Education and Politics

[Matt Dillon]

you're a jerkoff....ok?

I'm a jerkoff that remembers what classes are required in college, ok?

What is a malakka though? If you know Greek..

 

[BidenPresident]

I'm a jerkoff that remembers what classes are required in college, ok?

Every college has their own requirements. Are you really this ignorant?

 

[T. A. Gardner]

The best thing America can do is make Community College an optional extension of High School, and it would be great if it was all paid for by local school taxes.

And Community Colleges should also offer many of the trade school coursework and IT, technical, and builder trade certifications.

If you are doing a trade, many times--especially with union apprenticeships--the school is paid for in full as part of it. Many companies will pay for their employees to do one too.

 

[Lightbringer]

One interesting phenomenon that has taken place in the last couple decades is that various communities within the US have been realigning politically based on education level.

There used to be low-education areas that voted Democrat consistently, and high-education areas that voted Republican. West Virginia went for the Democrat in eight out of ten presidential elections between 1960 and 1996. Virginia, meanwhile, went Republican in all but one presidential election between 1952 and 2004. But, lately, there's almost perfect sorting of the states by education into red and blue camps, as formerly Democratic low-education areas pulled right and started falling to the Republicans (including WV), while formerly Republican high-education areas went blue (including VA).

You can see that here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_educational_attainment

If you list those by the percent of residents with a Bachelor's degree, the top 15 ALL went for Clinton and Biden, in the last two presidential elections. Meanwhile, of the 29 lowest-education places, only two went Democrat twice in the last two presidential elections: Nevada and New Mexico (though PR also would have, if they got a vote).

You see similar patterns if you list by advanced degrees. In 2020, Trump lost all of the top twenty places with the highest percentage of residents who have advanced degrees. The patterns also tend to hold within states. For example, in New York State, downstate New York tends to be highly educated, and usually goes overwhelmingly Democratic, while upstate has less education, and often goes Republican. New York County (Manhattan), where 87% of voters went for Biden, is New York's most educated county, with 61.3% of those 25 and over with a Bachelor's degree or better. Tioga County, where 59% went for Trump, is New York's least educated county, where only 26% of those 25 and older have a degree.

This isn't unique to the US, either. Although there isn't perfect sorting my education level internationally, generally speaking highly liberal areas like the countries of Scandinavia and other parts of northern and western Europe tend to have high educational levels (e.g. 44% of Dutch people age 25-34 having a four-year degree or better), while more conservative areas have low education (eg., 19% for Chile, or 11% for Indonesia).

I think this helps to explain the hostility so many on the right feel towards higher education.... why, for example, there's such a push for sending fewer people to college and guiding more to trade school. An educated community amounts to home-field advantage for liberal politicians.

Stop talking about liberals, you are not liberal. There is a big difference between a liberal and a progressive. Modern professors and graduates are not liberal, there is nothing liberal about them, they are progressive.

 

[Mina]

Stop talking about liberals....

No.

I've noticed this tendency among reactionaries to order others to stop talking. I expect it arises out of deep-seated intellectual inferiority. Stupid people know, deep down, that they're stupid. That makes them doubt whether their beliefs can hold up in the face of a challenge, and so they have this tendency you've demonstrated of whimpering for silence in the face of things that make them uncomfortable. This is part of why nobody respect them.

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

No.

I've noticed this tendency among reactionaries to order others to stop talking. I expect it arises out of deep-seated intellectual inferiority. Stupid people know, deep down, that they're stupid. That makes them doubt whether their beliefs can hold up in the face of a challenge, and so they have this tendency you've demonstrated of whimpering for silence in the face of things that make them uncomfortable. This is part of why nobody respect them.

Well said. I've noticed that several of them here will thread-ban everyone who disputes the false assertions in their OPs. They seem to see themselves as prophets chosen to spread "the word." One example is Earl, who constantly posts false and/or misleading stories from Reichwing sources. It's a common occurrence here. On some level they are aware that what they're posting is bullshit, and fear that they'll be made to look unintelligent when that's pointed out.

 

[Mina]

Simple answer: Romney really isn't a mainstream Republican

He was mainstream enough, at the time, to capture the nomination fairly handily. But regardless of where you come down on that semantic issue, the focus on Romney is a distraction, because the phenomenon I'm talking about predated him. Republicans won with college graduates in 1988, 1992, 1996, 2000, and 2004. Yet, even as they did better with the college educated at an individual level, Republicans were increasingly uncompetitive in highly educated states and communities. For example, in 1996, Dole edged out Clinton by two points among the college educated, but in Massachusetts (then, as now, our most educated state), Clinton beat Dole by a staggering 33 points!

Here's another way to explain such a paradox. Say you've crashed on a desert island with a dozen other survivors and you're deciding what to do. Two scenarios:

(1) The other survivors were US park rangers en route to a conference. They're all healthy, physically in their prime, and are clever, industrious, all with first-aid training, and very experienced in the outdoors.

(2) The other survivors were patients being transported to a new mental hospital. Half of them are elderly or sickly and most of the rest are already coming apart at the seams.

In the first scenario, you'll of course make common cause with the other survivors -- cooperating to make shelter, find food and water, signal for rescue, and tackle the other challenges. In the second scenario, though, you're probably going to at least consider heading out on your own, rather than tie yourself to that deadweight. And that's true pretty much without regard to your own ability level.

Well, in that sense, when you're living in a poorly educated community, it's going to look like those who are around you are more likely to be deadweight, and so you're going to hate the idea of the government tying you to them. If, on the other hand, they're more educated, it's going to look more likely that you'll all be better off working together than risking the "rugged individualist" path solo.

That is, he'd be a Democrat in the say, 1970's but isn't today because the Democrats have moved too far Left for his tastes

As a reminder, Mitt Romney was in his 20's and early 30's in the 1970's and wasn't a Democrat. He was, in fact, the son of famed Republican George Romney -- a former Republican governor and a member of the Nixon administration in the 1970's. Mitt Romney's politics fit in just fine with the GOP at the time.... a time when the party was defined by people like Nelson Rockefeller.

There's a common misconception on the right that the Democratic Party changed dramatically from the 70's to today. But, really, it's the GOP that has changed so much. One telling feature is to think about the party's evolution on abortion. It used to be that lots of major Republicans respected a woman's right to choose to end an unwanted pregnancy. In fact, of all the recent Republican nominees for president, nearly all of them had been pro-choice, in at least some cases, before the party devolved into a theocracy (including, famously, Trump).

Liberal / Leftist politics comes down to non-thinkers who operate off feelings and emotion, often to the point where they willfully ignore logic and facts even when presented with them.

I think you just summarized right-wing politics quite well. That's why, for example, we again and again find that it's conservatives and Republicans who stake out positions that are contrary to simple and demonstrable facts, whether that's about the relative risks of vaccines and COVID, or the process of climate change. They're driven not by evidence, which just befuddles them, but rather by emotional reactions.

 

[Mina]

lets not confuse black vote for working class.

There are, of course, Black voters who are part of the professional class, as well. But my point is that the tendency to use "working class" as if it meant "undereducated white folks" is wrong.

but they have been losing groud there as well.

Right-wingers have been saying that for a very long time. Going all the way back to 1976, at least, the Black vote has gone for the Democratic presidential candidate at a rate between 83% and 91% every single election, other than the two when it briefly went even higher because there was an actual Black candidate. Republicans have a tendency to squint at that remarkable consistency and see a pattern of decline, based simply on the last two candidates not doing as well as Obama. That's silly.

 

[Mina]

education now is indoctrination. it basically means you're dumb and have no innate bullshit detector.

PHD = pile it higher and deeper.

I think what upsets right-wingers is that education acts as a defense against indoctrination. Consider, for example, the anti-vaxxer hype during COVID. There was a strong tendency for those with more education to get vaccinated. That's because their bullshit detectors had been honed, making them hard marks for the anti-vax propagandists. As a result, undereducated people died at higher rates during COVID. Their willingness to swallow bullshit ended up costing many their lives.

 

[Mina]

This post really deserves a big groan.

Yes, I've found that when poorly educated people have a negative emotional reaction to something, but lack the thinking skills needed to dispute it, they often resort to grunts, groans, and other inarticulate vocalizations..... kind of like a dog, really.

 

[Geeko Sportivo]

Stop talking about liberals, you are not liberal. There is a big difference between a liberal and a progressive. Modern professors and graduates are not liberal, there is nothing liberal about them, they are progressive.

We are all liberals- but on a sliding scale!
Even you!

I suppose that is what makes politics interesting and challenging for both parties.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

I think what upsets right-wingers is that education acts as a defense against indoctrination. Consider, for example, the anti-vaxxer hype during COVID. There was a strong tendency for those with more education to get vaccinated. That's because their bullshit detectors had been honed, making them hard marks for the anti-vax propagandists. As a result, undereducated people died at higher rates during COVID. Their willingness to swallow bullshit ended up costing many their lives.

lol.

you're totally indoctrinated.

 

[Mina]

lol.

you're totally indoctrinated.

Let me know if you can spot any specific issue with what I said.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

Let me know if you can spot any specific issue with what I said.

nearly everything you believe is a lie.

 

[Walt]

So you thank the OP for saying Republicans are against higher education, because it makes people vote more liberal, and want to push people towards trade school. But now you claim Democrats are actually strong supporters of trade schools? Too funny.

Conservatives oppose trade schools, because they allow anyone to move up in life. Conservatives prefer trades be limited to white men who have social connections in the trades.

Worse yet, to Conservatives, trade schools are a strong path towards unions.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

Let me know if you can spot any specific issue with what I said.

yes. your every moronic utterance.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

I think what upsets right-wingers is that education acts as a defense against indoctrination. Consider, for example, the anti-vaxxer hype during COVID. There was a strong tendency for those with more education to get vaccinated. That's because their bullshit detectors had been honed, making them hard marks for the anti-vax propagandists. As a result, undereducated people died at higher rates during COVID. Their willingness to swallow bullshit ended up costing many their lives.

You have it backwards. Today, most universities engage in indoctrination of students to one degree or another, and virtually 100% of that indoctrination is geared to pushing the student Left politically.

As for the poorly educated and Fauci Plague, the stupid--who you are really talking about--often are hurt by their lack of intellect. You can have a PhD and still be stupid...

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

Conservatives oppose trade schools, because they allow anyone to move up in life. Conservatives prefer trades be limited to white men who have social connections in the trades.

Worse yet, to Conservatives, trade schools are a strong path towards unions.

you obviously consume no conservative media.

You're talking out of your asshole again, walter.

 

[Walt]

you obviously consume no conservative media.

You're talking out of your asshole again, walter.

I know, I still believe the Holocaust happened.

But back to trade schools. Government run schools that funnel people into unions, and make them successful in life. Schools that remove white privilege, and force everyone to compete as equal. Yes, Republicans hate them.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

I know, I still believe the Holocaust happened.

But back to trade schools. Government run schools that funnel people into unions, and make them successful in life. Schools that remove white privilege, and force everyone to compete as equal. Yes, Republicans hate them.

yes. i also believe the holocaust happened. and the b.i.s facilitated hitlers rise.

those are not mutually exclusive.