Reality check on electric cars

[RB 60]

Or maybe he's more into the car's entertainment center than it's driving performance and qualities...

He'd be bored driving my car. No power steering. No power brakes. No radio. No mufflers. No glove box!
It does have A/C (ambient air circulation). Its a 4-speed and power to weight ratio is too much for him.

Yeah, he probably wouldn't like it. You can't have your head up your ass, it's a man's driving machine.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

He'd be bored driving my car. No power steering. No power brakes. No radio. No mufflers. No glove box!
It does have A/C (ambient air circulation). Its a 4-speed and power to weight ratio is too much for him.

Yeah, he probably wouldn't like it. You can't have your head up your ass, it's a man's driving machine.

I doubt Joke Communist could even drive something with a manual transmission... Whattaya mean I have to shift gears? How do you do that?

 

[RB 60]

I doubt Joke Communist could even drive something with a manual transmission... Whattaya mean I have to shift gears? How do you do that?

They aren't an easy car to drive, even with the more modern suspension (they handle better). You have to admire those who raced these things back then, they had balls and stamina. They're a handful.

 

[RB 60]

You guys say the dumbest shit. I have never ever had to wait for charging. It happens at night when we sleep. I do not have to check gas prices. I do not have to look for one with an open pump. I do not have to pump my own gas in a potentially dangerous gas station. You spend a lot of time involved in fueling your pollution mobile.

Yep. I pump my own gas. I spend 5 minutes refueling after traveling 400 miles. I can take off again. What's in your engine compartment?

 

[Nordberg]

Anecdote isn't evidence.

It is. However, that is the typical experience. That is why EV owners love them.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

It is. However, that is the typical experience. That is why EV owners love them.

No, you present anecdote.

Surprising number of EV owners switch back to gas power, study says
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/ev-owners-switch-gas-power-study/

Uber Drivers Now Considering Switching Out EV for Gas As Batteries Lose Charge in Cold Weather
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/new...eries-lose-charge-in-cold-weather/ar-BB1ihkJv

Why some electric car owners return to gas – the reasons aren’t surprising
https://electrek.co/2021/04/29/study-why-some-electric-car-owners-gas-reasons-surprising/

Many owners of an EV are dissatisfied with their choice and are moving back to ICE vehicles. This is among early adopters, as opposed to those who down the road are going to be forced into an EV by government fiat.

 

[QP!]

Fun? Fast? You haven't had fun or seen fast until you've driven a Cobra. But then, driving one demands respect and common sense. Both seem to elude you...

I've driven Cobra's and no doubt they are fun, for a while.

i've owned a few Porsche's in my day and used to be volunteer instructor with our local porsche club during our track days. The track days were open to all vehicles, not just porches and while we would would all take spins in the Cobra for the sheer straight line speed (which is awesome) it was not considered one of the more 'fun' track cars. Much like the fastest corvettes and Grand Prix, etc they were straight line drag cars mostly. Put them into turns and corners and they struggled, even with the top drivers. Much like a lot of the fastest EV's today. They are far more similar in that regard then not.

 

[QP!]

I'll keep what I have. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Why do you think the guys who keep pushing this idea that if an EV is not the ideal car in EVERY area, it is therefore not of value, do not attack your Cobra?

I would not take a Cobra on any length road trip, even with gas stations available the entire route. It simply is not the vehicle for that and that is why most people have another car.

But as always, we see the same stupid people pushing the same stupid line that if they can name the places an EV is not yet ideal, that somehow makes EV's bad and laughable.


'ZOMG sedans cannot haul stuff like a pickup truck does. Sedans have no place in the market because i need to haul stuff' HarHarHarHar.
/MagatIdiocy

 

[QP!]

Right you are!

Or maybe he's more into the car's entertainment center than it's driving performance and qualities...

More idiocy.

The same person who defines his Cobra as fun to drive shares the same straight line speed function that the fastest EV's do.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

More idiocy.

The same person who defines his Cobra as fun to drive shares the same straight line speed function that the fastest EV's do.

I consider a Lotus the epitome of fun. A spartan car that handles like it's on rails. A Lotus will run rings around any EV on a winding road or track. All EV's can do is go fast in a straight line due to their massive weight.

 

[RB 60]

I consider a Lotus the epitome of fun. A spartan car that handles like it's on rails. A Lotus will run rings around any EV on a winding road or track. All EV's can do is go fast in a straight line due to their massive weight.

I keep in touch with the guy I bought the Cobra from. His wife wanted something with roll-up windows and A/C, so he bought a Lotus. Last year he asked me if I knew anyone who had a nice Cobra for sale. I said not off-hand, unless he can find me a cherry big block '67 Mustang Fastback...
As for handling, the Cobra also handles like it's on rails, but with it's short wheelbase, you can't over-throttle it coming out of a turn or the ass end will quickly come around and pass the front end. That's why most who track them prefer the FIA Cobras with the 289, or a small block S/C. No EV can match it's handling, and few will out run it on a straightaway. It's no luxury car, but many Cobra owners take cross country cruises in them. Myself? I doubt I'd want to. I've been caught in a heavy downpour an hour from home and got soaked! People looked at us (a friend helped keep the passenger's seat dry) like we were nuts! Borrowed an old furnace blower from a friend to dry the carpet out. I watch the weather radar much closer now!

 

[QP!]

I consider a Lotus the epitome of fun. A spartan car that handles like it's on rails. A Lotus will run rings around any EV on a winding road or track. All EV's can do is go fast in a straight line due to their massive weight.

I keep in touch with the guy I bought the Cobra from. His wife wanted something with roll-up windows and A/C, so he bought a Lotus. Last year he asked me if I knew anyone who had a nice Cobra for sale. I said not off-hand, unless he can find me a cherry big block '67 Mustang Fastback...
As for handling, the Cobra also handles like it's on rails, but with it's short wheelbase, you can't over-throttle it coming out of a turn or the ass end will quickly come around and pass the front end. That's why most who track them prefer the FIA Cobras with the 289, or a small block S/C. No EV can match it's handling, and few will out run it on a straightaway. It's no luxury car, but many Cobra owners take cross country cruises in them. Myself? I doubt I'd want to. I've been caught in a heavy downpour an hour from home and got soaked! People looked at us (a friend helped keep the passenger's seat dry) like we were nuts! Borrowed an old furnace blower from a friend to dry the carpet out. I watch the weather radar much closer now!

So like EV's and also pickup trucks, and also sedans, and also Minivans, they are not perfect for every need, for every driver.

Thanks for making my point that different drivers have different needs and you do not dismiss a class of vehicles because you can find an area that the vehicle does not work good in.

In fairness RB, I have not seen you make that stupid argument but it is a mainstay of Terry amd gfm, idiotic based arguments to keep pointing at an area an EV might not be the greatest and to think that somehow dismisses them as a class of vehicles.

EV's continue to be the most ideal vehicle for the vast bulk of the population who are the typical work/home/errands/weekend getaway drivers who do 80%+ of their yearly driving within their home town and another 10% for weekend getaways to friends or a cottage, etc. The types of 'across the more rural states' trips applies to a tiny percent of the population or is a once every 'many years' trip, in which case you rent a more suitable to mile out, with all the money you saved on gas.

But that won't stop Terry from pushing this stupid argument in the future, just as they push 'but EV's catch fire' as if an argument and that is because they know they have few valid arguments.

 

[RB 60]

For me, even though I put less than 10,000 miles a year on my daily driver, it would be impractical for me to go EV. I'd have to dig a ditch and run 75ft. of cable to an outdoor charger. Then buy an EV. $$$$! Then comes the winter snowstorms, and I'm messing with a 220 volt power cable? Then there's the road salt.

I've had a "pleasure vehicle" since I was 19. I had a '70 Torino GT as a daily driver and a 600 HP Mustang in the garage. I like horsepower and the thunder a big block has. I ain't giving it up.

 

[gfm7175]

Why do you think the guys who keep pushing this idea that if an EV is not the ideal car in EVERY area, it is therefore not of value, do not attack your Cobra?

If I am going to choose one vehicle to own, and I need that vehicle to be able to drive 900 miles (let alone even a few hundred miles) in a day (which requires very fast refueling), I am not going to be choosing an EV.

If I am going to choose one vehicle to own, and I need that vehicle to be able to haul wood, tow trailers, and other such work, I am not going to be choosing an EV.

If I am going to choose one vehicle to own, and I need that vehicle to be able to reliably operate in harsh Winter conditions, I am not going to be choosing an EV.

It doesn't matter if an EV would work the other 80-90% of the time. It's the remaining 10-20% of the time that it DOESN'T work that is the issue.

I would not take a Cobra on any length road trip, even with gas stations available the entire route. It simply is not the vehicle for that and that is why most people have another car.

Okay.

But as always, we see the same stupid people pushing the same stupid line that if they can name the places an EV is not yet ideal, that somehow makes EV's bad and laughable.

EV's can't serve the purposes of most people. That's why most people do not own an EV.

'ZOMG sedans cannot haul stuff like a pickup truck does. Sedans have no place in the market because i need to haul stuff' HarHarHarHar.
/MagatIdiocy

Here, you're resorting to ridiculousness because that's all you have left.

A person who needs to haul more than a small amount of stuff at a time is not going to buy a sedan. That person is going to buy a pickup truck instead because it better suits that person's needs. This is why most people do not buy EVs; EVs don't suit the needs of most people.

I've used a sedan to haul firewood from a family member's house to my house before. You'd be surprised how much firewood can fit inside of a large sedan's trunk. While it's not nearly as efficient of a transfer method as using a truck bed or using a truck pulling a trailer full of firewood, it still works for a person who doesn't own a truck and who already goes over to that location on a weekly basis anyway. Just take back a trunk load of firewood each week, and over a few months of doing so, one has enough firewood to last the entire Winter. --- In most cases, this method wouldn't fit one's needs (needing to haul a bunch of firewood at one time in one trip). However, in this special case, as the need is only to be able to haul some firewood at a time over a whole bunch of separate trips, then a sedan can fit that need where-as it typically cannot fit firewood hauling needs.

Likewise, if a person needs to travel 900 miles and it doesn't matter how long it takes that person to get there, then that person could make an EV work for that purpose. However, if that person needs to travel 900 miles within a single day, then an EV simply will not meet the needs of that person.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

So like EV's and also pickup trucks, and also sedans, and also Minivans, they are not perfect for every need, for every driver.

Thanks for making my point that different drivers have different needs and you do not dismiss a class of vehicles because you can find an area that the vehicle does not work good in.

In fairness RB, I have not seen you make that stupid argument but it is a mainstay of Terry amd gfm, idiotic based arguments to keep pointing at an area an EV might not be the greatest and to think that somehow dismisses them as a class of vehicles.

EV's continue to be the most ideal vehicle for the vast bulk of the population who are the typical work/home/errands/weekend getaway drivers who do 80%+ of their yearly driving within their home town and another 10% for weekend getaways to friends or a cottage, etc. The types of 'across the more rural states' trips applies to a tiny percent of the population or is a once every 'many years' trip, in which case you rent a more suitable to mile out, with all the money you saved on gas.

But that won't stop Terry from pushing this stupid argument in the future, just as they push 'but EV's catch fire' as if an argument and that is because they know they have few valid arguments.

I have never made an argument that EV's shouldn't exist or be allowed to exist. Buy one if you want it, just don't force me to buy one if I don't. My beef with them isn't so much the car, but rather that Leftist government is forcing them down our throats. Banning sale of new ICE vehicles, handing out large bribes to buy one, squandering billions on charging stations because nobody will build them otherwise--Tesla being an exception--are what I object to. All of that is in the name of supposedly 'saving the planet' bullshit from the radical environmentalist front on the Left. Fuck them!

 

[QP!]

If I am going to choose one vehicle to own, and I need that vehicle to be able to commute around town for work/School errands, I am not going to be choosing an Pickup, SUV or sport coup.

If I am going to choose one vehicle to own to commute around town, and I need that vehicle to not have to stop for fueling I am not going to be choosing an Pickup, SUV, sport coup or general ICE vehicle.

If I am going to choose one vehicle to own, and I live in cities where, most people do, where the climate is not so harsh , I am not going to be choosing an pickup, SUV, sport coup or general ICE vehicle.

It doesn't matter if an Pickup or SUV would work those 5-10% of times i might need something different as it is the remaining 90-95% of driving that i will value the most.
....

.

 

[gfm7175]

So like EV's and also pickup trucks, and also sedans, and also Minivans, they are not perfect for every need, for every driver.

Thanks for making my point that different drivers have different needs and you do not dismiss a class of vehicles because you can find an area that the vehicle does not work good in.

Nobody in this thread ever tried to make any such point, so your point is irrelevant. In fact, I've spent much of my time in this thread explaining just THAT... that different drivers do indeed have different needs, and how EVs simply don't fit most people's needs.

In fairness RB, I have not seen you make that stupid argument but it is a mainstay of Terry amd gfm, idiotic based arguments to keep pointing at an area an EV might not be the greatest and to think that somehow dismisses them as a class of vehicles.

Here, you are being delusional. Neither T.A nor I have made such an argument.

Once again, I've already explained how different people have different needs. I even gave you four separate examples within a single post of how different people have different needs (as well as which specific vehicles can fit those needs).

You don't like the truth about my arguments, so you resort to lies about them instead. Lies don't work here. Anyone can go back and see what I actually said, or what T.A actually said.

EV's continue to be the most ideal vehicle for the vast bulk of the population

Nope. The opposite is true, actually. EVs are the least ideal vehicle for the vast bulk of the population. There's a reason why hardly anyone owns an EV.

who are the typical work/home/errands/weekend getaway drivers who do 80%+ of their yearly driving within their home town and another 10% for weekend getaways to friends or a cottage, etc.

People don't buy a car because it works for 80-90% of their driving needs, but does not work for the other 10-20%. They buy a car that works for 99-100% of their driving needs.

The types of 'across the more rural states' trips applies to a tiny percent of the population or is a once every 'many years' trip, in which case you rent a more suitable to mile out, with all the money you saved on gas.

Here, you try to pull the classic "lie of omission" strategy that warmizombies like to make use of.

Does it make you feel better inside when you purposely make use of the word 'gas' instead of the word 'fuel'?

You obviously do that so that you can conveniently and dishonestly ignore the cost of electricity as fuel, pretending that EV's are soooooooooooo much cheaper to drive around. They aren't, especially when you include all other relevant costs associated with them.

 

[QP!]

...

gfm next insightful post is to tell the world why the segment of econo box ICE sedans were never actually of value to anyone because he can name situations they are not great at.

This despite the fact that econobox were a dominant segment, as the around town runabout vehicle, due to fuel savings, and the fact most people are making short, 1 or 2 person trips in them primarily.

gfm however tells everyone why they are wrong as an econobox

- econo box - not great in heavy winter weather
- econo box - not great for large families
- econo box - not comfortable to long drives
- econo box- can't haul wood or other stuff

- econo box - it does not matter if it works great the other 80-90% of time, they simply do not make sense to have as a segment as they do not work for everything, including that 10-20% of other.

This is how the idiotic mind of gfm works, to tell OTHERS there car choice makes no sense based on the areas HE THINKS they need to ALSO be good at.

 

[QP!]

...

Here, you're resorting to ridiculousness because that's all you have left.

A person who needs to haul more than a small amount of stuff at a time is not going to buy a sedan. That person is going to buy a pickup truck instead because it better suits that person's needs. This is why most people do not buy EVs; EVs don't suit the needs of most people.

I've used a sedan to haul firewood from a family member's house to my house before. You'd be surprised how much firewood can fit inside of a large sedan's trunk. While it's not nearly as efficient of a transfer method as using a truck bed or using a truck pulling a trailer full of firewood, it still works for a person who doesn't own a truck and who already goes over to that location on a weekly basis anyway. Just take back a trunk load of firewood each week, and over a few months of doing so, one has enough firewood to last the entire Winter. --- In most cases, this method wouldn't fit one's needs (needing to haul a bunch of firewood at one time in one trip). However, in this special case, as the need is only to be able to haul some firewood at a time over a whole bunch of separate trips, then a sedan can fit that need where-as it typically cannot fit firewood hauling needs.

Likewise, if a person needs to travel 900 miles and it doesn't matter how long it takes that person to get there, then that person could make an EV work for that purpose. However, if that person needs to travel 900 miles within a single day, then an EV simply will not meet the needs of that person.

And here you continue with your stupidity as you MAKE MY POINT and do not realize it.

Correct sedans are not great for hauling wood, and those who need that will buy a Pick up., meaning those who buy sedans do so for the OTHER functionality they NEED MORE.

That is MY ARGUEMENT with EV's. They are valued for what they DO, 80-90% of the time and not excluded, like a sedan for what it cannot do the rest.

And you seem to not understand there are EV, SUV, Minivans and Pickup trucks too.

So this is where you jump to another niche where EV's are not great thinking you are making a statement against them when like you say with Sedans, those who do things are not going to buy an EV. Simple as that. For the rest of the populace (that 80+%) an Ev is an ideal vehicle.

 

[QP!]

I have never made an argument that EV's shouldn't exist or be allowed to exist. Buy one if you want it, just don't force me to buy one if I don't. My beef with them isn't so much the car, but rather that Leftist government is forcing them down our throats. Banning sale of new ICE vehicles, handing out large bribes to buy one, squandering billions on charging stations because nobody will build them otherwise--Tesla being an exception--are what I object to. All of that is in the name of supposedly 'saving the planet' bullshit from the radical environmentalist front on the Left. Fuck them!

you and that idiot gfm keep pointing at what EV's are not ideal at doing as an argument against them such as his post i am replying to above this one.

It is a completely stupid argument to make and yet you persist.

IF i want something it is because of what it does, and not because of what it does not do. A motorcycle might be very appropriate for me, and no amount of you guys pointing and laughing that it cannot haul wood, is not good in the winter, etc, changes that for me and a large part of the populace it may be the best choice for them, depending on where they live and what their daily commute looks like.

The FACT is EV's are ideal for the bulk of the populace in the same the class of econo box was prior. AGAIN it does not matter that gfm, like an idiot can list what econo box cars are not good at doing. WHat they were GREAT at doing was getting a person to work and back and around town, CHEAPLY, which is the BULK of most peoples driving.

And EV's are better than the econobox, as they are even cheaper and more convenient for 'fueling' for those type of trips but also the EV"s as a class provide far more value matching most full size sedans, SUV's and minivans for most family needs. Of course this is where the idiot gfm comes in and points out what the EV is not ideal for, thinking he is making some point, and then you, Terry clap along with his idiocy.