Incels

[Dutch Uncle]

Yeah, you have to always watch your back. lol

Would being #3 out of 4 count as a middle child?

Yes; first, last or middle.

 

[Cypress]

In a way though it was more like I was the older child, period. There was a big gap in years between when our older brothers were born, and then we came along. I am three years older than my sister, who's the youngest. But a frequent refrain was "You're the older one, you should know better," "You should take care of your sister," "You should set an example for your sister," etc. Blech. lol

I had an overachieving older brother, and I could have let it affect my sense of self esteem if I didn't learn how to cope and just be comfortable with who I was.
. My younger sister was delicate and had chronic health problems, so a lot of the focus rightly went towards her

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

Yes; first, last or middle.

We sure drifted off topic here. lol

Were you #1?

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

I had an overachieving older brother, and I could have let it affect my sense of self esteem if I didn't learn how to cope and just be comfortable with who I was.
. My younger sister was delicate and had chronic health problems, so a lot of the focus rightly went towards her

You didn't feel resentment towards her getting more attention?

 

[Cypress]

I think Geeko was making the point that a lot of Incels use the quotes as a way to justify their hatred and fear of women, and seeing us as less than fully human like males are seen.

I leave interpretation of Torah up to Jewish scholars, and not Incels!

I actually don't see the need for Incels to invoke a 2,800 year old Jewish book. They have models like Andrew Tate and Donald Trumpf to justify their attitudes towards females

 

[Cypress]

You didn't feel resentment towards her getting more attention?

No! She had serious health issues and we were all concerned about her best welfare

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

I leave interpretation of Torah up to Jewish scholars, and not Incels!

I actually don't see the need for Incels to invoke a 2,800 year old Jewish book. They have models like Andrew Tate and Donald Trumpf to justify their attitudes towards females

But old stuff makes it even more valid, esp. if you claim to be a Christian.

As you know, the Nazis and other mass murderers did the same: Used the Bible to justify their crimes.

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

No! She had serious health issues and we were all concerned about her best welfare

She has a good family! You speak of her in past tense; she's passed on?

 

[Cypress]

But old stuff makes it even more valid, esp. if you claim to be a Christian.

As you know, the Nazis and other mass murderers did the same: Used the Bible to justify their crimes.

I don't remember Hitler using the bible to justify genocide. I doubt Hitler ever attended a day of church in his adult life, and he seemed to privately find the New Testament themes of pacifism and compassion to be repulsive.

You're right about hiding behind the bible to justify misogyny, racism, etc. That has been done since time immemorial.

In principle, I get annoyed when Holy Rollers or militant atheists cherry pick the bible for quotes, without having done the hard work of learning what the scholarship on the bible puts forth. Not saying that Geek is one of those militant atheists,

 

[Althea]

Every species, from humans, to tigers, to horses have variation in phenotypes.

I read somewhere that skin tone is determined by a few nucleotides out of the 3.2 billion nucleotides in the human genome.

You could probably put me in an auditorium of several dozen randomly selected Ethiopians, Australian aborigines, and Asians from south India and I might have a hard time determining which group has more melanin in their skin.

We, as in our ancestors, probably all started with black skin prior to moving into northern latitudes where dark skin could be lethal and natural selection favored phenotypes with less melanin.
.

Agree. Certain features are necessary for survival, and skin tone is a biggie.

But there are other physical attributes that vary widely between genotypes. Much as women's hips are much more flexible than men's (a necessity) so too are the hips of Asians of various nations. When I was training 5 days/week, no matter how much I stretched and tortured myself, I simply could not get my hips to do things that the Korean instructors could. Close, but not the same. It came naturally to every single student of Asian lineage, no matter the age.

There are distinct differences in facial appearance between Korean/Chinese/Japanese people. If we don't want to separate humans by 'race', then we can come up with another catchphrase that doesn't take a full sentence to describe.


The claim on the table is that Rachel Dolezal is black because she wants to be, and anyone who denies that is a racist.

I strongly disagree on both points.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

I think Geeko was making the point that a lot of Incels use the quotes as a way to justify their hatred and fear of women, and seeing us as less than fully human like males are seen.

Only idiots and/or the whacky (e.g. low self-esteem) judge others solely by the circumstances of their birth. The "all women", "all whites", "all blacks" type of thing.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

We sure drifted off topic here. lol

Were you #1?

How could you tell? LOL

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

BTW, before the GossipGrrlsGang starts screaming, I requested that Stone be removed from the thread -- but not his posts. I don't care about his personal attacks and neither does anyone else. But if you can't at least try to discuss the OP, rather than peeing all over other discussions and attacking the women here, it's off to the the emptiness of space with you.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Male Supremacy is written into their religion....

In the Western world, yes, but many human societies are patriarchal.

https://www.newscientist.com/articl...-sexism-how-men-came-to-rule-12000-years-ago/
The origins of sexism: How men came to rule 12,000 years ago
Human societies weren’t always male-dominated. The switch came when we became farmers – and that suggests ways to roll back towards a more equal system

For most of our history, we have been hunter-gatherers, and patrilocal residence is not the norm among modern hunter-gatherer societies. Instead, either partner may move to live with the “in-laws”, or a couple may relocate away from both their families. According to Hrdy, a degree of egalitarianism is built into these systems. If they reflect what prehistoric hunter-gatherers did, women in those early societies would have had the choice of support from the group they grew up with, or the option to move away from oppression.

According to one school of thought, things changed around 12,000 years ago. With the advent of agriculture and homesteading, people began settling down. They acquired resources to defend, and power shifted to the physically stronger males. Fathers, sons, uncles and grandfathers began living near each other, property was passed down the male line, and female autonomy was eroded. As a result, the argument goes, patriarchy emerged.

https://www.demogr.mpg.de/papers/working/wp-2016-014.pdf
The Patriarchy Index:
a new measure of gender and generational inequalities in the past

 

[Dutch Uncle]

BTW, before the GossipGrrlsGang starts screaming, I requested that Stone be removed from the thread -- but not his posts. I don't care about his personal attacks and neither does anyone else. But if you can't at least try to discuss the OP, rather than peeing all over other discussions and attacking the women here, it's off to the the emptiness of space with you.

When has Fatboy ever been able to stay on topic? He's a bloated narcissist. It always has to revolve around him. He's also a bully and, for idiots like him, it's easier to bully women than men.

OTOH, he counts it as a win when the women simply lose interest and leave. Yes, he's that stupid.

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

When has Fatboy ever been able to stay on topic? He's a bloated narcissist. It always has to revolve around him.

Yeah, same thing with his soul sisters, Minty and Toxic. Oh well. Good riddance. Figured this thread topic would trigger both overt Incels and those who desperately wish that they weren't but pretend otherwise. Bet you can figure out which are which. lol

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Yeah, same thing with his soul sisters, Minty and Toxic. Oh well. Good riddance. Figured this thread topic would trigger both overt Incels and those who desperately wish that they weren't but pretend otherwise. Bet you can figure out which are which. lol

It's my operating theory that people are their most basic selves when they are most uninhibited. An anonymous message board removes a level of social inhibitions. Observing them when they are drunk, drugged or very angry removes another level of inhibitions. It's also notable if they are drunk, drugged or very angry a lot. LOL

It they have socks, that's also when they are most likely to slip up.

It's a good reason why Friday and Saturday nights are among my most favorite nights for "hunting". It's not like many of the wackadoodles will go out dates.

 

[Cypress]

Agree. Certain features are necessary for survival, and skin tone is a biggie.

But there are other physical attributes that vary widely between genotypes. Much as women's hips are much more flexible than men's (a necessity) so too are the hips of Asians of various nations. When I was training 5 days/week, no matter how much I stretched and tortured myself, I simply could not get my hips to do things that the Korean instructors could. Close, but not the same. It came naturally to every single student of Asian lineage, no matter the age.

There are distinct differences in facial appearance between Korean/Chinese/Japanese people. If we don't want to separate humans by 'race', then we can come up with another catchphrase that doesn't take a full sentence to describe.


The claim on the table is that Rachel Dolezal is black because she wants to be, and anyone who denies that is a racist.

I strongly disagree on both points.

Yes, there's no denying there are phenotype variations if you look at Northern Europeans, Subsaharan Africans, , and Han Chinese.

Evolutionary biology dictates that geographic isolation can result in genetic mutations in a population.

My mind doesn't think of sickle cell being inherently a Black thing, or shortness being an indigenous Central American thing.

Sickle cell is a defensive response against malaria, as I recall. It has nothing to do with being black, it has to do with having ancestors who lived for millennia in the global malaria zone, and natural selection produced a phenotype in the blood which offered greater protection against malaria.

I think any human population who lived in the malaria zone for millennia would evolve a similar blood phenotype defense.

I'm not sure how height works out in the evolutionary scheme, but I always assumed diets low in protein statistically resulted in shorter populations.

 

[NiftyNiblick]

A doctor can easily access that, but you are skipping the fundamental question: even if they admit doing it, you claim they are not responsible for their actions? Either let them go or execute them on the spot. Why have an in-between?

The uber-idiot Dubya Bush admitted that Texans have a problem with nuance, and although you're a transplant, nobody illustrates that more than you, Oom.

You clearly don't see the huge difference between execution and euthanasia, whereas the very dumbest person in all of Massachusetts could explain it to you in a few words.

I'm not the dumbest person in Massachusetts, I don't think, but I'll try.

ANESTHESIA PRIOR TO THE LETHAL INJECTION. It's what we do when we have to put down our beloved pets. It's not punishment.

Now that this is cleared up, you apparently wish to go straight to here without examining if rehabilitation might work first.
OK, that's not a misunderstanding. That's just an opinion to which you're entitled.

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

I don't remember Hitler using the bible to justify genocide. I doubt Hitler ever attended a day of church in his adult life, and he seemed to privately find the New Testament themes of pacifism and compassion to be repulsive.

You're right about hiding behind the bible to justify misogyny, racism, etc. That has been done since time immemorial.

In principle, I get annoyed when Holy Rollers or militant atheists cherry pick the bible for quotes, without having done the hard work of learning what the scholarship on the bible puts forth. Not saying that Geek is one of those militant atheists,

My point is that the Christian Bible as we know it today has been through countless translations and revisions. The passages that Geeko posted in his comment still stand and are part of it. As you said, different groups cherry-pick passages to justify whatever it is that they are advocating. To this day, the Roman Catholic Church uses those NT passages to justify keeping the priesthood and hierarchy all male. Women can sing or read in church but are not allowed to lead it. The same is true of many evangelical American churches, esp. the fundie ones. Why leave these passages in their holy book? Simple: It allows men first class status, and women as submissive second class persons.