The 10 Most Dangerous Places to be a Woman in America

tekkychick said:
a) while you may feel an abortion is murdering an "unborn baby" many of us don't feel the same way

b) the organ restriction is because there is something appalling about someone making money by stripping their body of necessary parts. A similar analogy would be to compare it to surrogate mothers, which is legal, but the price is supposed to be limited to covering the costs of the pregnancy. So false analogy in your post.

Yes, the decisions around pregnancy should be between the mother, the doctor and the father - IF he is involved. It's not a canard.

And yes, the restrictions on abortion ARE dangerous for a woman - witness that Philadelphia doctor. Desperate women do desperate things, and it can lead to illness, sterility and death of the pregnant woman.
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There's something appalling about what?
 
cawacko said:
Tekkychick, if we look at crime statistics and the murder and rape of women in the U.S. those numbers are less than the the number of similar incidents to what occurred in Ohiladelphia? Again I find that hard to believe.
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I was referring to the doctor in Philadelphia who performed late-term abortions - very poorly. Women were driven to him because of lack of other providers and because of the expense of abortions if they did find a different provider.
 
tekkychick said:
I was referring to the doctor in Philadelphia who performed late-term abortions - very poorly. Women were driven to him because of lack of other providers and because of the expense of abortions if they did find a different provider.
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I understood what you were referring to. I don't see numbers of in indents like that being higher than rapes and murders in other cities.
 
tekkychick said:
a) while you may feel an abortion is murdering an "unborn baby" many of us don't feel the same way

b) the organ restriction is because there is something appalling about someone making money by stripping their body of necessary parts. A similar analogy would be to compare it to surrogate mothers, which is legal, but the price is supposed to be limited to covering the costs of the pregnancy. So false analogy in your post.

Yes, the decisions around pregnancy should be between the mother, the doctor and the father - IF he is involved. It's not a canard.

And yes, the restrictions on abortion ARE dangerous for a woman - witness that Philadelphia doctor. Desperate women do desperate things, and it can lead to illness, sterility and death of the pregnant woman.
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Well the crux of the argument for me is (a). Everything else is really irrelevant after that.

What is appalling about a woman wanting to sell a kidney? How does it harm anyone else? I think it is a fully appropriate analogy. It is her healthcare. It is her body. All arguments made by the pro abortion crowd.

What I find appalling is the knots many twist themselves into in trying to dehumanized the baby. I find it appalling that the majority of abortion clinics are in black neighborhoods. I find it appalling that 1800 black babies are slaughtered every day. That is what I find appalling.

I also don't buy the argument that a woman would actually take a hanger and do what people claim they do with it. If she is really that desperate to not have a child, then the simplest solution is to not participate in the action that leads to the baby. Yes, I know what you are going to say "but what about the guy". And to that I answer he is irrelevant. He can want sex all he wants, but it is the woman who decides if the transaction is taking place. Ask any married guy.

Abortion has turned into a way to avoid consequences of ones actions and that I find appalling.
 
tekkychick said:
Then I honestly don't get why you are comparing unsafe abortions to rapes and murders.

They're all bad.
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I agree they are all bad. I just don't understand how a woman living in a rich low crime area is in the most dangerous part of the U.S. compared to a woman living in an area with a high number of rapes and murders.
 
I Love America said:
I also don't buy the argument that a woman would actually take a hanger and do what people claim they do with it. .
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Then I suggest you read some women's history. Not always a hanger, but women will do a lot of desperate and dangerous things to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy. A hanger was just one of them.
 
It's not, "a womans choice" when there is another human involved. None of us can make the call on murder

The debate is about, "human or not" not "womans choice or not"
 
tekkychick said:
Then I suggest you read some women's history. Not always a hanger, but women will do a lot of desperate and dangerous things to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy. A hanger was just one of them.
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are you unaware that as many women are dying today as a result of legal abortion as died in 1971 from illegal ones?.......
 
Women today have got it made.

Let's cut the bullshit out once and for all about their victimization. They create their own problems and their own dangerous life style choice situations.

Let them stop their whining and their Oprah victimization boo hoo BS. all by themselves without a male shoulder to cry on.

Never in this country's history have women had more opportunities and more lifestyle choices and if they make the wrong choices then that's on them.


They wanted liberation so they got it now deal with it girls and STFU with your constant victimization and your poor little picked on me whining.
 
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cawacko said:
So a woman can live in a crime infested neighborhood but she's safe as long as she has good abortion options nearby? I find that one hard to believe.
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We are witnessing the criminalization of women. These laws being rammed through state legislatures are turning women into a criminal class. You are not less free because a man in your town was murdered.

I am less free every time one of these laws is passed.
 
tekkychick said:
Then I suggest you read some women's history. Not always a hanger, but women will do a lot of desperate and dangerous things to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy. A hanger was just one of them.
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Believe it or not, I have done an exhaustive search and I have found only ONE documented case of a woman using a hanger to murder her unborn baby and that was in 2009.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2791734/

While I don't deny that women have probably done some desperate things to terminate a pregnancy, I don't know where the whole "coat hanger" thing has come from. As I say, there is only one documented case that I can find after an exhaustive search.

It would be my preference that if a woman were so intent on having an abortion that she would take the steps to prevent one which of course the most effective is not participating in the actions that lead to an unwanted pregnancy. It just seems so logical to me
 
Darla said:
We are witnessing the criminalization of women. These laws being rammed through state legislatures are turning women into a criminal class. You are not less free because a man in your town was murdered.

I am less free every time one of these laws is passed.
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Well said. It's all about criminalizing women - and punishing them for having sex.

Which takes us back to the bad old days, when men who had sex were "manly" while the women they had sex with were "sluts". A teenage boy who got a teenage girl pregnant could finish high school; she was sent out of town to have her baby somewhere no one could see her.

And if a woman decided not to carry a baby to term, she risked her life through home-grown remedies or through a doctor who may or may not be well-trained; who may or may not take sanitary precautions; and who DEFINITELY charged a lot.

for the men on this site who are so opposed to abortion - these are your mothers, sisters, daughters, wives, nieces whose lives you are risking with these terrible laws. You are taking the choice away from your mothers, sisters, daughters, wives, nieces. Shame on you.
 
tekkychick said:
Well said. It's all about criminalizing women - and punishing them for having sex.

Which takes us back to the bad old days, when men who had sex were "manly" while the women they had sex with were "sluts". A teenage boy who got a teenage girl pregnant could finish high school; she was sent out of town to have her baby somewhere no one could see her.

And if a woman decided not to carry a baby to term, she risked her life through home-grown remedies or through a doctor who may or may not be well-trained; who may or may not take sanitary precautions; and who DEFINITELY charged a lot.

for the men on this site who are so opposed to abortion - these are your mothers, sisters, daughters, wives, nieces whose lives you are risking with these terrible laws. You are taking the choice away from your mothers, sisters, daughters, wives, nieces. Shame on you.
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It sounds like your major concern is that you want women to be able to have sex like a man with ZERO consequence to avoid being called a slut. While I agree, that abortion does absolve a woman of the consequence of her sexual proclivities and I will also concede that there is a double standard that exists as it pertains to the sexual activities of men and women. However, I don't see how murdering a baby is the way to eliminate that double standard.

As double standards go, being able to have consequence free sex isn't exactly life altering. Oh, yes I know that sex can be fun, exhilarating and all of that. But, it is not without consequence.

Separate for a second the murdering of an unborn child. Other consequences of sex include sexually transmitted diseases, low self esteem to name a couple. I am not sure how a woman contracting syphilis or chlamydia or herpes is good for her regardless of how fun sex is.

The simple fact remains that if a woman does not want to become pregnant, there is an easy remedy. She should not participate in the activity that leads to a pregnancy.

I don't want to become addicted to heroin or crack, therefore I do not do heroin or crack. I know that heroin and crack are HIGHLY addictive and that trying them even ONE TIME can lead to a lifetime of hell. Therefore I do not do them. I don't demand that the government change the laws because trying heroin or crack might be fun.

I don't want to get convicted of drunk driving. I don't want to accidentally kill someone while behind the wheel of a car while intoxicated. Therefore I do not drink and drive.

Lastly, nobody is criminalizing women. They are preventing murder.
 
I Love America said:
It sounds like your major concern is that you want women to be able to have sex like a man with ZERO consequence to avoid being called a slut. While I agree, that abortion does absolve a woman of the consequence of her sexual proclivities and I will also concede that there is a double standard that exists as it pertains to the sexual activities of men and women. However, I don't see how murdering a baby is the way to eliminate that double standard.
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Perhaps if men would accept their responsibility for sticking their dick into women there'd be less abortions?
 
ILA, I appreciate your new style of discussion.

In this particular case, I don't think we'll ever "get through" to each other because we fundamentally disagree on what abortion is. You consider it murder; I don't.

The rest all falls from that.

My major concern is protecting women's health by giving all women access to safe, legal, effective medical treatment for all things, whether it's abortion, pre-natal care, STD treatment, IVF treatments, tubal ligation, cancer, depression, etc etc etc.

I see abortion and contraception as just pieces of a woman's overall medical care; you don't.

I don't think I'll ever change your opinion; you will never change mine.

I'm saying all this so you'll understand why I'm not going to address your comments line by line. You have been perfectly polite; it's just it won't get us anywhere.

And for those who are going to rush in to say "oh you are just admitting you have no argument" -no, I'm not admitting that. I just don't like pointless debate. I'd rather discuss things where we MIGHT be able to come to agreement, or at least nudge someone in one direction or another. Doesn't mean I won't discuss this again. I just am not answering ILA's post point-by-point and, given our past history, wanted to assure ILA that it isn't the tone of his post that is keeping me from responding.
 
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