Reality check on electric cars

[QP!]

Wow, you seem to be very angry. In fact, I've found a VERY strong correlation between liberals and anger, especially whenever questioned about anything. I wonder why that is...

You don't have to wonder. I will tell you.

Because Marjorie Greene and other Magats have made the stupidest amongst us, like you and Terry, feel the need to speak out as if an expert, on topics you KNOW NOTHING about.

You think simply having an opinion, no matter how ignorant it is, is enough and you should speak, instead of listen and learn.

You DID NOT know EV's can fast charge in 20 minutes now. You DID NOT know, EV's can be provided charging in the parking spot and not need to line up at a fueling station. And on and on and on.

And yet like Marjorie Greene you make uneducated guesses almost always being 100% wrong on everything. Why? Because you are stupid, thus your guesses end up stupid.


Hope clearing that up for you helps.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

There you go again. yes you can make up a scenario. I can do the same thing
. However, I have an EV and have driven them for years. In the real world, I have no problems. I have never used a charger outside my garage. Never, not once, and never ran out of charge.
And yeah, hotels and motels give free charges. The cost of a room with a charger used is the same as one without.

And, that's fine. Buy one and own it if you want to. Don't make me buy one, and don't expect the government to subsidize or mandate charging stations on my tax dollar like they are. That's my problem with them--The government is trying to force me to buy one and mandating public charging stations, and heavily subsidizing the whole clusterfuck of a mess on the weak premise that somehow they're saving the planet.

 

[gfm7175]

You don't have to wonder. I will tell you.

This'll be good.

Because Marjorie Greene and other Magats have made the stupidest amongst us, like you and Terry, feel the need to speak out as if an expert, on topics you KNOW NOTHING about.

Your issue is that you confuse fantasy with actuality.

You think simply having an opinion, no matter how ignorant it is, is enough and you should speak, instead of listen and learn.

Your issue, not mine.

You DID NOT know EV's can fast charge in 20 minutes now.

Fantasy. A partial charge is not a full charge.

You DID NOT know, EV's can be provided charging in the parking spot and not need to line up at a fueling station.

I don't recall anyone denying that charging stations can be installed in some parking spots. A couple of parking spots very occasionally is not half of a parking lot's parking spots everywhere. IOW, what you're talking about barely exists atm, and you're fantasizing that it's already widespread.

And on and on and on.

Meaningless drivel.

And yet like Marjorie Greene you make uneducated guesses almost always being 100% wrong on everything. Why? Because you are stupid, thus your guesses end up stupid.

Your issue, not mine.

Hope clearing that up for you helps.

You didn't clear anything up. You simply fantasized about things that don't exist in actuality and you blamed me for your own issues.

 

[QP!]

...

I don't recall anyone denying that charging stations can be installed in some parking spots. A couple of parking spots very occasionally is not half of a parking lot's parking spots everywhere. IOW, what you're talking about barely exists atm, and you're fantasizing that it's already widespread.
...

What you did, in your stupidity and ignorance, was laugh at the idea that every parking can be given a charger because, in your stupidity, you assumed it would take up to much space and cost.

You are wrong on both.

Again i spent years working in cold weather big cities, back when most cars used heating blocks if their car was going to be sitting hours on end.

EVERY SPOT had these plug in, so cars could plug in their block heaters.

The above is ENOUGH now, to provide power to EV's for a work place or mall, if they only cared about getting them a charge, but the current EV charging stations do a lot more, as Smart Stations with computers in them that are gathering data. That is why they are bigger., but shrinking each year while getting more efficient. But if a mall or work place only cares to get someone a charge they can use those simple plug ins, like the picture above.

And for everywhere else the For PRofit charging market would be thrilled to get the contract to provide Smart charging stations to every spot, to match the EV need and then get paid for use. That is their entire model and reason for being. They want to match all need with a charger and will gladly provide them on a 'Pay Per Use' model.


So you need to be less stupid and stop speaking on a topic you clearly do not understand.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

What you did, in your stupidity and ignorance, was laugh at the idea that every parking can be given a charger because, in your stupidity, you assumed it would take up to much space and cost.

You are wrong on both.

Again i spent years working in cold weather big cities, back when most cars used heating blocks if their car was going to be sitting hours on end.

EVERY SPOT had these plug in, so cars could plug in their block heaters.

The above is ENOUGH now, to provide power to EV's for a work place or mall, if they only cared about getting them a charge, but the current EV charging stations do a lot more, as Smart Stations with computers in them that are gathering data. That is why they are bigger., but shrinking each year while getting more efficient. But if a mall or work place only cares to get someone a charge they can use those simple plug ins, like the picture above.

And for everywhere else the For PRofit charging market would be thrilled to get the contract to provide Smart charging stations to every spot, to match the EV need and then get paid for use. That is their entire model and reason for being. They want to match all need with a charger and will gladly provide them on a 'Pay Per Use' model.


So you need to be less stupid and stop speaking on a topic you clearly do not understand.

No, they're not. A block heater takes 1 to 3 amps to run. A Level 1 charger pulls 12 to 15. That means it's pretty likely that the circuit will be overloaded if it is used for EV charging as is and cause breakers to trip.

 

[Nordberg]

And, that's fine. Buy one and own it if you want to. Don't make me buy one, and don't expect the government to subsidize or mandate charging stations on my tax dollar like they are. That's my problem with them--The government is trying to force me to buy one and mandating public charging stations, and heavily subsidizing the whole clusterfuck of a mess on the weak premise that somehow they're saving the planet.

Charging stations are mostly for profit companies. The battery manufacturing plants are also making charging stations for profit. When you charge at one, you use your credit card to pay for it. If you are paying, please give us your credit card numbers.
The government is trying to respond to the environmental disasters that ICE has contributed to. You can thank us all for keeping your family healthier.

 

[QP!]

No, they're not. A block heater takes 1 to 3 amps to run. A Level 1 charger pulls 12 to 15. That means it's pretty likely that the circuit will be overloaded if it is used for EV charging as is and cause breakers to trip.

Yes they can.

If the mall or employer does not care about the data and only cares to give the electricity then that type of strip down plug in, providing 12-15 amps can be easily set up and provided.

The reason the current ones are so big, as they are full computers also dong tons of data collection and communicating with the companies that provide them that stream of data. And those one get smaller and more efficient, including using solar, each and every day.


But there would be NOTHING to stop an employer or mall providing the strip down 'charge only' service if they wanted. They just do not need to as the for Profit market is thrilled to provide the full service 'Pay to Play' units.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

Charging stations are mostly for profit companies. The battery manufacturing plants are also making charging stations for profit. When you charge at one, you use your credit card to pay for it. If you are paying, please give us your credit card numbers.
The government is trying to respond to the environmental disasters that ICE has contributed to. You can thank us all for keeping your family healthier.

Investors Are Bailing On EV Charging Companies Because They Might Not Make Any Money
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/new...use-they-might-not-make-any-money/ar-AA1m6WES

Can public EV fast-charging stations be profitable in the United States?
https://www.mckinsey.com/features/m...g-stations-be-profitable-in-the-united-states
(the answer is almost certainly no...)

‘Nearly all’ high voltage EV charging stations lose money: Report
https://www.utilitydive.com/news/ne...v-charging-stations-lose-money-report/561026/

 

[Nordberg]

Investors Are Bailing On EV Charging Companies Because They Might Not Make Any Money
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/new...use-they-might-not-make-any-money/ar-AA1m6WES

Can public EV fast-charging stations be profitable in the United States?
https://www.mckinsey.com/features/m...g-stations-be-profitable-in-the-united-states
(the answer is almost certainly no...)

‘Nearly all’ high voltage EV charging stations lose money: Report
https://www.utilitydive.com/news/ne...v-charging-stations-lose-money-report/561026/

Yep profits between 25 to 50 percent. https://evchargingsummit.com/blog/w...EV charging station business,margin of 25-50%.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

Yep profits between 25 to 50 percent. https://evchargingsummit.com/blog/w...EV charging station business,margin of 25-50%.

So, your response to my links to the actual market returns to date is to offer up a sales pitch. Buying into EV charging stations is like buying a time share condo...

 

[Scott]

I'm guessing you live in a city, perhaps on the East Coast?

In any case, there's plenty of evidence that EVs are not nearly as green as some people think, and there are other drawbacks as well, such as price:
Electric Cars Aren't As Eco-Friendly As You Think. Here's Why. | makeuseof.com

There are other technologies that appear to be better in every way from regular gas powered cars, however. Their inventors tend to die under suspicious circumstances though. The story of Stanley Meyer is informative:
The Mysterious Death of Stanley Meyer and His Water-Powered Car | gaia.com

The article above also contains a story of a man who managed to use regular gas super efficiently. After selling his technology for a lot of money to some company that then sat on it, he was shot at and after surviving that, he also died suspiciously.

There is no comparison between EV and gas powered as far as the environment. You actually think a car belching out exhaust 100% of the time it is being used is about the same as an electric car belching out none?

First of all, it's not just about what whether the EV polutes once it's on the road. It's also about what it takes to produce them. The first article I linked to explains:
**
While electric cars don't directly emit greenhouse gases when in use, their carbon footprint certainly isn't zero. The manufacturing process of electric cars is energy-intensive and has its own considerable environmental impact.

This may surprise you, but studies have revealed that it actually requires more energy to produce an electric car than it does to produce a traditional one. Therefore, the manufacturing process of electric cars has a higher carbon footprint overall. This is mainly down to the materials needed.

The metals required to construct an electric car are more lightweight than those needed for traditional versions. However, manufacturing these high-performance metals requires a lot of energy, which feeds into the production process's overall carbon footprint.
**

Then there's the carbon footprint of the energy that EVs are charged with. Again, the first linked article explains:
**
On top of this, it's important to remember that electric cars still require a form of energy to function. So while using electricity to operate doesn't directly release fossil fuels, the production of the electricity itself most likely does.

Say, for example, that you're an American citizen who owns an electric car. Given that 83% of U.S electricity comes from non-renewable resources (or fossil fuels) such as coal, oil, and gas, you're most likely going to be charging your electric car using resources that damage the planet.

The production of electricity via these materials requires them to be burned, releasing huge amounts of carbon dioxide into the atmosphere. So, even though your electric car isn't directly emitting greenhouse gases, you're probably playing a role in the emission of such gases when you pop it on charge.
**

If your power comes from nuclear, hydroelectric, solar or wind the EV is damn near 100% more envirnomentally friendly. You actually think one guy figured out how to run a car on water but it hasn't dawned on any other scientist, give me a break.

First of all, as mentioned in the quote above, 83% of U.S. energy comes from non renewable sources. And they don't even seem to be including nuclear energy.

Nuclear energy has a lot of drawbacks:
The 7 reasons why nuclear energy is not the answer to solve climate change | eu.boell.org

I think the other sources of energy you mention are better, but they do have their issues too. Solar panels seem to have an industry standard duration of 25 years. It certainly saves money over other energy sources assuming it lasts this standard length, but that's only talking about direct savings for the customer. There are other issues with them:
There are grounds for concern about solar power | Al Jazeera

Wind farms also have their issues:
The down side to wind power | Harvard

As does hydroelectric power:
The Downside of Dams: Is the Environmental Price of Hydroelectric Power Too High? | Scientific American

I notice you didn't even respond to the second link in my last post. Did you see it?

 

[Nordberg]

So, your response to my links to the actual market returns to date is to offer up a sales pitch. Buying into EV charging stations is like buying a time share condo...

Nope, it is not. You pretend to be an expert on everything, yet you do not have an EV. People who have them can learn from you. Some of us who drive EVs know you are wrong because we have real-life experience. But nothing stops you from scraping about looking for something else. Your problem is you do not want to be told what to do. You can drive ICRs until you die if you want to. They will not evaporate when auto companies go 100 percent electric. You can ride a horse if you want. Most of us moved from them.

 

[Port Tack]

First of all, it's not just about what whether the EV polutes once it's on the road. It's also about what it takes to produce them. The first article I linked to explains:
**
While electric cars don't directly emit greenhouse gases when in use, their carbon footprint certainly isn't zero. The manufacturing process of electric cars is energy-intensive and has its own considerable environmental impact.

This may surprise you, but studies have revealed that it actually requires more energy to produce an electric car than it does to produce a traditional one. Therefore, the manufacturing process of electric cars has a higher carbon footprint overall. This is mainly down to the materials needed.

The metals required to construct an electric car are more lightweight than those needed for traditional versions. However, manufacturing these high-performance metals requires a lot of energy, which feeds into the production process's overall carbon footprint.
**

Then there's the carbon footprint of the energy that EVs are charged with. Again, the first linked article explains:
**
On top of this, it's important to remember that electric cars still require a form of energy to function. So while using electricity to operate doesn't directly release fossil fuels, the production of the electricity itself most likely does.

Say, for example, that you're an American citizen who owns an electric car. Given that 83% of U.S electricity comes from non-renewable resources (or fossil fuels) such as coal, oil, and gas, you're most likely going to be charging your electric car using resources that damage the planet.

The production of electricity via these materials requires them to be burned, releasing huge amounts of carbon dioxide into the atmosphere. So, even though your electric car isn't directly emitting greenhouse gases, you're probably playing a role in the emission of such gases when you pop it on charge.
**



First of all, as mentioned in the quote above, 83% of U.S. energy comes from non renewable sources. And they don't even seem to be including nuclear energy.

Nuclear energy has a lot of drawbacks:
The 7 reasons why nuclear energy is not the answer to solve climate change | eu.boell.org

I think the other sources of energy you mention are better, but they do have their issues too. Solar panels seem to have an industry standard duration of 25 years. It certainly saves money over other energy sources assuming it lasts this standard length, but that's only talking about direct savings for the customer. There are other issues with them:
There are grounds for concern about solar power | Al Jazeera

Wind farms also have their issues:
The down side to wind power | Harvard

As does hydroelectric power:
The Downside of Dams: Is the Environmental Price of Hydroelectric Power Too High? | Scientific American

I notice you didn't even respond to the second link in my last post. Did you see it?

You are an idiot not worth responding to. Sure both types of vehicles need to be manufactured but once they are the comparisons are night and day and if you are going to try and compare wind or solar or hydroelectric to burning coal you can do it with idiots who care to listen.

 

[Port Tack]

It depends on the level of the charger. It also depends on the car. Those that get 300 miles on a charge take longer, 100-mile range vehicles are much faster.
EV owners do not empty the charge. That is another reason your demand is not valid. Do you run your ICE empty and then walk to a gas station with a gas can? How long does that take you? https://blog.evbox.com/level-3-char...lso referred,and unlocking much faster speeds.
A level 3 can take you to 80 percent in 15 minutes.
Of course, the technology of charging improves almost monthly. There are 3 battery manufacturing plants being built in the midwest and they also have the business of building and improving charging stations.

So if you don't empty your charge that means you don't get 300 miles to the charge and that 800 mile trip takes 5 or 6 stops. I guess by the time I get there in my gas vehicle you will be somewhere in North Carolina. I don't bother to begin thinking about stopping for gas until I'm approaching 400 miles of driving and have never run out of gas. A level 3 charge does not get you 80% charge in 15 minutes unless your battery is over half capacity, not to mention how many level 3 charging stations are there?

 

[RB 60]

Nope, it is not. You pretend to be an expert on everything, yet you do not have an EV. People who have them can learn from you. Some of us who drive EVs know you are wrong because we have real-life experience. But nothing stops you from scraping about looking for something else. Your problem is you do not want to be told what to do. You can drive ICRs until you die if you want to. They will not evaporate when auto companies go 100 percent electric. You can ride a horse if you want. Most of us moved from them.

That's the whole point. I don't want to be told what to do, either. Don't allow the government to tell me I have to own an EV. I don't want to. And I won't.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

That's the whole point. I don't want to be told what to do, either. Don't allow the government to tell me I have to own an EV. I don't want to. And I won't.

No one is telling you to own an EV just like no one ever told you to use lead-free gas.

 

[RB 60]

No one is telling you to own an EV just like no one ever told you to use lead-free gas.

The government is giving incentives to buy an EV. They aren't giving incentives to buy an ICE. That is bullshit (discrimination?) and a waste of taxpayer's money.
Lead free (garbage) gasoline and now added methanol were/are being mandated (forced) by the government. So yeah, we're being told what we can and cannot purchase.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

The government is giving incentives to buy an EV. They aren't giving incentives to buy an ICE. That is bullshit (discrimination?) and a waste of taxpayer's money.
Lead free (garbage) gasoline and now added methanol were/are being mandated (forced) by the government. So yeah, we're being told what we can and cannot purchase.

Thanks for agreeing no one is forcing you to buy an EV despite your previous claim they are.

Trump has two years with a Republican Senate and House. Why didn't he change it?

 

[gfm7175]

Nope, it is not. You pretend to be an expert on everything, yet you do not have an EV. People who have them can learn from you. Some of us who drive EVs know you are wrong because we have real-life experience. But nothing stops you from scraping about looking for something else. Your problem is you do not want to be told what to do. You can drive ICRs until you die if you want to. They will not evaporate when auto companies go 100 percent electric. You can ride a horse if you want. Most of us moved from them.

Continued pretending that you aren't the Luddite.

 

[gfm7175]

Thanks for agreeing no one is forcing you to buy an EV despite your previous claim they are.

Trump has two years with a Republican Senate and House. Why didn't he change it?

Because Republican and MAGA are not synonymous terms.