The Constitution protects Trumps tax returns

Nordberg said:
House Ways and Means has a function is to make sure the executive branch is honest. Getting Trump's taxes is just a way to do the job. It is necessary. Trump should be an adult and hand them over.
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The 4th requires "PROBABLE CAUSE." "I do solemnly swear to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States Of America." (Congresses oath of office) "Congress shall make all laws that are "NECESSARY and PROPER" for carrying into Execution the "FORGOING POWERS", "AND ALL OTHER POWERS" "VESTED BY THIS CONSTITUTION" in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.
 
Originally Posted by PoliTalker View Post
The 4th does not apply here. There is no search or seizure taking place.
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Like the Democrats in congress just want to hold Trumps tax returns in their lock box and never have "seized or searched" them, right?:rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2::rofl2:
 
Robo said:
The 4th requires "PROBABLE CAUSE." "I do solemnly swear to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States Of America." (Congresses oath of office) "Congress shall make all laws that are "NECESSARY and PROPER" for carrying into Execution the "FORGOING POWERS", "AND ALL OTHER POWERS" "VESTED BY THIS CONSTITUTION" in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.
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Different subjects. Ways and Means has the power. They do not need probable cause. Are you suggesting that Trump does not give probable cause? Are you really suggesting that? Try and slip in a sliver of honesty in your posts. This whole problem is because Trump shows probable cause about taxes, emoluments, obstruction and other matters. Trump is a walking, talking probable cause.
 
Hello Nordberg,

Nordberg said:
I see no basis for going to court. The IRS has to provide requested taxes. Ways and Means does not have to sue to get them. The only legal problems arie if the IRS refuses to do their job . Then Rettig ,the boss ,is subject to removal from his position, a 10 K fine and up to 5 years in jail. Is he willing to risk that to protect Trump from paying for his crimes?
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Who is supposed to enforce that?

The way I see it going down is this:

1. Mnuchin and Rettig both refuse to turn over the taxes.

2. House issues subpeona for them.

3. Trump files lawsuit, gets an injunction, sends the whole thing into a court battle.

4. Trump's lawyers drag the ordeal out with endless briefs, filings, appeals.

5. Trump uses the whole thing as hate-bait Twitter-fuel to further the hatred of Democrats by Republicans, thus shoring up any who might be getting cold feet. Trump spoon-feeds his fans all the arguments they need to justify continued support, and how they are protecting freedom from illegal search and seizure by protecting President Trump from owning up to his own word to release his taxes.
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello Nordberg,



Who is supposed to enforce that?

The way I see it going down is this:

1. Mnuchin and Rettig both refuse to turn over the taxes.

2. House issues subpeona for them.

3. Trump files lawsuit, gets an injunction, sends the whole thing into a court battle.

4. Trump's lawyers drag the ordeal out with endless briefs, filings, appeals.

5. Trump uses the whole thing as hate-bait Twitter-fuel to further the hatred of Democrats by Republicans, thus shoring up any who might be getting cold feet. Trump spoon-feeds his fans all the arguments they need to justify continued support, and how they are protecting freedom from illegal search and seizure by protecting President Trump from owning up to his own word to release his taxes.
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The law is clear. When the Ways and Means requests a person's taxes, the IRS shall provide them. There is no fuzziness to take to court. It is just can Trump convince Rettig to break the law.?The court has to see a case before they spend time ruling on it. I see the case rejected for no argument.
 
Nordberg said:
Different subjects. Ways and Means has the power. They do not need probable cause.
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I know you keep saying that shit, but you never tell me where the constitutional amendment or article is that overrides the 4th amendment and gives such power to the Way’s & Means committee. It’s illegal constitutionally for the Congress to make any law that overrides the Constitution without first getting an amendment to the Constitution therefore. Now doesn’t that make perfect sense Nordi buddy?

Are you suggesting that Trump does not give probable cause? Are you really suggesting that?
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For what?

Try and slip in a sliver of honesty in your posts.
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So when your back is against the wall and you have no rational arguments or any credible evidence for your arguments, you resort to insulting me again, right pal? What lie have I ever told you friend?

This whole problem is because Trump shows probable cause about taxes, emoluments, obstruction and other matters. Trump is a walking, talking probable cause.
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But that’s only according to Democrats and other Trump haters and CNN & MSNBC. According to Fox & Mueller & William Barr & Rod Rosenstein, there is NO COLLUSION, NO OBSTRUCTION, and now NO PROBABLE CAUSE is apparent to anybody except the left and their propaganda media machine. If you or they had anything even close to probable cause, you & they would be shouting it from the roof tops!!!!!
 
Nordberg said:
The law is clear. When the Ways and Means requests a person's taxes, the IRS shall provide them. There is no fuzziness to take to court. It is just can Trump convince Rettig to break the law.?The court has to see a case before they spend time ruling on it. I see the case rejected for no argument.
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The law has no constitutional teeth! It's unconstitutional. Trump will keep it in the courts all the way to the Supreme Court where there are 5 Republican Judges and 4 Democrats. Good luck with your unconstitutional hopes and dreams old pal!!!
 
BTW, I do believe there is a clause about probable cause in that unconstitutional law. If you ever find the text, it'd be good to post it.
 
Nordberg said:
The law is clear. When the Ways and Means requests a person's taxes, the IRS shall provide them. There is no fuzziness to take to court. It is just can Trump convince Rettig to break the law.?The court has to see a case before they spend time ruling on it. I see the case rejected for no argument.
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The topic is that the CONSTITUTION protects Trump tax returns. And, I don't think you're so stupid and ignorant (but I could be wrong) to think a law trumps the Constitution. I think you're just a lying, lawless ashole rather than so stupid and ignorant. Maybe you could settle this for me?
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello Nordberg,



Who is supposed to enforce that?

The way I see it going down is this:

1. Mnuchin and Rettig both refuse to turn over the taxes.

2. House issues subpeona for them.

3. Trump files lawsuit, gets an injunction, sends the whole thing into a court battle.

4. Trump's lawyers drag the ordeal out with endless briefs, filings, appeals.

5. Trump uses the whole thing as hate-bait Twitter-fuel to further the hatred of Democrats by Republicans, thus shoring up any who might be getting cold feet. Trump spoon-feeds his fans all the arguments they need to justify continued support, and how they are protecting freedom from illegal search and seizure by protecting President Trump from owning up to his own word to release his taxes.
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I believe they have the power to arrest Rettig if he refuses. They do not have to go to court. The law he violated exists and has punishments.
 
Nordberg said:
I believe they have the power to arrest Rettig if he refuses. They do not have to go to court. The law he violated exists and has punishments.
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The Congress has no power to arrest anybody! There only power is oversight, to recommend indictments to the Justice Department or take people to court for "contempt of Congress." Dream on fellow traveler!!!!
 
Hello Nordberg,

Nordberg said:
The law is clear. When the Ways and Means requests a person's taxes, the IRS shall provide them. There is no fuzziness to take to court. It is just can Trump convince Rettig to break the law.?The court has to see a case before they spend time ruling on it. I see the case rejected for no argument.
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I guess we will find out. I just don't know what actual LEO agency is supposed to force their way into the IRS buildings at what point in this process and retrieve the tax forms by force to back up this rule of law.

Laws are meaningless if there is no enforcement.
 
Angry right-wing children: the power of ways and means is not in conflict with the 4th amendment. Trump's taxes have to be turned over like anyone else's would have to be. You Trumpys believe as he does, the laws do not apply to Trump. He, like you, will find out the hard way.
This whole silly argument is about a desperate attempt to avoid justice. If Trump pays for his crimes, America will be better for it.
 
Nordberg said:
Angry right-wing children: the power of ways and means is not in conflict with the 4th amendment. Trump's taxes have to be turned over like anyone else's would have to be. You Trumpys believe as he does, the laws do not apply to Trump. He, like you, will find out the hard way.
This whole silly argument is about a desperate attempt to avoid justice. If Trump pays for his crimes, America will be better for it.
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You poor deranged anti-Trump dumbsht, how does this not conflict with the 4th Amendment? Saying everyone else has to do it just shows you're a dumbsht. That's not an explanation. Anyone should have the right to prevent the IRS releasing their return without reasonable cause. The Dems pathetic fishing expedition is not reasonable cause.
 
Hello Nordberg,

Nordberg said:
I believe they have the power to arrest Rettig if he refuses. They do not have to go to court. The law he violated exists and has punishments.
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Who is going to do that arrest? The FBI? President Trump hand-picked the director. That would be like asking to get fired.
 
Bobb said:
You poor deranged anti-Trump dumbsht, how does this not conflict with the 4th Amendment? Saying everyone else has to do it just shows you're a dumbsht. That's not an explanation. Anyone should have the right to prevent the IRS releasing their return without reasonable cause. The Dems pathetic fishing expedition is not reasonable cause.
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You name calling child. That is most of what this thread is about. Can you read with a scrap of concentration? This is not about the IRS releasing Trump's taxes to the public. Trump promised to do that many times. Read slowly, it is about the Ways and Means Committee seeing his taxes as part of the investigative powers that the constitution grants. They have that power. If the IRS Comm. Rettig refuses, he is subject to losing his position, a 10 K fine and up to 5 years in jail.
 
Nordberg said:
You name calling child. That is most of what this thread is about. Can you read with a scrap of concentration? This is not about the IRS releasing Trump's taxes to the public. Trump promised to do that many times. Read slowly, it is about the Ways and Means Committee seeing his taxes as part of the investigative powers that the constitution grants. They have that power. If the IRS Comm. Rettig refuses, he is subject to losing his position, a 10 K fine and up to 5 years in jail.
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Faggot, Congress has no right to anyone's personal documents without reasonable cause.
 
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