Islamic timetable
- Thread starter Gaffer
- Start date
I'm calling bullshit on your "career" as a counter-terrorism intelligence officer.
Battleborne
Terminator
Whatever....
cupcake#2! USCS Dept of Treasury 1975-1986 GS 11 step 3 even did the Los Angeles Olympics...
cupcake#2! USCS Dept of Treasury 1975-1986 GS 11 step 3 even did the Los Angeles Olympics...
Battleborne
Terminator
Hey Damo...
Where did you recruit these people from...New Orleans...lol
Where did you recruit these people from...New Orleans...lol
I'm kind of hoping he was. I figure, if this guy was a counter-terrorism intelligence officer, and, we are all still alive this is very nearly irrefutable proof that God, or some creator, actually does exist.
And that would be good news, you know, in general.
AnyOldIron
Atheist Missionary
1920 was the end of the Ottoman Empire...and yes the Egyptians took the helm...
Took the helm of what?
but you missed the point that the Ottoman Empire brought Islam to Egypt and are you forgetting History...
No, I'm not. The Fatimids brought Islam to Egypt in 639AD. Egypt wasn't captured by the Saljuks until 1517.
You aren't forgetting history, you just don't seem to know it.
The burning of the Libraries of Alexandria.
There are four possible occasions when the library building was destroyed that are sited by historians, Caesar's conquest in 48BC, Aurelian's attack in the C3rd, Theophilus attack in 391AD or after the Muslim conquest in 642AD.
However it was the Muslim invasion that preserved the collection itself, incorporating it into the Library of Al-Azhar, through which we still have the library today.
was the first recorded Jihad to eliminate all other religious beliefs...
No it wasn't. The first Muslim holy war was the capture of Mecca from the pagan tribes that occupied it.
Where did you learn your history from? The back of cereal boxes?
Took the helm of what?
but you missed the point that the Ottoman Empire brought Islam to Egypt and are you forgetting History...
No, I'm not. The Fatimids brought Islam to Egypt in 639AD. Egypt wasn't captured by the Saljuks until 1517.
You aren't forgetting history, you just don't seem to know it.
The burning of the Libraries of Alexandria.
There are four possible occasions when the library building was destroyed that are sited by historians, Caesar's conquest in 48BC, Aurelian's attack in the C3rd, Theophilus attack in 391AD or after the Muslim conquest in 642AD.
However it was the Muslim invasion that preserved the collection itself, incorporating it into the Library of Al-Azhar, through which we still have the library today.
was the first recorded Jihad to eliminate all other religious beliefs...
No it wasn't. The first Muslim holy war was the capture of Mecca from the pagan tribes that occupied it.
Where did you learn your history from? The back of cereal boxes?
AnyOldIron
Atheist Missionary
While Egypt was introduced to Islam in the 10th century, BB is partially right as Selim I assumed the caliphate just after the defeat of the Malmuks in Syria and Egypt during the expansion of the Ottoman empire and as Al Qaeda wishes to reestablish the Caliphate it would be a reemergence of a sort of the Ottoman empire.
No, he claimed the Saljuks brought Islam to Egypt. And you know that the Ottoman empire was secular and modern looking from the reforms starting in 1699, as the empire looked more towards emulating the empires to the west of it.
The Ottoman empire prior to that merely took the title Caliph from Umayyads and Abbasids as an honourary title for the lineage of their leaders. The title Caliph came about very shortly after the death of Mohammed, so to claim that AQ are descendents from an Ottoman empire because of the title Caliphate is disingenuious. All Muslim states descend from the notion of the Caliphate.
AQ can't be seen as a re-emergence of the Ottoman empire, largely because for many centuries, the Ottoman were moving away from theocratic Islam and towards a western style empire.
You might as well call them a re-emergence of the Fatimids......
No, he claimed the Saljuks brought Islam to Egypt. And you know that the Ottoman empire was secular and modern looking from the reforms starting in 1699, as the empire looked more towards emulating the empires to the west of it.
The Ottoman empire prior to that merely took the title Caliph from Umayyads and Abbasids as an honourary title for the lineage of their leaders. The title Caliph came about very shortly after the death of Mohammed, so to claim that AQ are descendents from an Ottoman empire because of the title Caliphate is disingenuious. All Muslim states descend from the notion of the Caliphate.
AQ can't be seen as a re-emergence of the Ottoman empire, largely because for many centuries, the Ottoman were moving away from theocratic Islam and towards a western style empire.
You might as well call them a re-emergence of the Fatimids......
AnyOldIron
Atheist Missionary
As it was the leader of the Ottoman Empire was the Caliphate, the goal is a reemergence of the Caliphate. That it happened to be the leader of the Ottoman Empire is really a sideline.
Major logical FALLACY here Damo.
Its like saying 'Because all crows are black, all black things are crows.'
The Ottoman empire nominally operated under the Caliph, but were largely westernised from the 1600's on. Most of the Muslim empires, from the Umayyads, Abbasids to the Fatimids, operated under a Caliph.
Would that make AQ a re-emergence of the Fatimids? Or Umayyads?
No, Modern Islamic Jihad is a modern invention, created in the 1970's out of the teachings of the Muslim Brotherhood (an Egyptian political group) and through the teachings of Sayed Qutb.
Major logical FALLACY here Damo.
Its like saying 'Because all crows are black, all black things are crows.'
The Ottoman empire nominally operated under the Caliph, but were largely westernised from the 1600's on. Most of the Muslim empires, from the Umayyads, Abbasids to the Fatimids, operated under a Caliph.
Would that make AQ a re-emergence of the Fatimids? Or Umayyads?
No, Modern Islamic Jihad is a modern invention, created in the 1970's out of the teachings of the Muslim Brotherhood (an Egyptian political group) and through the teachings of Sayed Qutb.
AnyOldIron
Atheist Missionary
Damo to the rescue eh'...how profound ole' wise one...for the record damo understands history and intelligence analysis as he was one also...in the biz...sorta speak! So in your little world along with your oh so educated friends in here I and damo are posers....lol
Seriously, you shouldn't put yourself on a level with Damo. Damo is an intelligent poster with knowledge to back it up. He is sometimes wrong, as in this case, but he still has intelligence and makes a good case.
You are a no-mark, who claims to be 'in intelligence' but shows absolutely no intelligence and a woeful lack of understanding of world history or politics.
If you were in intelligence, it is not that much of a shock to see the state of US foreign policy, but I doubt that even they would take such a cretin....
Seriously, you shouldn't put yourself on a level with Damo. Damo is an intelligent poster with knowledge to back it up. He is sometimes wrong, as in this case, but he still has intelligence and makes a good case.
You are a no-mark, who claims to be 'in intelligence' but shows absolutely no intelligence and a woeful lack of understanding of world history or politics.
If you were in intelligence, it is not that much of a shock to see the state of US foreign policy, but I doubt that even they would take such a cretin....
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AnyOldIron
Atheist Missionary
addendum : The Caliphates were established and ran from 661-1258...The continuation of the Caliphates being the 'Ottoman Empire' established during this period(1258)...The Ottoman Empire lasted until 1920 then went underground and reemerged as the Al Qaeda we see today! So my referring to the Ottoman Empire burning the Alexandria Libraries was correct as they were then called Caliphates and are now called al Qaeda...!end of story!
History for Dummies: 101...
The term Caliph translates roughly as 'Leader of the Muslims' and is the equivilent of the Celtic 'High King' or Latinised 'Emperor'.
There have been many Muslim empires, from the Umayyads, Abbasids, Fatimids to the Ottoman.
There have been many Christian empires, from the Roman, to the Byzantine to the German Holy Roman to the Spanish and British.
To claim that the Ottoman is even a re-emergence of older Muslim empires such as the Fatimids is as disingenuious as stating that the British empire was a re-emergence of the Roman empire.
To claim that AQ are a re-emergence of the Ottoman empire is as disingenuious as claiming that those that plan the American empire (ie PNAC) are a continuation of the British empire.
What you are struggling with is the fact that each of the empires were Muslim. From this, you are attempting to deduce that all Muslim empires were the same, simply re-emergences of each other.
As for the library, as mentioned above, the date of the destruction of the library is unknown, and could be any time from the invasion of Julius Caesar in circa 50BC. What is known is the fact that the Muslim invaders preserved the library intact, which explains why much of it exists today.
Again, you are a moron...
History for Dummies: 101...
The term Caliph translates roughly as 'Leader of the Muslims' and is the equivilent of the Celtic 'High King' or Latinised 'Emperor'.
There have been many Muslim empires, from the Umayyads, Abbasids, Fatimids to the Ottoman.
There have been many Christian empires, from the Roman, to the Byzantine to the German Holy Roman to the Spanish and British.
To claim that the Ottoman is even a re-emergence of older Muslim empires such as the Fatimids is as disingenuious as stating that the British empire was a re-emergence of the Roman empire.
To claim that AQ are a re-emergence of the Ottoman empire is as disingenuious as claiming that those that plan the American empire (ie PNAC) are a continuation of the British empire.
What you are struggling with is the fact that each of the empires were Muslim. From this, you are attempting to deduce that all Muslim empires were the same, simply re-emergences of each other.
As for the library, as mentioned above, the date of the destruction of the library is unknown, and could be any time from the invasion of Julius Caesar in circa 50BC. What is known is the fact that the Muslim invaders preserved the library intact, which explains why much of it exists today.
Again, you are a moron...
AnyOldIron
Atheist Missionary
USCS Dept of Treasury 1975-1986 GS 11 step 3 even did the Los Angeles Olympics...
Then they must have extremely low entry standards.
Maybe we should get toby a job with US intelligence....
Then they must have extremely low entry standards.
Maybe we should get toby a job with US intelligence....
T
TRGLDTE
Guest
Prakoshpyder
Gaffer
Sanctimonious Prick
I put out a post that explains the time table of alqueda and there's no discussion of it. Just attacks on BB for pointing out it was from the former ottoman empire. I post things to get discussion so that someone can add something that maybe I'm not familiar with. Instead there's nothing but name calling.
Battleborne
Terminator
Whatever....
cupcake#3...I made my analysis...and you made yours...now answer my question earlier...were you or are you a Brittish military officer? Just curious because you lack the required manners...more like a socialist professor! on the 'Bully Pulpit'...
cupcake#3...I made my analysis...and you made yours...now answer my question earlier...were you or are you a Brittish military officer? Just curious because you lack the required manners...more like a socialist professor! on the 'Bully Pulpit'...
uscitizen
Villified User
ROTFLMAOcupcake#3...I made my analysis...and you made yours...now answer my question earlier...were you or are you a Brittish military officer? Just curious because you lack the required manners...more like a socialist professor! on the 'Bully Pulpit'...
And I suppose you exhibit the proper manners of a US govt agent / Ex military person and such ?
Gaffer
Sanctimonious Prick
Each empire throughout history has been uniquely different. Alqueda is attempting to build an empire. They are using the same methods used in the past by other muslim empires. In each case the goal of an empire is world domination.
America is not a empirical society, much as the socialist like to call it that. But America has fallen into the role of the mightiest nation in the world which is again unique. Though not out to conquor and rule the world we are finding necessary to flex our muscle and make changes in the world.
Democratizing the middle east is one of those changes. There is one problem with that. Any country that has islam as its state religion will not be democratized.
America is not a empirical society, much as the socialist like to call it that. But America has fallen into the role of the mightiest nation in the world which is again unique. Though not out to conquor and rule the world we are finding necessary to flex our muscle and make changes in the world.
Democratizing the middle east is one of those changes. There is one problem with that. Any country that has islam as its state religion will not be democratized.
Battleborne
Terminator
Nope....
I am retired...so I can let out lotsa pent up anger...no need to be polite to the elite crowd anymore...I can just call em' like I see em'...kinda/sorta fun!
ROTFLMAO
And I suppose you exhibit the proper manners of a US govt agent / Ex military person and such ?
I am retired...so I can let out lotsa pent up anger...no need to be polite to the elite crowd anymore...I can just call em' like I see em'...kinda/sorta fun!