Peaceful pardoned political prisoner in the news

Damocles said:
It's not an excuse it is an observation, a constant. As I said, a Law of Political Nature, an Axiom. A simple truth.

Listen to them. If they say Trump is planning on doing this and he hasn't said he was (as you said Trump tells you what he's going to do), it is because they plan on doing it. I believe that next time the left has the White House this is something they will try to do, because when I see them say things like this with no evidence or even a hint that Trump is actually thinking of such a thing, it is because it is central to their minds.

In any moment, listen to what they "predict" and you will know what they plan.
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Are you agreeing that both parties are better at representing themselves than the nation? That both parties are engaged in the division and destruction of our Republic, Damo?

Results count. Trump says a lot of shit. He pardoned the 1/6 traitors in a day. Where are the Pedo files? The JFK files? Why the distraction with the Fort Knox conspiracy theory when all he has to do is send a flunky to go count the gold bars?

Whenever Trump says something outlandish or kooky, his defenders say he is joking. I think the man is so demented that he's speaking his mind and, if he can do it, he will do it. So far he's moving in the direction of being a "strong man" of the United States, claiming he's above the law and doing whatever he pleases.
 
Damocles said:
You don't think any of the Vietnam Draft Dodgers that were pardoned by Jiminy Cricket ever committed a crime? Methinks you doth protest too much.

I agree that a blanket pardon was a "bit much" (exaggeration) and he should have taken the time to separate out the violent criminals... Believe me. Folks who assault cops, even if it is on January 6th, deserve to serve their full prison terms. I'm not supporting that action. However, pretending that nobody ever who was pardoned by a Dem ever committed a crime is just not supported by reality. Blanket pardons are problematic. So are preemptively pardoning family and friends...
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No one is pretending anything. We are talking about a convicted, violent criminal who was pardoned and freed by a convicted criminal POTUS. We are not going back 50 years to play whataboutism, esp. since there's no evidence that any of the pardoned draft dodgers later assaulted or otherwise harmed others. I agree, the violent convicts of J6 should serve their full sentences. The incident under discussion sounds fairly petty on its face although he did violently cause property damage. I doubt if anything will come of it, unfortunately. Eventually he'll really fuck someone up; wait for it.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
Are you agreeing that both parties are better at representing themselves than the nation? That both parties are engaged in the division and destruction of our Republic, Damo?

Results count. Trump says a lot of shit. He pardoned the 1/6 traitors in a day. Where are the Pedo files? The JFK files? Why the distraction with the Fort Knox conspiracy theory when all he has to do is send a flunky to go count the gold bars?

Whenever Trump says something outlandish or kooky, his defenders say he is joking. I think the man is so demented that he's speaking his mind and, if he can do it, he will do it. So far he's moving in the direction of being a "strong man" of the United States, claiming he's above the law and doing whatever he pleases.
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My question to you is: Why were you not so insistent that they be released instantly when your braindead hero was telling you "no"... This guy says "yes" and you want instant gratification that you are willing to pretend that it's his fault somehow that they weren't released for the previous 5 decades?

More than 50 years Presidents have been burying this and just now when one has begun the process to release the documents you suddenly want it "NOW" and act like he somehow deleted the information that was readily available before from your brain and you want it back.
 
Damocles said:
marches promoting and supporting Muslim terrorists and terrorizing Jewish US Citizens happened very recently on college campuses during Biden's term
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There seems to be a lot of violence on both sides, though the actual college campus protests are peaceful. The ultimate "both sides" incident is Mordechai Brafman trying to murder Palestinians in Florida. He saw two Middle Eastern men in a car speaking a foreign language, and decided they must be Palestinian. He then tried to murder them by shooting them. They turned out to be Israelis.

We need to bring down the violence. Protest for whatever side you want, but don't commit terrorism.

 
ThatOwlWoman said:
No one is pretending anything. We are talking about a convicted, violent criminal who was pardoned and freed by a convicted criminal POTUS. We are not going back 50 years to play whataboutism, esp. since there's no evidence that any of the pardoned draft dodgers later assaulted or otherwise harmed others. I agree, the violent convicts of J6 should serve their full sentences. The incident under discussion sounds fairly petty on its face although he did violently cause property damage. I doubt if anything will come of it, unfortunately. Eventually he'll really fuck someone up; wait for it.
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Please. You asked "name one time" and when I do you call it "whataboutism"... I provided information that you asked for.

Anyway, I agreed with you that violent criminals shouldn't get a pardon and told you I think blanket pardons and preemptive pardons are problematic. At this point you are arguing just to argue, I suspect you just want to believe I didn't say what I said. When someone agrees with you, if you act like it you get better results, and you get even better results if you don't move the goalposts and pretend that history is unimportant.

Blanket pardons are problematic because you are bound to pardon someone that did not deserve it.
 
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Walt said:
There seems to be a lot of violence on both sides, though the actual college campus protests are peaceful. The ultimate "both sides" incident is Mordechai Brafman trying to murder Palestinians in Florida. He saw two Middle Eastern men in a car speaking a foreign language, and decided they must be Palestinian. He then tried to murder them by shooting them. They turned out to be Israelis.

We need to bring down the violence. Protest for whatever side you want, but don't commit terrorism.

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They were only "peaceful" if you ignored the Jewish students who were chased and attacked by the protesters. So much so they were told they should stay home and attend by computer as the colleges were unwilling to provide consequences to those that attacked them and therefore didn't even attempt to provide safety for them.

You know, told to stay in their "Jewish neighborhood" and not to show in public... Blaming the victims and forcing them to stay in special "neighborhoods"...
 
Walt said:
A lot of the stories that the alt right media has claimed have been rescinded. They never happened.
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Nonsense. You just want to pretend that these things did not happen. College Presidents were fired over their inaction and unwillingness to protect their Jewish students. You don't get to rewrite history in lefstream craziness.
 
Damocles said:
My question to you is: Why were you not so insistent that they be released instantly when your braindead hero was telling you "no"... This guy says "yes" and you want instant gratification that you are willing to pretend that it's his fault somehow that they weren't released for the previous 5 decades?

More than 50 years Presidents have been burying this and just now when one has begun the process to release the documents you suddenly want it "NOW" and act like he somehow deleted the information that was readily available before from your brain and you want it back.
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Why are you dodging my questions and making accusations that Biden is my hero? Again, I never voted for him, I suspect that you are upset because I'm both in the middle politically and do not worship your Orange Jesus. You are on record repeatedly supporting Trump whereas I'm on record mostly attacking Trump and considering Biden to be the 21st century equivalent of Jimmy Carter; a nice man but weak in a hostile era.

I expect results. Trump promised to reduce inflation and grocery prices, something he has not even attempted to do. Trump made a big show of solving conspiracy theories. He ordered the release of the records but so far, nada. OTOH, he's moved quickly to suck up to Putin and threatened to take over Panama, Greenland, renamed the Gulf of Mexico and other stupid shit. Your hero. Biden is not my hero. He's demented and should never have broken his promise to be a one-term president.

Process? What the fuck is the problem? Just have one of Musk's computer geeks scan and release them. What the fuck is so hard about that? Are the records declassified or not? Musk's geeks released the names of undercover CIA agents in an unsecure email. Why are the JFK records so much more difficult?
 
Damocles said:
Please. You asked "name one time" and when I do you call it "whataboutism"... I provided information that you asked for.
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Nah. You just said that Carter pardoned draft dodgers, some of whom *might* have committed crimes afterwards, but offered only speculation and no evidence.

Damocles said:
Anyway, I agreed with you that violent criminals shouldn't get a pardon and told you I think blanket pardons and preemptive pardons are problematic. At this point you are arguing just to argue, I suspect you just want to believe I didn't say what I said. When someone agrees with you, if you act like it you get better results, and you get even better results if you don't move the goalposts and pretend that history is unimportant.

Blanket pardons are problematic because you are bound to pardon someone that did not deserve it.
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ThatOwlWoman said:
Nah. You just said that Carter pardoned draft dodgers, some of whom *might* have committed crimes afterwards, but offered only speculation and no evidence.
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Absolute rubbish... Pretending that none of them did is absurd. Shoot, some draft dodgers participating in resistance protests even injured police officers, you know those same cops that some of the Jan 6ers injured.

You asked for information, then when it is presented you simply try to whitewash history and pretend you didn't ask for it or that it "isn't good enough" for you.

The reality, both of the mainstream political parties have blanket pardoned folks, and when they did some folks among the blanket pardons were violent offenders who didn't deserve them.

Everyone likes to believe they are part of the "elite" and are in some way "better" than the unwashed in "that other group" but in reality all of us are Americans who have been failed by these folks we vote to represent us.

TLDR version:

- blanket pardons are bad.
- both side have done them.
- bad guys get pardons when they are used regardless of which side uses them.
 
Damocles said:
Absolute rubbish... Pretending that none of them did is absurd. Shoot, some draft dodgers participating in resistance protests even injured police officers, you know those same cops that some of the Jan 6ers injured.

You asked for information, then when it is presented you simply try to whitewash history and pretend you didn't ask for it or that it "isn't good enough" for you.

The reality, both of the mainstream political parties have blanket pardoned folks, and when they did some folks among the blanket pardons were violent offenders who didn't deserve them.

Everyone likes to believe they are part of the "elite" and are in some way "better" than the unwashed in "that other group" but in reality all of us are Americans who have been failed by these folks we vote to represent us.

TLDR version:

- blanket pardons are bad.
- both side have done them.
- bad guys get pardons when they are used regardless of which side uses them.
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Carters blanket pardon did not include violent offenders or deserters.

 
Phantasmal said:
Half of those pardoned never returned to the USA and Canada was delighted to have the young men. All of prime age!
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Canada has as much land as the Continental US but with a population less than California. While their immigration policy has long been very open, they "paused" it last year in order to let the infrastructure catch up.

The US immigration policy is to build a wall. LOL

www.canada.ca

Government of Canada reduces immigration

Today, the Honourable Marc Miller, Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship, announced the 2025–2027 Immigration Levels Plan: a plan that will pause population growth in the short term to achieve well-managed, sustainable growth in the long term. For the first time ever, the levels plan...
www.canada.ca www.canada.ca
2025–2027 Immigration Levels Plan: a plan that will pause population growth in the short term to achieve well-managed, sustainable growth in the long term. For the first time ever, the levels plan includes controlled targets for temporary residents, specifically international students and foreign workers, as well as for permanent residents.

Immigration is essential to our country’s economic success and growth. As Canada reopened following the pandemic, the needs of businesses were greater than the supply of workers available to support their recovery. We took decisive measures to attract some of the world’s best and brightest to study and work in Canada, and to integrate them into the economy quickly. This meant a faster economic recovery. It also meant that robust immigration helped prevent a recession, while contributing to Canada’s workforce.

In response to the evolving needs of our country, this transitional levels plan alleviates pressures on housing, infrastructure and social services so that over the long term we can grow our economic and social prosperity through immigration. This unprecedented plan offers a comprehensive approach to welcoming newcomers—one that preserves the integrity of our immigration programs and sets newcomers up for success. Canadians also expect a well-managed immigration system from the Government of Canada.
 
Damocles said:
However, pretending that all of those folks never committed crimes is pretense, and pretending that somehow folks that were among violent resistance protests were not among the pardoned but not arrested or convicted is clearly an obtuse assumption.
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Damocles said:
However, pretending that all of those folks never committed crimes is pretense, and pretending that somehow folks that were among violent resistance protests were not among the pardoned but not arrested or convicted is clearly an obtuse assumption.
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I don’t think anyone’s pretending that. I see you claiming it, but I reread the thread and no one claimed pardoned draft dodgers didn’t commit crimes once they were released.
 
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