APP - 'What We Owe to Each Other'

USFREEDOM911 said:
Apple feels that anyone who isn't working, or is working and not earning what they "should", deserves to be compensated for the difference of what they need.
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ok, i ask you this, if someone is unemployed or underemployed due to an economic downturn, do you advocate that they should lose most if all of their savings and their home or should unemployment insurance really cover what a person has lost in the way of income (less what they save by not working)

in a capitalist world, the answer is the first case because it keeps wages down

in a more humane world, the answer is the second case because it helps keep workers and their families afloat
 
Don Quixote said:
ok, i ask you this, if someone is unemployed or underemployed due to an economic downturn, do you advocate that they should lose most if all of their savings and their home or should unemployment insurance really cover what a person has lost in the way of income (less what they save by not working)

in a capitalist world, the answer is the first case because it keeps wages down

in a more humane world, the answer is the second case because it helps keep workers and their families afloat
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You're talking about unemployment, which is paid for, and Apple is talking about a "gimmie".

Two different situations.
 
USFREEDOM911 said:
So the people out of work aren't obligated to owe anything?
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It depends on what you mean by "owe". If one is unemployed and living well off investments then, sure, they owe. If one is unemployed and in poverty they certainly don't owe money. They do "owe" equal time should the community face a disaster and require the assistance of everyone.
 
USFREEDOM911 said:
You're talking about unemployment, which is paid for, and Apple is talking about a "gimmie".

Two different situations.
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whether it is an insurance program paid for by the employer and employee or provided by the government is only material in that the employer and employee would not have as much incentive to prevent the job loss

perhaps what would be best would be a combination of the three so everyone has a vested interest in the economy
 
apple0154 said:
It depends on what you mean by "owe". If one is unemployed and living well off investments then, sure, they owe. If one is unemployed and in poverty they certainly don't owe money. They do "owe" equal time should the community face a disaster and require the assistance of everyone.
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But only during a disaster!! :good4u:

And if they don't put in that "equal time"??
 
Don Quixote said:
whether it is an insurance program paid for by the employer and employee or provided by the government is only material in that the employer and employee would not have as much incentive to prevent the job loss

perhaps what would be best would be a combination of the three so everyone has a vested interest in the economy
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You're not going to stop job loss; because you can't control the employeers behavior or that of the employee.
Plus there is very little control over the job market; because there are so many variables.
We can learn what not to do; but it doesn't prepare us for what we haven't thought of.
 
USFREEDOM911 said:
You're talking about unemployment, which is paid for, and Apple is talking about a "gimmie".

Two different situations.
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That can be easily resolved by either an increase in taxes or a different allotment of tax dollars. Unemployment contributions are like a tax. It's everyone contributing to a social program.

The problem is all the taxes are used and nothing put aside to help the average citizen in need and this is what Obama and ObamaCare is addressing.

The military is one of the biggest "gimmie(s)" around. Also, if towns can rip out perfectly good street lamps and rip up perfectly good sidewalks to "freshen up" Main Street it can ensure every citizen has the basic necessities. It has little to do with a lack of funds and a lot to do with thinking someone is getting something for nothing.
 
apple0154 said:
That can be easily resolved by either an increase in taxes or a different allotment of tax dollars. Unemployment contributions are like a tax. It's everyone contributing to a social program.

The problem is all the taxes are used and nothing put aside to help the average citizen in need and this is what Obama and ObamaCare is addressing.

The military is one of the biggest "gimmie(s)" around. Also, if towns can rip out perfectly good street lamps and rip up perfectly good sidewalks to "freshen up" Main Street it can ensure every citizen has the basic necessities. It has little to do with a lack of funds and a lot to do with thinking someone is getting something for nothing.
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Translation:
Busy ants giving to lazy grasshoppers
/translation
 
USFREEDOM911 said:
But only during a disaster!! :good4u:

And if they don't put in that "equal time"??
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It depends on what the equal time involves. For example, a hundred years ago most people lived out their lives in one place. In a small community if a road needed built the people would get together and do it or they might build a community center. Others would supply food for the workers.

Today, projects are done by professionals and most citizens contribute through financial means.
 
USFREEDOM911 said:
Translation:
Busy ants giving to lazy grasshoppers
/translation
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Healthy, happy people are not lazy. The very first thing the unemployed require is a full medical check-up. Start there. Then a counselling session to help them adjust to unemployment. Make a budget. Plan ahead. Many people wait until they are behind in house payments before they put their home up for sale. Once the bank moves in they lose any equity they had as the bank is only interested in selling it for the amount owed.

Perhaps a resume service provided by the unemployment office. A refresher course on how to apply for a job for people who haven't had to look for a job in 20 years. In short: Help.
 
apple0154 said:
It depends on what the equal time involves. For example, a hundred years ago most people lived out their lives in one place. In a small community if a road needed built the people would get together and do it or they might build a community center. Others would supply food for the workers.

Today, projects are done by professionals and most citizens contribute through financial means.
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That wasn't what I asked you. :palm:
 
apple0154 said:
Healthy, happy people are not lazy. The very first thing the unemployed require is a full medical check-up. Start there. Then a counselling session to help them adjust to unemployment. Make a budget. Plan ahead. Many people wait until they are behind in house payments before they put their home up for sale. Once the bank moves in they lose any equity they had as the bank is only interested in selling it for the amount owed.

Perhaps a resume service provided by the unemployment office. A refresher course on how to apply for a job for people who haven't had to look for a job in 20 years. In short: Help.
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You seem to believe that there is no help; but the truth is, all unemployment offices have classes in resume writing, interviews, help with job searches, comparable jobs, and such.
But then you only have Canadian services to relate to. :palm:
 
USFREEDOM911 said:
You seem to believe that there is no help; but the truth is, all unemployment offices have classes in resume writing, interviews, help with job searches, comparable jobs, and such.
But then you only have Canadian services to relate to. :palm:
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Counselling sessions? How to approach the bank to renegotiate a mortgage? Budget classes offering ideas on refinancing so an individuaol can take some equity out of their home to tide them over the unemployed period?

Times have changed. Being unemployed is not a temporary thing anymore. There has to be long term strategies explained to the unemployed.

A more comprehensive approach. Who can argue against that?
 
apple0154 said:
"It depends on what the equal time involves." If you're not satisfied with my answer clarify what you mean.
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Are you admitting that when you first decided to throw the term out there, that you really didn't have an definition also. :palm:
 
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apple0154 said:
Counselling sessions? How to approach the bank to renegotiate a mortgage? Budget classes offering ideas on refinancing so an individuaol can take some equity out of their home to tide them over the unemployed period?

Times have changed. Being unemployed is not a temporary thing anymore. There has to be long term strategies explained to the unemployed.

A more comprehensive approach. Who can argue against that?
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Are you suggesting that there aren't any information out there, on how to do what you're complaining about?
 
USFREEDOM911 said:
Are you suggesting that there aren't any information out there, on how to do what you're complaining about?
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I'm suggesting a person who recently lost their job may or may not know what information and help is available. The logical thing to do would be to have recently unemployed people attend a class on "Things to do while collecting Pogey."
 
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