"Hate Begets Hate" and Civil Politics

NiftyNiblick said:
But this has been the root of all of my posts since I came here.

People who disagree on the means to a common goal CAN INDEED DEBATE the means to get there.
That was ONCE the case between Democrats and Republicans. It hasn't been true for years now.

WE DO NOT HAVE COMMON GOALS.
Their idea of a GREAT AMERICA is our idea of HELL...and vice versa.

They're misogynists, theocrats, racists, xenophobes, homophobes, anti-intellectuals, and fascists. And what's nearly as bad, vulgarians.
An America in which they have influence and power is a SHITHOLE.

I'm an old man, now.
I couldn't personally make them all disappear even if I were young.
What I can do is talk and write about them, so that the people capable of recognizing logic will share my seething hatred for them and help take them down.

Your trying to attribute human status toward them will do nothing to help. It just makes you a Trumpanzee sympathizer.
That's treason. That's not your goal, perhaps, but at the very least,
it's an inadvertent consequence of your false equivalencies, PoliTalker.
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aptly put
 
Jack said:
The Russians and Chinese (and maybe others) have done a great job in pitting Americans against Americans. The Russians and Chinese can move forward on their Global Plans while Americans are in a Death Struggle with themselves.

Red Team/Blue Team! Who will accuse who? More Investigations! Traitors. Conspiracies?
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I think americans have a great deal of dificulty taking resonsibility for anything, we really didn't need much outside assistance in having a go at each other, we just don't want to face that. The fact of the matter is that we have all participated, and may well continue to. If we blame someone else we'll never achieve anything other than what we have, and that's pretty much the script we've been reading from.

The more one observes the american political system, the less useful it is to think of it in political terms. The two-headed one party system serves to provide citizens the illusion of choice while advancing the agendas of the plutocratic class which owns and operates both parties, yes, but even more importantly, it’s a mechanism of controlling the narrative and a manipulation of perceptual reality. If you can separate the masses into two groups based on extremely broad ideological characteristics, you can then funnel streamlined “us vs them” narratives into each of the two stables, with the white hats and black hats reversed in each case. Now you’ve got Republicans cheering for the president, Democrats cheering for the CIA and FBI, and now a sleeper cell of “adults” alleged to be operating on the inside of Trump’s own administration. Everyone’s cheering for one aspect of the US power establishment or another.

Who does this dynamic serve? Not you, me, us.

If one belonged to a ruling class, obviously your goal would be to ensure your subjects’ continued support for you. In a corporatist oligarchy, the shot callers are anonymous amorphous entities beyond the reach of electoral outcomes, the subjects don’t know they’re ruled, and power is held in place with manipulation and with money. As such a ruler your goal would be to find a way to manipulate the masses into supporting your agendas, and, since people are different, you’d need to use different narratives to manipulate them. You’d have to divide them, tell them different stories, turn them against each other, play them off one another, suck them in to the tales you are spinning with the theater of enmity and heroism.
 
I am constantly amused when the people who complain the most and feign outrage over political hatred and incivility are the propagators of same.
 
Fentoine Lum said:
I think americans have a great deal of dificulty taking resonsibility for anything, we really didn't need much outside assistance in having a go at each other, we just don't want to face that. The fact of the matter is that we have all participated, and may well continue to. If we blame someone else we'll never achieve anything other than what we have, and that's pretty much the script we've been reading from.

The more one observes the american political system, the less useful it is to think of it in political terms. The two-headed one party system serves to provide citizens the illusion of choice while advancing the agendas of the plutocratic class which owns and operates both parties, yes, but even more importantly, it’s a mechanism of controlling the narrative and a manipulation of perceptual reality. If you can separate the masses into two groups based on extremely broad ideological characteristics, you can then funnel streamlined “us vs them” narratives into each of the two stables, with the white hats and black hats reversed in each case. Now you’ve got Republicans cheering for the president, Democrats cheering for the CIA and FBI, and now a sleeper cell of “adults” alleged to be operating on the inside of Trump’s own administration. Everyone’s cheering for one aspect of the US power establishment or another.

Who does this dynamic serve? Not you, me, us.

If one belonged to a ruling class, obviously your goal would be to ensure your subjects’ continued support for you. In a corporatist oligarchy, the shot callers are anonymous amorphous entities beyond the reach of electoral outcomes, the subjects don’t know they’re ruled, and power is held in place with manipulation and with money. As such a ruler your goal would be to find a way to manipulate the masses into supporting your agendas, and, since people are different, you’d need to use different narratives to manipulate them. You’d have to divide them, tell them different stories, turn them against each other, play them off one another, suck them in to the tales you are spinning with the theater of enmity and heroism.
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did you support the Democratic party when they tried to get publically funded elections OVER and OVER again?
 
Jack said:
The Russians and Chinese Democratic Party of the Jackass (and maybe others) have done a great job in pitting Americans against Americans. The Russians and Chinese Democratic Party of the Jackass can move forward on their Global Plans while Americans are in a Death Struggle with themselves.

Red Team/Blue Team! Who will accuse who? More Investigations! Traitors. Conspiracies?
Click to expand...

Fixed this screed.
 
TTQ64 said:
Politalker agrees with them that's why he started this thread.

He tries to act like he's neutral......he thinks we're too stupid to see right through him.

No one wants to be nice to racist or civil.
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that is why we need to go after ANYONE who supports idiot ideas


I do
 
NiftyNiblick said:
Sounds like Pollyanna talk to me, Politalker.

If you can't recognize that people are not all the same and not all compatible, that's a perception issue.

If I acted civilly toward people like Banjofuck and Bullshit Blob and the present President of the United States,
I'd lose all respect for myself.

We tried that hippie flowers and love shit to save the country from vermin fifty years ago. I was there. Epic Fail.

Sometimes you just have to treat vermin like vermin.
And now the vermin infestation issue is much worse than it was then.
Trumpanzees represent a new low.
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:lolup:The new and angry leftist mob mentality. You go girl!! :rofl2:
 
Kacper said:
fashioning your seething hatred as logic; rallying against "fascists" while lamenting you cannot disappear the opposition; fashioning yourself an intellectual and not a vulgarian while using vulgarity and nonsense terminology like "Trumpanzee sympathizer"; labeling the other side as xenophobes while illustrating absolute opposition to those whose opinions you find foreign.

A virtual smörgåsbord of oxymoron that one. Well done :thumbsup:
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SPOT ON!

giphy.gif
 
We simply don't agree, PoliTalker.

I am a much more entrenched leftist than you are, and I've never believed that tolerance for the intolerant was a virtue.
 
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PoliTalker said:
Hello Controlled Opposition,



The charge of being sanctimonious is an easy one to make from the viewpoint that anti-social behavior is somehow acceptable. If that view is also coupled with the view that 'everyone does it' as justification, then when an individual is encountered who does not 'do it,' that is a nuisance to the belief that 'everyone does it.' It is only understandable that an effort would be made to dispense with that which causes self-doubt.
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You ban me from your threads cause I see through you BS..................tee hee hee.

Coward!
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello Nifty,



That's true and false. Both sides want America to be her best. But there is disagreement on what that is.



I think that is an exaggeration. Some people think of it that way, but that doesn't make it such. Americans of all political stripes have it good, despite which side is in power. That's part of the problem. We have it so good, that most are not sufficiently motivated to even vote. Believe me. If most people thought their lives were hell, and somebody offered them a pathway to correct that situation, they would be highly motivated to vote. Instead, Americans are placated. They work their jobs, collect their pay, spend it as they wish, go home to their cushy homes, eat plentiful food and beverages of their choosing, and watch cheap entertainment on TV. Their lives are full enough for them. Once in a while they go out and watch some fireworks and pretend to be patriotic, but mostly they are oblivious to the structure of their own government, can't even name their own representative, and in many sad cases, can't even name the three branches of government.

The people who post in this Forum are more of the rare somewhat politically informed crowd who actually is motivated to vote. Including a lot of anti-social types who post here because if they rant and rave like that in real life it quickly turns people off. This Forum is not representative of the nation.



And while others see those traits as negative, they either do not, or deny that's what they are. In many cases, they believe they are backed up by God.



Since that is a nebulous term, the statement is purely opinion.



Hatred is not a good motivation for anything. Hatred is irrational and immature.

If it is bad that the other side is motivated by hatred, why is it good that you are?



News flash. They are indeed humans.



It does nothing of the sort.



You realize you are essentially arguing with Martin Luther King.

The stance I have taken is his.

Do you believe Dr. Martin Luther King Jr was wrong in some way?

Should he have exaggerated how bad his opponents were? Should have have used foul language and perhaps violence?
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Leave Dr. King out of it.

You have no clue of what he stood for because if you did, you would not be supporting racist.

You're a fraud and a coward.
 
evince said:
that is why we need to go after ANYONE who supports idiot ideas


I do
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Me too. I can tell by the first few post what a poster supports.

I called out anatta/noise, cawacky, sailor and alouisuos off the bat. Now people are seeing who they really are.

They never had me fooled.
 
rjhenn said:
The problem with that viewpoint is that their idea of a better America is profoundly unAmerican, even anti-American. So their goal is totally different from that of real Americans. For one thing, their goals are rooted in hatred, and are profoundly anti-Christian.
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The problem with this viewpoint is it's an appeal to glittering generalities. The whole "they're anti-American, they're anti-Christian!" It's propaganda. They say the same exact thing about your side, almost word for word actually. This is the very nature of political discourse in this country. An appeal to symbolic nothings, rather than intelligent debate about the the actual issues we face.

You'd be surprised to find your cognitive bias about Trump supporters only describes a small, loud minority. Unfortunately, most of that crowd love to get on political forums like this one and dick with people. That has colored your perception of reality and made enemies out of a group that is largely made up of regular, everyday Americans.
 
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