Surprise! Massachusetts pushes for spanking ban

Superfreak said:
AGAIN... your assertation was that all this was happening to AMERICANS.... THAT is what I asked you to provide evidence on.
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No. I asserted that the Bush Administration claims the power to do this to US citizens, which it does:

Yeah, preventing people from spanking their children is much worse than what the conservative Bush Administration thinks it can do to US citizens in the name of the War on Terror. Rendition? Torture? Indefinite detention without charges? Use of coerced confessions as evidence? Warrantless wire-tapping? They've got nothing on a proposed ban on corporal punishment. That's the worst.
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Chapdog said:
sounds like you are a good mom. world needs more of them thats for sure.

This whole issue is mind boggling to me because if I choose to use a different punishment such as a swat on the ass for doing something very bad it is not being a bad parent or criminal.. and also nobody’s business.

99% of time time outs.. yelling and lecturing.. and rewarding works fine. But in my mind big things that are dangerous and you don’t have a luxury of normal discipline that usually takes a few times before they learn… your safer to put fear into them so they don’t do it again.
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I agree a smack on the but to distract a toddler is sometimes a good thing.

I DO not agree with spanking. Spanking where you hit a kid with anything other than your hand and or you hit repetedly. One swat to distract a toddler is very different then a ritualistic hitting of a kid for an infraction which could be dealt with by restricting priviledges.

I greatly prefered the 45 minute lecture where you spend time telling them just why what they did was wrong in every way possible. Im telling you they never forget and it does not let them off easy as they have to stay in the conversation when you do it right. Most people wont do it because it takes way to much effort.
 
Darla said:
What Dano just said is that the children he knows are intimidated by adults they don’t know. This means that he is teaching children to feel that way, and the adults he knows are teaching them the same thing. This is the conservative teachings, and this is the main mindset in this country.

90 percent of children who are sexually abused will be abused by an adult the child knows. Please do not teach your children to be intimidated by “their elders”, or that “their elders” are always right, or that they must “obey their elders”.

This is absolutely the worst thing you can teach any child. If they come into the orbit of a predator, that predator will jump on them. And the child will not tell because he was told not to by his or her “elder”. And that child will not say no, you can’t do that to me, because this child has been taught to not question their “elders”.

For God sakes, I have given up on conservatives politically, I really have, but what is wrong with you people? What is wrong with you people?
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Too many children are fondled or something like that by that "uncle they were told never to stay around", and feel as if it was their fault for not taking the advice, and that they shouldn't tell because he's an elder.
 
Chapdog said:
99% of time time outs.. yelling and lecturing.. and rewarding works fine. But in my mind big things that are dangerous and you don’t have a luxury of normal discipline that usually takes a few times before they learn… your safer to put fear into them so they don’t do it again.
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Agreed.
 
Desh said:
Its called communication. When you try to reason with them with language instead of resorting to smacking them you raise a person who trys to reason instead of resorting to violence.

I bet you did much more talking than hitting and you just dont want to admitt it because you see reasoning as a liberal thing and hitting as a conservative thing.

J/K look you and every good parent knows smacking a kid is a last resort.
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That's right, it was a last resort, usually with tantrums where they just scream and don't listen.

It would be nice if kids were completely rational, but you can't possibly be deluded enough to think they are.

I don't see spanking as a Conservative thing, I see it as a last resort that Conservatives allow.
Great if you had kids that never needed discipline, I've seen a few kids like that, but there are far more who do and I am just saying it's up to parents and not government to decide whether or not they need to.
 
Darla said:
And here is the typical right wing male, who calls me a “bimbo” out of absolutely nowhere for expressing my opinion .
Is Runyon called a bimbo, a slut, a whore, or the c word on here? Is Said?
Nope. Because liberal men have more class than that, and that is the only reason why.
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How very true Darla.

Its one of the things that makes it impossible for me to ever consider any man who is not a liberal as a partner. They will refuse to see it but it is just transparent in the male conservative.
 
Southern parents use corporal punishment far too often.

I remember one story of a girl I know who read "Charlotte's Web", and cried at the end. Her father came in, asked her "WHY ARE YOU CRYING?", and spanked her because of that (probably not with a rod or something, but oh well).
 
TheDanold said:
That's right, it was a last resort, usually with tantrums where they just scream and don't listen.

It would be nice if kids were completely rational, but you can't possibly be deluded enough to think they are.

I don't see spanking as a Conservative thing, I see it as a last resort that Conservatives allow.
Great if you had kids that never needed discipline, I've seen a few kids like that, but there are far more who do and I am just saying it's up to parents and not government to decide whether or not they need to.
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Oh please. I never "Just screamed and didn't listen" as a child.
 
No darla..............

Darla said:
And here is the typical right wing male, who calls me a “bimbo” out of absolutely nowhere for expressing my opinion .
Is Runyon called a bimbo, a slut, a whore, or the c word on here? Is Said?
Nope. Because liberal men have more class than that, and that is the only reason why.
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I called you a bimbo...because all of your arguments are anti-conservative...you and cippie always fail to be fair ...it is always the conservatives who are the perves...when in fact most perves are from your sector...just a fact...get over it!
 
Watermark said:
Too many children are fondled or something like that by that "uncle they were told never to stay around", and feel as if it was their fault for not taking the advice, and that they shouldn't tell because he's an elder.
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I never let my son out of my sight with anyone I did not know(fortunately there were no dangerous people in my family). My son always knew he had a right to say no even to me. I would just reason with him as to why he should do what I said. I know to many of you this sounds nuts but we did not have very many problems as he always knew I would explain to him why if he asked so he pretty well did whatever I said. He knew I had his best interest in mind and it was the very basis of our cooperative relationship.
 
Battleborne said:
I called you a bimbo...because all of your arguments are anti-conservative...you and cippie always fail to be fair ...it is always the conservatives who are the perves...when in fact most perves are from your sector...just a fact...get over it!
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Please produce some proof of this repeted claim?
 
Darla said:
What Dano just said is that the children he knows are intimidated by adults they don’t know. This means that he is teaching children to feel that way, and the adults he knows are teaching them the same thing. This is the conservative teachings, and this is the main mindset in this country.

90 percent of children who are sexually abused will be abused by an adult the child knows. Please do not teach your children to be intimidated by “their elders”, or that “their elders” are always right, or that they must “obey their elders”.

This is absolutely the worst thing you can teach any child. If they come into the orbit of a predator, that predator will jump on them. And the child will not tell because he was told not to by his or her “elder”. And that child will not say no, you can’t do that to me, because this child has been taught to not question their “elders”.

For God sakes, I have given up on conservatives politically, I really have, but what is wrong with you people? What is wrong with you people?
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You are fucking insane.
You go on about how it's not good that children are wary of strangers, but aren't wary enough about relatives!?!
Yeah sure there is the perverted uncle or whatever that a very few kids will have to deal with but would you actually contend that kids are safer around strangers than people they know? That sounds like what you're saying.

Do you even understand how to read stats? Yes more people are abused by people they know, but that is only because parents don't leave their kids with strangers, NOT because people they know are more dangerous.

Honest to fucking God, you are nuts lady...

I can just see it now:
Darla: Now Darla Jr., you stay away from that uncle of yours he is statistically more likely to abuse you, be wary of him. But don't be afraid of that stranger who comes around the park to stare at the kids, be friendly to him, he has a much lower chance of abusing you.

Common sense and powers of observation are completely lacking from you, if an expert told you anything you would do it.
 
Superfreak said:
You are saying that Bush has said the US has the power to torture and subject US citizens to rendition?????

Calling bullshit on that.
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OK. Call bullshit on it. I don't care one whit. Look at the Military Commission Act of 2006 and how it defines unlawful enemy combatant and then tell me if you see any exclusion for US citizens. You won't. That statute also permits "enhanced interrogation techniques" f.k.a. torture.

As for rendition, I am mistaken. As far as I know, no US citizen has been subject to rendition.
 
Desh said:
I never let my son out of my sight with anyone I did not know(fortunately there were no dangerous people in my family). My son always knew he had a right to say no even to me. I would just reason with him as to why he should do what I said. I know to many of you this sounds nuts but we did not have very many problems as he always knew I would explain to him why if he asked so he pretty well did whatever I said. He knew I had his best interest in mind and it was the very basis of our cooperative relationship.
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Well, as prudish as it may sound, you must keep on an eye them even in company that you know. Even if you trust them and they seem the most likeable person in the world. That's where 90% of molestations come from.
 
TheDanold said:
You are fucking insane.
You go on about how it's not good that children are wary of strangers, but aren't wary enough about relatives!?!
Yeah sure there is the perverted uncle or whatever that a very few kids will have to deal with but would you actually contend that kids are safer around strangers than people they know? That sounds like what you're saying.

Do you even understand how to read stats? Yes more people are abused by people they know, but that is only because parents don't leave their kids with strangers, NOT because people they know are more dangerous.

Honest to fucking God, you are nuts lady...

I can just see it now:
Darla: Now Darla Jr., you stay away from that uncle of yours he is statistically more likely to abuse you, be wary of him. But don't be afraid of that stranger who comes around the park to stare at the kids, be friendly to him, he has a much lower chance of abusing you.

Common sense and powers of observation are completely lacking from you, if an expert told you anything you would do it.
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You better wake up stupid, it’s frightening how you think. You don’t tell any kid anything like that. You teach them that they are in charge of their bodies, that if something feels wrong, it is wrong no matter who is doing it, that no adult has the right to touch them, and that they can say “no” to anybody, and that they are always to tell. Get your head out of your ideological ass, you have kids, it’s not just you on the line, if it were, I wouldn’t care.
 
TheDanold said:
You are fucking insane.
You go on about how it's not good that children are wary of strangers, but aren't wary enough about relatives!?!
Yeah sure there is the perverted uncle or whatever that a very few kids will have to deal with but would you actually contend that kids are safer around strangers than people they know? That sounds like what you're saying.

Do you even understand how to read stats? Yes more people are abused by people they know, but that is only because parents don't leave their kids with strangers, NOT because people they know are more dangerous.

Honest to fucking God, you are nuts lady...

I can just see it now:
Darla: Now Darla Jr., you stay away from that uncle of yours he is statistically more likely to abuse you, be wary of him. But don't be afraid of that stranger who comes around the park to stare at the kids, be friendly to him, he has a much lower chance of abusing you.

Common sense and powers of observation are completely lacking from you, if an expert told you anything you would do it.
Click to expand...

People trust kind old Joe uncle a bit too much. It's obvious to be scared of strangers, that's just common sense Dano. But we train our children to accept anything from adults we know, and that just isn't right.
 
Dungheap said:
OK. Call bullshit on it. I don't care one whit. Look at the Military Commission Act of 2006 and how it defines unlawful enemy combatant and then tell me if you see any exclusion for US citizens. You won't. That statute also permits "enhanced interrogation techniques" f.k.a. torture.

As for rendition, I am mistaken. As far as I know, no US citizen has been subject to rendition.
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ok... that took about five seconds....

"Sec. 948c. Persons subject to military commissions
Any alien unlawful enemy combatant is subject to trial by military commission under this chapter. "
 
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