that Mike Farzan (dubbed the "discoverer of SARS receptor" and a professor of immunology at Scripps Research) found a key aspect of the virus "highly unlikely" to have developed outside a lab.


"So, I think it becomes a question of how do you put all this together, whether you believe in this series of coincidences, what you know of the lab in Wuhan, how much could be in nature — accidental release or natural event? I am 70:30 or 60:40," Farrar recounted Farzan saying on the call.

Another scientist on the call, Tulane Medical School microbiology professor Robert Garry, said he could see no "plausible natural scenario" for key amino acids and nucleotides to have been inserted into a bat virus to make it the virus that would go on to kill more than 5 million people worldwide.

But in another email from the same day referenced in the lawmakers' letter, Ron Fouchier, the deputy head of the Erasmus MC Department of Viroscience, seemed to embrace the theory that the virus occurred naturally and warned that lab leak discussions could "do unnecessary harm to science in general and science in China in particular."

Collins sent an email back to Farrar, Fauci, and Tabak that day, saying he was "coming around to the view that a natural origin is more likely" and alluding to the lab leak hypothesis as a "conspiracy theory."

"I share your view that a swift convening of experts in a confidence inspiring framework (World Health Organization) seems really the only option) is needed, or the voices of conspiracy will quickly dominate, doing great potential harm to science and international harmony," he wrote.


Yet another email, this one from Collins to Fauci and others and dated April 16, 2020, showed him trying to push back against reporting from Bret Baier of Fox News on the lab leak theory. Baier cited multiple sources who had been briefed at the beginning on the origins of the virus and believed it had sprung from the lab.

"Wondering if there is something NIH can do to help put down this very destructive conspiracy, with what seems to be growing momentum," Collins wrote. "I hoped the Nature Medicine article [casting doubt on the lab leak theory] on the genomic sequence of SARS-CoV-2 would settle this. But probably didn't get much visibility. Anything more we can do? Ask the National Academy to weigh in?"

A day later, Fauci replied to his boss in an email released by the GOP lawmakers.

"I would not do anything about this right now," Fauci wrote. "It is a shiny object that will go away in time."

Fauci continued to insist as recently as November that it is "much more likely" that COVID-19 originated in nature rather than from the Wuhan lab.


https://denvergazette.com/news/fauc...cle_908df8b6-2161-5b7e-b7ed-003be942e341.html

Not a single sentence in there about Fauci illegally funding a lab and then spreading disinformation to prevent people from finding out he illegally funded the lab.

Fauci went around the law to fund gain of function research at the very same lab that gave us COVID Then when it looked like he would be exposed he began covering his tracks by spreading misinformation. We have the emails .That certainly was not Fauci job. You should stick to mixing booze cause you sure don’t know medicine,

It seems you did lose the emails that supported your claim.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

Yeah, pretty much. Except you can't reclassify a declassified doc.

Can an unclassified document be classified? A declassified document is nothing more than an unclassified document which means it could be determined to be classified.

But a declassified document that still has the classification headers on it doesn't need those headers added so the process only requires the President think it is classified and POOF, it's classified and has all the markings to make it classified.

 

[martin]

Just to side bar from the OP:

Fauci did indeed do his job...which entailed perpetuating the FALSE narrative of using the PCR test to determine viral cause of current illness in a patient. Made a HELL of a lot of money for pharma companies, made medical careers (like his).

It was a false narrative when he did the SAME thing regarding HIV nearly 40 years ago. The man who INVENTED the process and won a Nobel Prize for it, the late Dr. Mullis, spent YEARS explaining to peer reviewed colleagues and medical academics just that. He routinely challenged Fauci to debate the issue among such...Fauci never did with him or anyone else.

That's just for starters.....Fauci's false claims and misleading narratives regarding Covid have been well documented. THIS contributed to the death rate. Period.

Now, back to the Orange Oaf and his document BS.

Fauci's and the rest of the medical establishment's "claims" prompted most Americans to wear masks and get vaccinated. The statistical result was far less death and far less serious illness among Americans who took that advice than among Americans who
shunned it, not that it has made a whit of difference to Right wing ideologues.

 

[QP!]

Good. I'm sure you will post the quotes you found in A2S2 here for all to see, right?

You have to post your quotes and citations first. Go.

 

[Earl]

RFK Jr.

“RFK Jr. portrays Dr. Fauci as “cracking down on HCQ [hydrochloroquine] to keep case fatalities high.” (Page 30.) Speaking of federal decisions not to authorize Hydroxychloroquine as a COVID treatment, he says:

Most of my fellow Democrats understand that Dr. Fauci led an effort to deliberately derail America’s access to lifesaving drugs and medicines that might have saved hundreds of thousands of lives and dramatically shortened the pandemic. There is no other aspect of the COVID crisis that more clearly reveals the malicious intentions of a powerful vaccine cartel — led by Dr. Fauci and Bill Gates — to prolong the pandemic and amplify its mortal effects in order to promote their mischievous inoculations.”

The Real Anthony Fauci, p.19

 

[Bigdog]

Can an unclassified document be classified? A declassified document is nothing more than an unclassified document which means it could be determined to be classified.

But a declassified document that still has the classification headers on it doesn't need those headers added so the process only requires the President think it is classified and POOF, it's classified and has all the markings to make it classified.

Wrong.

And you can't claw back the information once a document has been declassified.