The Death of Dilbert and False Claims of White Victimhood

Nordberg said:
Pollsters by and large are working very hard to get it right. There are some with a bit if slant, but the ones with the best predictions get the most work. It is a for-profit business. 538 is the one that sends me daily emails. Their bias is to survive as a business.
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538 is a compiler of polls and not a pollster itself. Nate Silver is a numbers guy. 538 is predicated upon the idea that if you average enough polling on a particular person or issue, you come closer to an accurate reading of the public.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
538 is a compiler of polls and not a pollster itself. Nate Silver is a numbers guy. 538 is predicated upon the idea that if you average enough polling on a particular person or issue, you come closer to an accurate reading of the public.
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It works. His polls are the most accurate. I get an email from 538 every day.
 
Nordberg said:
Pollsters by and large are working very hard to get it right.
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False. Pollsters, just as in any other business, are concerned with the bottom line. If you don't believe me, go to one of their board meetings.

The appeal to the target market before the election/event is the sale; after the election/event it is too late. They concern themselves more with the wording of the poll questions than with the fidelity of the predictions after the fact.

When Donald Trump won in 2016, it was predicted by zero polls. It was then that we all saw that polls make zero effort to get it right. Not a single one wanted to be seen predicting Donald Trump winning, because they were worried about the money, not the results.

Polls sell hope, not financial advice. Their survival as businesses do not depend on their track record.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
That's why the RWers denigrate him. Guess they don't understand that his numbers include those from their beloved Rasmussen and from Fox as well as all the others.
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I thought Silver had totally fallen out of favor with many on the left? This article is several years old but I don’t think it was the only one. I follow him on Twitter, and while Twitter certainly isn’t the real world, he often gets crushed on there by liberals saying he’s a shill, a blow hard, even a conservative.

https://newrepublic.com/article/155761/fall-nate-silver
 
cawacko said:
I thought Silver had totally fallen out of favor with many on the left? This article is several years old but I don’t think it was the only one. I follow him on Twitter, and while Twitter certainly isn’t the real world, he often gets crushed on there by liberals saying he’s a shill, a blow hard, even a conservative.

https://newrepublic.com/article/155761/fall-nate-silver
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Maybe try reading the articles on fiftythirtyeight.com instead of the gossipy stuff on Twitter? BTW he's a sports- and odds-figuring/betting fanatic and has a great following there as well. He's a numbers guy, as I said. I trust numbers guys. So much so that I share my pillow with one every night. ;)
 
cawacko said:
I thought Silver had totally fallen out of favor with many on the left? This article is several years old but I don’t think it was the only one. I follow him on Twitter, and while Twitter certainly isn’t the real world, he often gets crushed on there by liberals saying he’s a shill, a blow hard, even a conservative.

https://newrepublic.com/article/155761/fall-nate-silver
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Truth tellers always fall out of favor with political extremists. Look at James Comey; He did the right thing and told the truth twice. Both sides hate him for it.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
Maybe try reading the articles on fiftythirtyeight.com instead of the gossipy stuff on Twitter? BTW he's a sports- and odds-figuring/betting fanatic and has a great following there as well. He's a numbers guy, as I said. I trust numbers guys. So much so that I share my pillow with one every night. ;)
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I read some his work and I have no dog in the fight as to liking him or not. I just remember him being persona non grata on the left, at least for a period of time, so it was interesting to hear the comment that the right doesn’t like him.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post

Again, whining that "I can't read my favorite comic anymore" is just that...selfish, indifferent whining from people ASSURED that they are not the target of Adams rants.
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In the general elections, I probably vote for the same candidates that you do.
In my personal life, I have not advocated in favor of bigotry against anybody.

However, before I go all in on making your problems my problems, please enlighten me on what you've done for me and mine lately.
I marched with Dr. King when I was eighteen years old in 1965.
Tell me about your efforts on behalf of the Italian Anti Defamation League.

And for what it's worth, I don't remember the last time that I myself saw a Dilbert cartoon.
We're talking principles here.

You appear to be too smart to becoming a walking stereotype, Tach, but you're sure working on it anyway.
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- Your voting record is irrelevant to the topic of discussion at hand.

- I didn't accuse you of anything to the contrary. I addressed what you said regarding how removal of Dilbert affects its fans.

- I have not advocated, insinuated or alluded to enforcing problems on you. Again, I addressed what you said regarding how removal of Dilbert affects its fans. I see that as trivial when compared to the historical evidence of how prominent figures advocating racism can result in bias business actions and/or racial violence. How you come to the conclusion that what happened to Adams requires me to "do something" for you is beyond rational thinking.

- That's nice....I was 7 years old at the time.

- They came around when I was 12. My Pop, a NYC Homicide detective, would not have been keen on advocating for an organization started by the lawyer for the Colombo crime family....nor would any of his fellow Italian cops at the time.

- And I was not a fan, nor do I understand it's amazing success (although I found the cartoon funny). But what you originally stated was NOT based on your personal approval.

- Ahh, principals. Explain to the reading audience how it would be a positive "principal" to maintain support of a product while it's creator advocates racist ideology. Remember, American businesses like IBM and individuals like Grandpa Bush (of the presidential Bush relative) were doing brisk business with Nazi Germany until the American gov't shut that down...a matter of PRINCIPAL. Maybe you should revisit the fall from grace of Charles Lindbergh for his personal version and advocacy of nazi-ism....matters of principal and all, you know.

- You keep trying to portray me as something that you cannot support via the chronology of the posts. You seem to be projecting some here, kid. A pity.
 
zymurgy said:
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post
You have a bias, that means your poll is inaccurate and worthless, the B grade non-with-standing
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you are too stupid to continue this with

I give you an F grade
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translation: zymurgy's MAGA mook mentality allows him to accept a polling company with a proven bias in its conclusions...as stated by an assessment company's management personnel that zymurgy touted.

Typical insipid MAGA stubbornness. No wonder Trump loves to wipe his feet on these fools.
 
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Taichiliberal said:
- Your voting record is irrelevant to the topic of discussion at hand.

- I didn't accuse you of anything to the contrary. I addressed what you said regarding how removal of Dilbert affects its fans.

- I have not advocated, insinuated or alluded to enforcing problems on you. Again, I addressed what you said regarding how removal of Dilbert affects its fans. I see that as trivial when compared to the historical evidence of how prominent figures advocating racism can result in bias business actions and/or racial violence. How you come to the conclusion that what happened to Adams requires me to "do something" for you is beyond rational thinking.

- That's nice....I was 7 years old at the time.

- They came around when I was 12. My Pop, a NYC Homicide detective, would not have been keen on advocating for an organization started by the lawyer for the Colombo crime family....nor would any of his fellow Italian cops at the time.

- And I was not a fan, nor do I understand it's amazing success (although I found the cartoon funny). But what you originally stated was NOT based on your personal approval.

- Ahh, principals. Explain to the reading audience how it would be a positive "principal" to maintain support of a product while it's creator advocates racist ideology. Remember, American businesses like IBM and individuals like Grandpa Bush (of the presidential Bush relative) were doing brisk business with Nazi Germany until the American gov't shut that down...a matter of PRINCIPAL. Maybe you should revisit the fall from grace of Charles Lindbergh for his personal version and advocacy of nazi-ism....matters of principal and all, you know.

- You keep trying to portray me as something that you cannot support via the chronology of the posts. You seem to be projecting some here, kid. A pity.
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I've just shared my view, Tach.
It's not the biggest issue to me.
Absent our own discussion, I may have forgotten completely about it by now.

I wish you no ill will whatsoever. I hope you at least believe that much.

It's probably impossible for different eyes from different places to see everything the exact same way.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post
- Your voting record is irrelevant to the topic of discussion at hand.

- I didn't accuse you of anything to the contrary. I addressed what you said regarding how removal of Dilbert affects its fans.

- I have not advocated, insinuated or alluded to enforcing problems on you. Again, I addressed what you said regarding how removal of Dilbert affects its fans. I see that as trivial when compared to the historical evidence of how prominent figures advocating racism can result in bias business actions and/or racial violence. How you come to the conclusion that what happened to Adams requires me to "do something" for you is beyond rational thinking.

- That's nice....I was 7 years old at the time.

- They came around when I was 12. My Pop, a NYC Homicide detective, would not have been keen on advocating for an organization started by the lawyer for the Colombo crime family....nor would any of his fellow Italian cops at the time.

- And I was not a fan, nor do I understand it's amazing success (although I found the cartoon funny). But what you originally stated was NOT based on your personal approval.

- Ahh, principals. Explain to the reading audience how it would be a positive "principal" to maintain support of a product while it's creator advocates racist ideology. Remember, American businesses like IBM and individuals like Grandpa Bush (of the presidential Bush relative) were doing brisk business with Nazi Germany until the American gov't shut that down...a matter of PRINCIPAL. Maybe you should revisit the fall from grace of Charles Lindbergh for his personal version and advocacy of nazi-ism....matters of principal and all, you know.

- You keep trying to portray me as something that you cannot support via the chronology of the posts. You seem to be projecting some here, kid. A pity.
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I've just shared my view, Tach.
It's not the biggest issue to me.
Absent our own discussion, I may have forgotten completely about it by now.

I wish you no ill will whatsoever. I hope you at least believe that much.

It's probably impossible for different eyes from different places to see everything the exact same way.
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Now you're copping out instead of just conceding a point that you logically cannot defend your original contentions ... much less the other things you've put forth here. A pity.
 
Taichiliberal said:
Now you're copping out instead of just conceding a point that you logically cannot defend your original contentions ... much less the other things you've put forth here. A pity.
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I don't care how old you were at any particular time.
Is there a good reason for me to care about that?

I feel that I've done more for you, even if it's been admittedly very little, than you've done for me.
If, in fact, I'm wrong about that, which is theoretically possible, I suppose,
then I'll just have to live with that misconception.

I'm sorry that we don't understand one another, but from my perspective, this discussion ends here.
It's passed its expiration date with no positive result for either of us.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post
Now you're copping out instead of just conceding a point that you logically cannot defend your original contentions ... much less the other things you've put forth here. A pity.
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I don't care how old you were at any particular time.
Is there a good reason for me to care about that?

I feel that I've done more for you, even if it's been admittedly very little, than you've done for me.
If, in fact, I'm wrong about that, which is theoretically possible, I suppose,
then I'll just have to live with that misconception.

I'm sorry that we don't understand one another, but from my perspective, this discussion ends here.
It's passed its expiration date with no positive result for either of us.
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1- A absurd response by you.....just what would you expect a 7 year old to do at that time?

2 - Well, since YOU injected the event and date into the conversation, it should be noted to the readers that any comparison to me would not be rational. Besides, it's no justification for the assertion you originally made and are trying 6 ways to Sunday to defend against my critique. Essentially, this particular bit of information is irrelevant to this discussion.

3 - So, advocating for civil rights for all isn't enough...YOU EXPECT EQUAL COMPENSATION IN SOME FORM. But since in my lifetime there weren't Italian "Jim Crow" laws, or "driving while Italian" arrests (or murders) through out the country ... well, you get the picture. Mind you, in my college days I successfully advocated with others to eliminate some "jokes" at Italians expense that were made during audio/video projects....does that count?

4 - There lies the rub, Nifty....I CAN'T AFFORD TO "LIVE WITH" ADAMS GETTING AWAY WITH HIS RACIST ADVOCACY WHILE MAKING MILLIONS IN A PUBLIC VENUE...eventually, it affects me and mine (sometimes violently), as history has shown. Maybe you can, but I can't.

5 - Oh I understand you all too well...you just don't like having your subconscious peccadillos laid out in public and deconstructed. More to the point, you become insipidly stubborn about it, yet think you're clever enough to obscure that point. Sorry, but the chronology of the posts won't let you.

6 - You said as much a post or two earlier....but it seems you just want the last word of denial and left handed reiteration. So be it.
 
cawacko said:
I read some his work and I have no dog in the fight as to liking him or not. I just remember him being persona non grata on the left, at least for a period of time, so it was interesting to hear the comment that the right doesn’t like him.
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I don't recall that at all. When was he persona non grata and for what?
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
I don't recall that at all. When was he persona non grata and for what?
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I can't claim to closely follow every move he makes but I thought it started with Trump winning in 2016 and him not seeing it and then articles started coming out about him not being this guru and now people on Twitter saying he's a right-wing shill and so forth.

It's definitely possible to have people on the right and left dislike you. Wouldn't be the first time for someone. But that's why your comment caught my attention.


Nate Silver is a Dart Throwing Chimp

How Big Data missed the rise of Trump

https://medium.com/olson-zaltman/nate-silver-is-a-dart-throwing-chimp-404743336ac6



The Fall of Nate Silver

https://newrepublic.com/article/155761/fall-nate-silver


Behind Nate Silver’s war with The New York Times

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/08/15/nate-silver-new-york-times-1461666
 
cawacko said:
...It's definitely possible to have people on the right and left dislike you. Wouldn't be the first time for someone. But that's why your comment caught my attention....
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Agreed 100% as political extremists on JPP prove daily. Anyone caught telling the unvarnished truth about both sides quickly becomes the enemy of both sides.

They hate "fence sitters" AKA centrists and moderates. They are stupid and extreme enough to believe that, by attacking moderates, they can bully the moderates to join them. Sad, but true.
 
Taichiliberal said:
translation: zymurgy's MAGA mook mentality allows him to accept a polling company with a proven bias in its conclusions...as stated by an assessment company's management personnel that zymurgy touted.

Typical insipid MAGA stubbornness. No wonder Trump loves to wipe his feet on these fools.
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translation - you are a barely functioning retard.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-death-of-polling-is-greatly-exaggerated/

First, let’s give a shout-out to the pollsters with the lowest average error. Those were AtlasIntel (2.2 percentage points), Trafalgar Group (2.6 points), Rasmussen Reports/Pulse Opinion Research (2.8 points), Harris Insights & Analytics (3.3 points) and Opinion Savvy/InsiderAdvantage (3.5 points).
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