H.R. 582, “Raise the wage act”

[Truth Detector]

Wrong. The minimum wage was NEVER designed to be a 'living wage'. Minimum wage was for UNSKILLED jobs. Meant for students or second income earners in a family. Meant for people needing to learn job skills.

Minimum wage laws kill job opportunities for High School and College students as well. Good point!

 

[Into the Night]

Whiners need to be dealt with that way.

Oh, they will, in the end. The government at some point will be forced to cut back on all their handouts like this, either controlled, by Congress reducing the programs, or uncontrolled, in a government collapse. These are the only options left to these programs now.

 

[Into the Night]

Is that an argument by Mason? I'd call it more unable to defend what he supports.

Not a valid one. He simply rejected an argument without any counter-argument. Rejecting an argument out of hand in and of itself is a fallacy, known as the argument of the stone (like talking to stone).

 

[Into the Night]

There have always been two types of people when it comes this topic. Those that work for/earn a living and those that vote for one. The problem is less and less want to earn it and more think the government should force someone else to provide it for them.

Nice summary. You have it right.

 

[Into the Night]

That is incorrect. It was not designed as that. https://www.thebillfold.com/2015/07/it-was-always-supposed-to-be-a-living-wage/

FDR said it was a living wage which he defined as "more than bare subsistence level. I mean wages of decent living."

Where do you get the info you post and do you ever look up corroboration?

FDR, like most socialists, was promising a Utopia that could never be fulfilled.

 

[Into the Night]

It is a stupid bill and will get killed in the Senate if it passes and/or vetoed by Trump. Why does the Party of the Jackass waste so much time on partisan issues like this without the bi-partisan support they need?

It's simple. The Party of the Jackass doesn't want what America needs. They want to destroy the Constitution and replace it with fascism by oligarchy.

 

[Truth Detector]

It's simple. The Party of the Jackass doesn't want what America needs. They want to destroy the Constitution and replace it with fascism by oligarchy.

CORRECT! I want to believe that a majority of Americans are not as stupid as the Democratic constituency and will reject it outright in 2020.

 

[Into the Night]

CORRECT! I want to believe that a majority of Americans are not as stupid as the Democratic constituency and will reject it outright in 2020.

I don't think you have much to worry about when it comes to that! Just look the numbers showing up at a Trump rally.

It's getting to be State fair season, go look at the Democrat table and the Republican table at them. You'll see it plain as day.

 

[Gonzomin]

Ok let's go back to FDR's living wage. He set the minimum wage due to industry paying slave wages! That hasn't been true for decades.

Yes it is. That is the point of raising the min wage. People are working for wages that barely cover the cost of going to work. When the min wage does not go up, it goes down due to inflation. Corporate profits are at all time high levels and wages are stagnant. That means, of course, that the top brass are confiscating it all. The living wage is a concept,one that is just as real today as it was in 1934. People should be paid a decent living wage for their wotk and time.

 

[CFM]

FDR, like most socialists, was promising a Utopia that could never be fulfilled.

That's because a utopia exists only in the imagination of people too far removed from reality.

Look at the Preamble. The founding fathers knew we couldn't have the utopia the left believes can exist. That's why they said a "MORE" perfect union.

 

[CFM]

Yes it is. That is the point of raising the min wage. People are working for wages that barely cover the cost of going to work. When the min wage does not go up, it goes down due to inflation. Corporate profits are at all time high levels and wages are stagnant. That means, of course, that the top brass are confiscating it all. The living wage is a concept,one that is just as real today as it was in 1934. People should be paid a decent living wage for their wotk and time.

If the only job your skill set can get is one that barely covers the cost of going to work, look in the mirror to see where the problem lies.

If you have $2/hour skills and because of federal law are getting paid at least $7.25/hour, how is that not a decent wage. It may not be what the one working wants but they can hardly claim making 3 1/2 times more than what they offer in skills isn't decent.

When is the last time you heard one of these low skilled workers say what they'll do to warrant a wage increase?

 

[gfm7175]

Yes it is. That is the point of raising the min wage. People are working for wages that barely cover the cost of going to work.

Then gain a skill or two?? Get educated?? Gain experience?? Make yourself worth more??

When the min wage does not go up, it goes down due to inflation.

So? If all you are worth to an employer is $7.25/hour, then see above for what you need to do...

Corporate profits are at all time high levels

Some corporations are doing well... Others are not doing so well... So?

and wages are stagnant.

My wages aren't. They increase every year. Many other people's wages aren't either. Maybe wages at $7.25/hour are stagnant, since that's all that the job is worth?? If $7.25/hour is not enough for you, then gain a skill or two, gain knowledge, gain experience, anything to make yourself worth more to others...

That means, of course, that the top brass are confiscating it all.

How can someone "confiscate" what is already theirs to begin with?

The living wage is a concept,one that is just as real today as it was in 1934.

It is a price control. It, like all other price controls, leads to shortages.

People should be paid a decent living wage for their wotk and time.

People are not entitled to a "decent living wage", whatever that subjective idea means. People should instead put some EFFORT into increasing their value to others instead of sitting around on their lazy ass with outstretched arms.

 

[Into the Night]

Yes it is. That is the point of raising the min wage. People are working for wages that barely cover the cost of going to work. When the min wage does not go up, it goes down due to inflation. Corporate profits are at all time high levels and wages are stagnant. That means, of course, that the top brass are confiscating it all. The living wage is a concept,one that is just as real today as it was in 1934. People should be paid a decent living wage for their wotk and time.

Price controls don't work, dude. Neither does fascism.

 

[Into the Night]

If the only job your skill set can get is one that barely covers the cost of going to work, look in the mirror to see where the problem lies.

If you have $2/hour skills and because of federal law are getting paid at least $7.25/hour, how is that not a decent wage. It may not be what the one working wants but they can hardly claim making 3 1/2 times more than what they offer in skills isn't decent.

When is the last time you heard one of these low skilled workers say what they'll do to warrant a wage increase?

The last time I saw one use minimum wage job as an apprenticeship to increase their skills, and the last time I saw a student helping to pay his way through school with one.

Of course, there are college graduates that simply never learned to apply themselves as well.

 

[CFM]

The last time I saw one use minimum wage job as an apprenticeship to increase their skills, and the last time I saw a student helping to pay his way through school with one.

Of course, there are college graduates that simply never learned to apply themselves as well.

I don't know of any minimum wage job where someone can use it to improve their skills. Most of those jobs involve doing things that people my age learned through daily living.

Is it that those college graduates never learned to apply themselves or that the field in which they choose to apply it is worthless? There are college graduates that are very good at what they do. The problem is that very few, if any, place a lot of value on what they have to offer.

 

[Into the Night]

I don't know of any minimum wage job where someone can use it to improve their skills.

I know of several:
A ranchhand learning how to handle animals (yes, that means shoveling shit as part of the job), and increasing his skills to successfully being a ranch owner himself.
A slot machine mechanic learning about his chosen field in electronics or computer programming in a trade school or college.
A fast food worker learning about the basics of customer service and holding a job (you know, showing up on time, being responsible, etc) while they are going to school earning a business degree.
An airport fuel lineman or even a baggage handler while they learn about being a pilot or aircraft mechanic.
An apprentice learning to wire or plumb a building (on the job training).
A man selling hot dogs from a cart while he learns how to sell things to people, perhaps eventually become a successful marketer of products, making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year or more.

You are making an argument of ignorance fallacy. These opportunities exist out there and are used this way, despite the fact that you can't see them for what they are.

Most of those jobs involve doing things that people my age learned through daily living.

Doesn't 'daily living' involve producing something at some time?

Is it that those college graduates never learned to apply themselves or that the field in which they choose to apply it is worthless?

It is both. There are worthless college courses and there are great college courses but the graduate never applies himself.

There are college graduates that are very good at what they do.

Indeed there are. There are also those that never attended any college at all that are very good at what they do, and make good money doing it.

The problem is that very few, if any, place a lot of value on what they have to offer.

I disagree. The problem is simply one of laziness. Anyone that applies himself to their own success, regardless of their education, WILL succeed. Those that do not, simply fail.

 

[Gonzomin]

Workers, who are the real wealth creators, should have a living wage. That is not only fair but is self-serving for the top 10 percent. If the min is at 15, the costs of food stamps will be cut way down. The costs of any people saving programs will be slashed.
It also kick starts the economy. Regular people with money spend it and create demand. Demand is what makes more companies hire and to expand.

 

[CFM]

I know of several:
A ranchhand learning how to handle animals (yes, that means shoveling shit as part of the job), and increasing his skills to successfully being a ranch owner himself.
A slot machine mechanic learning about his chosen field in electronics or computer programming in a trade school or college.
A fast food worker learning about the basics of customer service and holding a job (you know, showing up on time, being responsible, etc) while they are going to school earning a business degree.
An airport fuel lineman or even a baggage handler while they learn about being a pilot or aircraft mechanic.
An apprentice learning to wire or plumb a building (on the job training).
A man selling hot dogs from a cart while he learns how to sell things to people, perhaps eventually become a successful marketer of products, making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year or more.

You are making an argument of ignorance fallacy. These opportunities exist out there and are used this way, despite the fact that you can't see them for what they are.

Doesn't 'daily living' involve producing something at some time?

It is both. There are worthless college courses and there are great college courses but the graduate never applies himself.

Indeed there are. There are also those that never attended any college at all that are very good at what they do, and make good money doing it.

I disagree. The problem is simply one of laziness. Anyone that applies himself to their own success, regardless of their education, WILL succeed. Those that do not, simply fail.

There you go again thinking because you disagree it means you're correct.

 

[Into the Night]

So you don't think it's simply laziness? You don't think that someone that applies themselves towards their own successes can succeed?

 

[Gonzomin]

So you don't think it's simply laziness? You don't think that someone that applies themselves towards their own successes can succeed?

Oh yes.anyone who makes less than you, it is because of laziness. I suppose those making more than you are entitled to talk about your laziness.