Vicious Political Movement

Read the whole of the post. She said, "I understand that this is for care further on...."

I assumed she was speaking of Emergency Care because of that post. You assumed I was talking about all care because you just wanted to. You don't want to admit it, because it is embarrassing, but it is what happened. Then Cypress attempted to come to your rescue as now did BAC. All pretending that context doesn't exist.

Damo, I am not embarrassed. I have no idea what you are talking about with that.

You use this debate tactic, which you admit is a debate tactic, and now you want to not only play the victim, but claim that I am embarrassed? LOL. You'll have to go a lot further to embarrass me. I was angry momentarily, and still am a little.

This is an important issue. It's real. It's not funny. It's not a joke. It's not something to BS about.

But embarrassed because you used the same "technique" you use every day here? Yeah, ok.
 
I don't think "yes she would get care" was an adequate answer. That's all.

No, she wouldn't get care - care as I define it. She would get stablized. But, without insurance, I doubt they would do much in the way of diagnostics, clinical care, etc.
I honestly thought she was just talking about Emergency Care. Whether you thought it was accurate enough it was what I had time to say at that second...

I had somebody asking me a question at my desk.
 
Damo, I am not embarrassed. I have no idea what you are talking about with that.

You use this debate tactic, which you admit is a debate tactic, and now you want to not only play the victim, but claim that I am embarrassed? LOL. You'll have to go a lot further to embarrass me. I was angry momentarily, and still am a little.

This is an important issue. It's real. It's not funny. It's not a joke. It's not something to BS about.

But embarrassed because you used the same "technique" you use every day here? Yeah, ok.
Okay. I was again doing.. what do you call it? Oh, yes. "Projecting".

I get embarrassed when I am that wrong in an assumption. When I place myself in another's shoes or "Project", as you call it, I tend to use how I would feel in your place. It's all good if you are not embarrassed. I would be.
 
"I don’t know about you, but I think American children who need medical care should get it, period. Even if you think adults have made bad choices — a baseless smear in the case of the Frosts, but put that on one side — only a truly vicious political movement would respond by punishing their injured children."

Sliming Graeme Frost
By PAUL KRUGMAN
Two weeks ago, the Democratic response to President Bush’s weekly radio address was delivered by a 12-year-old, Graeme Frost. Graeme, who along with his sister received severe brain injuries in a 2004 car crash and continues to need physical therapy, is a beneficiary of the State Children’s Health Insurance Program. Mr. Bush has vetoed a bipartisan bill that would have expanded that program to cover millions of children who would otherwise have been uninsured.

What followed should serve as a teaching moment.

First, some background. The Frosts and their four children are exactly the kind of people S-chip was intended to help: working Americans who can’t afford private health insurance.

The parents have a combined income of about $45,000, and don’t receive health insurance from employers. When they looked into buying insurance on their own before the accident, they found that it would cost $1,200 a month — a prohibitive sum given their income. After the accident, when their children needed expensive care, they couldn’t get insurance at any price.

Fortunately, they received help from Maryland’s S-chip program. The state has relatively restrictive rules for eligibility: children must come from a family with an income under 200 percent of the poverty line. For families with four children that’s $55,220, so the Frosts clearly qualified.

Graeme Frost, then, is exactly the kind of child the program is intended to help. But that didn’t stop the right from mounting an all-out smear campaign against him and his family.

Soon after the radio address, right-wing bloggers began insisting that the Frosts must be affluent because Graeme and his sister attend private schools (they’re on scholarship), because they have a house in a neighborhood where some houses are now expensive (the Frosts bought their house for $55,000 in 1990 when the neighborhood was rundown and considered dangerous) and because Mr. Frost owns a business (it was dissolved in 1999).

You might be tempted to say that bloggers make unfounded accusations all the time. But we’re not talking about some obscure fringe. The charge was led by Michelle Malkin, who according to Technorati has the most-trafficked right-wing blog on the Internet, and in addition to blogging has a nationally syndicated column, writes for National Review and is a frequent guest on Fox News.

The attack on Graeme’s family was also quickly picked up by Rush Limbaugh, who is so important a player in the right-wing universe that he has had multiple exclusive interviews with Vice President Dick Cheney.

And G.O.P. politicians were eager to join in the smear. The New York Times reported that Republicans in Congress “were gearing up to use Graeme as evidence that Democrats have overexpanded the health program to include families wealthy enough to afford private insurance” but had “backed off” as the case fell apart.

In fact, however, Republicans had already made their first move: an e-mail message from the office of Mitch McConnell, the Senate minority leader, sent to reporters and obtained by the Web site Think Progress, repeated the smears against the Frosts and asked: “Could the Dems really have done that bad of a job vetting this family?”

And the attempt to spin the media worked, to some extent: despite reporting that has thoroughly debunked the smears, a CNN report yesterday suggested that the Democrats had made “a tactical error in holding up Graeme as their poster child,” and closely echoed the language of the e-mail from Mr. McConnell’s office.

All in all, the Graeme Frost case is a perfect illustration of the modern right-wing political machine at work, and in particular its routine reliance on character assassination in place of honest debate. If service members oppose a Republican war, they’re “phony soldiers”; if Michael J. Fox opposes Bush policy on stem cells, he’s faking his Parkinson’s symptoms; if an injured 12-year-old child makes the case for a government health insurance program, he’s a fraud.

Meanwhile, leading conservative politicians, far from trying to distance themselves from these smears, rush to embrace them. And some people in the news media are still willing to be used as patsies.

Politics aside, the Graeme Frost case demonstrates the true depth of the health care crisis: every other advanced country has universal health insurance, but in America, insurance is now out of reach for many hard-working families, even if they have incomes some might call middle-class.

And there’s one more point that should not be forgotten: ultimately, this isn’t about the Frost parents. It’s about Graeme Frost and his sister.

I don’t know about you, but I think American children who need medical care should get it, period. Even if you think adults have made bad choices — a baseless smear in the case of the Frosts, but put that on one side — only a truly vicious political movement would respond by punishing their injured children.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/12/opinion/12krugman.html?_r=1&hp=&oref=slogin&pagewanted=print

1200 per month is preposterous. there is no way in hell that was the cost for 2 children with no prior medical condition..
 
Okay. I was again doing.. what do you call it? Oh, yes. "Projecting".

I get embarrassed when I am that wrong in an assumption. When I place myself in another's shoes or "Project", as you call it, I tend to use how I would feel in your place. It's all good if you are not embarrassed. I would be.

LOL Why would I be embarrassed, because you once again made one claim, and then spent an entire thread backpeddling from it?
 
LOL Why would I be embarrassed, because you once again made one claim, and then spent an entire thread backpeddling from it?
I did not. The post was accurate. The person would receive care. I should have put in "Emergency" in retrospect, but I thought people would read her post that spoke to that. Instead I got incorrect assumptive opinion "given" me that didn't exist.

Had I made that assumption I would have been embarrassed about being so wrong. As I said, that was 'projection' as you are so fond of calling it. It's okay if you don't get embarrassed when you are wrong. I know that I would. I am certainly not embarrassed about posting that comment, nor have I "backpedalled" from it. It is a true statement.

I also note, that later clarification of who ends up paying when the person cannot pay themselves was also skipped over.
 
I think its that message board Maineman and I went to a while back.

I don't know if you remember me telling you: its the one where I was threatened with banning within the first ten minutes of logging on, because my handle was GeorgeWChimp lol

They're a tad sensitive about their hero over there!

I can only imagine that lame, bush-loving reason why Care got banned

Yes, you got it! I have been harrassed with vile and vulgar pm's from a moderator no less, since I have been there....

I made mention to the vile pm he had just sent me and the 3 reps he had shot at me in a row in a post, and indirectly at that, I released NO personal content at all that this Moderator said to me in pm's and reps and the next thing ya know ZAPPED....banned. Desh and I are over there playing around, maineman, and Damo too every once in a while...and some of the other newer posters on this site are over there too.... I am not under Care4all there though. ;)

It's a joke that someone LIKE ME would be banned from any message board, I am not at all the devisive type person, or troll that should be banned, couldn't be IF I EVEN WANTED TO BE....but.... I think I am the only person that has been banned out of all of the vulgar people there....at least in the last 4 months...:dunno: :dunno: :dunno:

Care
 
Yes, you got it! I have been harrassed with vile and vulgar pm's from a moderator no less, since I have been there....

I made mention to the vile pm he had just sent me and the 3 reps he had shot at me in a row in a post, and indirectly at that, I released NO personal content at all that this Moderator said to me in pm's and reps and the next thing ya know ZAPPED....banned. Desh and I are over there playing around, maineman, and Damo too every once in a while...and some of the other newer posters on this site are over there too.... I am not under Care4all there though. ;)

It's a joke that someone LIKE ME would be banned from any message board, I am not at all the devisive type person, or troll that should be banned, couldn't be IF I EVEN WANTED TO BE....but.... I think I am the only person that has been banned out of all of the vulgar people there....at least in the last 4 months...:dunno: :dunno: :dunno:

Care
I think they work to find ways to ban liberals on that site. There is a comfort zone for them. I like the people, but sometimes saw a bias that is unalterable or even arguable.

The guy who owns this site built USMessageboard. I was nearly banned there when I first came on because I was arguing against banning gay marriage, and against wars that are not formally declared.
 
I think they work to find ways to ban liberals on that site. There is a comfort zone for them. I like the people, but sometimes saw a bias that is unalterable or even arguable.

The guy who owns this site built USMessageboard. I was nearly banned there when I first came on because I was arguing against banning gay marriage, and against wars that are not formally declared.

yeah Damo, they look for reasons to ban liberals, they do not believe in free speech whatsoever. Then this particular moderator taunts me over and over again....it was his ammo, to get me to say something about the intimidation and harrassment on to me, so that he could then ban me.

yes, Jim can be whacko sometimes and then sweet as pie on other times??? And I finally found Sir Evil after he left this site last year....not knowing he was Jim's brother!!!

Care
 
yeah Damo, they look for reasons to ban liberals, they do not believe in free speech whatsoever. Then this particular moderator taunts me over and over again....it was his ammo, to get me to say something about the intimidation and harrassment on to me, so that he could then ban me.

yes, Jim can be whacko sometimes and then sweet as pie on other times??? And I finally found Sir Evil after he left this site last year....not knowing he was Jim's brother!!!

Care

You "finally found" Sir Evil?? You make it sound as if anyone would be looking for that dick? Care I worry about you. lol
 
Seriously tho. Nobody finds it odd that they are claiming it costs 1200 to insure these kids with no prior medical condition? I understand they are the victims of the system here but shouldn't the parents be held accountable for being irresponsible?
 
You "finally found" Sir Evil?? You make it sound as if anyone would be looking for that dick? Care I worry about you. lol

LONG story Darla....

in short, I thought he left here because of me and spats....Damo, would not tell me where he went cuz SE didn't want anyone to know, I think....?

I just wanted to see if it was me that insulted and infuriated him enough to leave, and as a Christian, that nagged at me...at my inner self.

turns out it was MM and not me. :shock:

Care
 
Seriously tho. Nobody finds it odd that they are claiming it costs 1200 to insure these kids with no prior medical condition? I understand they are the victims of the system here but shouldn't the parents be held accountable for being irresponsible?


they found that it would cost $1,200 a month —


It doesn't say that the monthly premium is 1200. It says their cost would be 1200.

For a family, if you factor in deductibles, co-pays, premiums, fees, perscription drugs, it could come out to $1200.
 
they found that it would cost $1,200 a month —


It doesn't say that the monthly premium is 1200. It says their cost would be 1200.

For a family, if you factor in deductibles, co-pays, premiums, fees, perscription drugs, it could come out to $1200.
Not even for my family does it cost that much. I carried my own insurance for a bit when changing companies, it does not cost that much and that is with three kids.
 
Not even for my family does it cost that much. I carried my own insurance for a bit when changing companies, it does not cost that much and that is with three kids.
your area damo, has some of the cheapest healthcare costs in america...saw a program about it....while the northeast has some of the most expensive, for the exact same procedures, many times double. Something's not right!

care
 
your area damo, has some of the cheapest healthcare costs in america...saw a program about it....while the northeast has some of the most expensive, for the exact same procedures, many times double. Something's not right!

care

Doesn't the northeast have the most expensive everything?
 
your area damo, has some of the cheapest healthcare costs in america...saw a program about it....while the northeast has some of the most expensive, for the exact same procedures, many times double. Something's not right!

care

Liberal Northeast.... moderate Mountain states... hmmm... what could be the difference? Just to salt the wound a bit... we also get by with a flat tax on income. A whopping 4.63%.

;)
 
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