Museum of Atheism

[PoliTalker]

Hello evince,

We are a pack animal at heart


Mutually aided survival

The loner had a very low level of survival and reproduction

We NEED each other


Which creates a moral code based on survival


Those that survived to reproduce and populate were those with a better natural propensity to feel compassion for others


That requires a higher brain function

And ability to over ride fright or flight


To think of others first

The survival of the pack over the individuals survival


To work in tandem with other requires higher brain function also


Hence mankind’s brains grew

Those with better survival and reproduction rates had higher brain function


A genetic preference for individuals with higher brain function was inseparable from compassion for others

We are compassionate because we were smart

To be human is to be compassionate


Those with aberrations of the brain that make them in compassionate are flawed humans


It may seem harsh but it is just true



We are born with morals as a species


Most people are mostly good


A few are like saints


And a few are complete rat bastards


Humanity explained

Reminds me of a funky movie I would recommend for anyone who would like some 'light' viewing.

"Caveman" is a fun exploration of an early society and how morals evolved without religion.

It featured Ringo Starr, Shelley Long, and Barbara Bach.

Bach and Starr are married, and they met while filming 'Caveman.'

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Hello Dutch,



I agree. Morality is situational.

Humans living in a society is a situation which produces morality or doesn't endure.

Since humans have already endured for thousands of years in societies, social situations produce morality.

Some have melted down along the way, or been eradicated by others, but every society has a moral code.

The codes may differ, but they exist independent of religion.

How many of those societies have religion or had religion in the past? I'm guessing 100%.

 

[Cypress]

How many of those societies have religion or had religion in the past? I'm guessing 100%.

Jack was only pointing out that Cypress, and I can think of no one else, thinks the Dark Ages was a time of scientific inquiry and the highest ethics the world has seen. If it wasn't for a 1,000 years of Ignorance, we wouldn't be where we are now. Then to validate his claim, he starts naming off Greek Scholars.

If that is your condescending, indirect way of saying I have a keen interest in, and working knowledge of history and historical facts, you are correct.

You literally only know about Plato and Aristotle because the Islamic and Christian scholars of Late Antiquity and the High Middle Ages, took interest in then, reserected them, and continued to produce hand written copies of them thus preserving that knowledge.

Aristotle was practically forgotten in western Europe after the fall of the western Roman empire.

You basically only know about Aristotle and Plato because of Islamic and Christian scholars like Augustine, Averroes, Thomas Aquinas, and the monks who painstakingly preserved the Greek knowledge, because they recognized the value of it.

I am going to criticize religious institutions when they deserve it. And I have the posts to prove it.

But I feel no obligation to join you in leaping to the assumption that religion is always terrible, always evil, and has never, not one single time brought a nanogram of benefit to humanity.

 

[PoliTalker]

Hello Dutch,

LOL Agreed.

I don't get the point of an "Atheist Museum" other than to contradict bullshit museums like Noah's Ark or Jesus riding a dinosaur.


Most societies would simply call it a Museum with a wing on musicians, one for scientists, one for philosophers, etc.

The Smithsonian in Washington DC has a lot of "atheist museums". Not the Native American Museum because that covers Native American religions. https://americanindian.si.edu/

My favorite is the National Air and Space museum. No religious deities are featured except as names on spaceships like "Apollo".

Some of the WWII airplanes became gods in the South Pacific.

 

[evince]

Hello evince,



Reminds me of a funky movie I would recommend for anyone who would like some 'light' viewing.

"Caveman" is a fun exploration of an early society and how morals evolved without religion.

It featured Ringo Starr, Shelley Long, and Barbara Bach.

Bach and Starr are married, and they met while filming 'Caveman.'

Still true

 

[Jack]

If that is your condescending, indirect way of saying I have a keen interest in, and working knowledge of history and historical facts, you are correct.

You literally only know about Plato and Aristotle because the Islamic and Christian scholars of Late Antiquity and the High Middle Ages, took interest in then, reserected them, and continued to produce hand written copies of them thus preserving that knowledge.

Aristotle was practically forgotten in western Europe after the fall of the western Roman empire.

You basically only know about Aristotle and Plato because of Islamic and Christian scholars like Augustine, Averroes, Thomas Aquinas, and the monks who painstakingly preserved the Greek knowledge, because they recognized the value of it.

I am going to criticize religious institutions when they deserve it. And I have the posts to prove it.

But I feel no obligation to join you in leaping to the assumption that religion is always terrible, always evil, and has never, not one single time brought a nanogram of benefit to humanity.

What happened to the knowledge of the Ancients?

Did your 'religion' destroy everything that questioned the new Storyline? After a thousand years, did people think it 'safe' to question The Religious Order?
You are right that, thanks to the Arabs leaving a library in Spain, the wisdom of the Ancients was re-introduced into Europe.

And the only people that could read were the Hierarchy, not the millions of Serfs that were used as slave labor. Part of your 'morality' and 'ethics' provided by the Church.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Why is it some people think their anger at the world is interesting to anyone?

TBH, I strongly doubt they care. They care more about themselves and are simply venting regardless of the consequences to others.

Venting, or displaced aggression, is a typical response by people frustrated in life. It's not the best response, which is confronting the problem in a positive manner, but it's a common one.

https://www.verywellmind.com/what-is-displacement-in-psychology-4587375
Displacement is a psychological defense mechanism in which a person redirects a negative emotion from its original source to a less threatening recipient. A classic example of the defense is displaced aggression.1 If a person is angry but cannot direct their anger toward the source without consequences, they might "take out" their anger on a person or thing that poses less of a risk.

 

[PoliTalker]

Hello Dutch,

Just as most can't comprehend the size of the planet that doesn't stop us from navigating around it or off of it.

I'm still fuzzy on the who Black Hole - Information Theory - Maxwell's Demon thing...and, to be frank, have in interest in the math end of it. OTOH, philosophically, I agree that our Universe is a closed system; nothing gets in or out...which makes the origin of the Primordial Atom a mystery.

If something does get in, such as miracles*, then that's a problem.

So far, except for the theoretical issues with Black Holes, there have been no violations of natural law proven. Lots of magic tricks and misinterpretations plus a few nutjobs, but no miracles. At least not on our level of perception. What, if anything, we perceive or become upon mortal death remains a mystery too.



*miracle - event or act that defies all natural law. The Miracle on the Hudson wasn't a miracle.

The violations are rampant. Watch more science videos. Read more science articles. The universe far beyond Earth is as strange as the continuing discoveries of the tiny:

Scientists Discover 4 New Particles

I see all this kind of stuff and I think: 'Yeah. No way religion/creation explains any of this.'

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Hello Dutch,



Some of the WWII airplanes became gods in the South Pacific.

The Cargo Cult? An interesting study of the results of modern culture intruding upon stone age cultures.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/cargo-cult

cargo cult, any of the religious movements chiefly, but not solely, in Melanesia that exhibit belief in the imminence of a new age of blessing, to be initiated by the arrival of a special “cargo” of goods from supernatural sources—based on the observation by local residents of the delivery of supplies to colonial officials. Tribal divinities, culture heroes, or ancestors may be expected to return with the cargo, or the goods may be expected to come through foreigners, who are sometimes accused of having intercepted material goods intended for the native peoples. If the cargo is expected by ship or plane, symbolic wharves or landing strips and warehouses are sometimes built in preparation, and traditional material resources are abandoned—gardening ceases, and pigs and foodstocks are destroyed. Former customs may be revived or current practices drastically changed, and new social organizations, sometimes imitative of the colonial police or armed forces, initiated.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Hello Dutch,



The violations are rampant. Watch more science videos. Read more science articles. The universe far beyond Earth is as strange as the continuing discoveries of the tiny:

Scientists Discover 4 New Particles

I see all this kind of stuff and I think: 'Yeah. No way religion/creation explains any of this.'

I never claimed it would.

Humans have physical limitations but like building the Pyramids or supercomputers, we can build things greater than ourselves.

 

[Cypress]

How many of those societies have religion or had religion in the past? I'm guessing 100%.

What happened to the knowledge of the Ancients?

Did your 'religion' destroy everything that questioned the new Storyline? After a thousand years, did people think it 'safe' to question The Religious Order?
You are right that, thanks to the Arabs leaving a library in Spain, the wisdom of the Ancients was re-introduced into Europe.

And the only people that could read were the Hierarchy, not the millions of Serfs that were used as slave labor. Part of your 'morality' and 'ethics' provided by the Church.

I understand stand you have a relentless need, a jihad in fact, to assume religion is always wrong, always evil, always terrible, a blight on humanity which has never offered a single, solitary benefit to humanity.

And that is exactly how I knew you were lying your ass off about supposedly being a detached agnostic.


I am actually one of the few genuine agnostics here: I don't choose sides, I don't play on a team, I attempt to be balanced. and I stick to the historical facts as best as I can understand them .

I even have a record of respect for atheistic thought, and have the posts to prove them.

As a matter of interest, what is the source of your unrelenting and highly emotional anti- religion jihad? Traumatized because Mom dragged you unwittingly to some Fundy church?

 

[evince]

Jesus is God and has always existed!

Then why is it hard for you to imagine an existence where matter has always existed and everything that exists is just a result of matter interacting over time


If you accept that something has just always existed


There is No need for the theory of gods

 

[PoliTalker]

Hello Dutch,

How many of those societies have religion or had religion in the past? I'm guessing 100%.

Probably so. It's easier and less scary to go along with the crowd.

I view religion thus:

A long long time ago, humans gathered in groups for mutual benefit. Language developed, and with it, the ability to tell stories.

As humans taught their young to speak a language, the inevitable question came along from the curious young:

"Where did we come from?"

Unable to truthfully answer the question, parents made up a story about a great creator being, just to put an end to the incessant questions.

There was no way for these early humans to know such a thing or verify it, so it went unchallenged.

Those who were told this as children grew up and told their own children the same thing.

Fast forward a few thousand years and presto. We've got religion.

 

[Wolverine]

Most likely, it was a result of quantum fluctuation.

The most popular version of the big bang says that the universe popped into existence from a quantum fluctuation. But since it is more likely for quantum fluctuations to produce simpler things, it is more likely that your solitary brain popped into existence from a quantum fluctuation. (After all, if the big bang could produce a universe filled with billions of brains, producing one brain with false memories is much simpler.)

While most big bang supporters do not actually believe such a conclusion, it is the logical outcome of the theory.

Dr. Jason Lisle, an astrophysicist working at Answers in Genesis, notes that self-refutation is a common defect in nonbiblical worldviews. “If a theory leads to conclusions that are contrary to the theory,” Lisle notes, “then the theory refutes itself. If the big bang were true, it would lead to a conclusion that is not true!”

 

[Wolverine]

Then why is it hard for you to imagine an existence where matter has always existed and everything that exists is just a result of matter interacting over time


If you accept that something has just always existed


There is No need for the theory of gods

I believe in the Biblical creation as it makes the most sense! God Created matter!

 

[Wolverine]

Hello Dutch,



Probably so. It's easier and less scary to go along with the crowd.

I view religion thus:

A long long time ago, humans gathered in groups for mutual benefit. Language developed, and with it, the ability to tell stories.

As humans taught their young to speak a language, the inevitable question came along from the curious young:

"Where did we come from?"

Unable to truthfully answer the question, parents made up a story about a great creator being, just to put an end to the incessant questions.

There was no way for these early humans to know such a thing or verify it, so it went unchallenged.

Those who were told this as children grew up and told their own children the same thing.

Fast forward a few thousand years and presto. We've got religion.

Well then Science should be able to prove such nonsense!

 

[Jack]

I understand stand you have a relentless need, a jihad in fact, to assume religion is always wrong, always evil, always terrible, a blight on humanity which has never offered a single, solitary benefit to humanity.

And that is exactly how I knew you were lying your ass off about supposedly being a detached agnostic.


I am actually one of the few genuine agnostics here: I don't choose sides, I don't play on a team, I attempt to be balanced. and I stick to the historical facts as best as I can understand them .

I even have a record of respect for atheistic thought, and have the posts to prove them.

As a matter of interest, what is the source of your unrelenting and highly emotional anti- religion jihad? Traumatized because Mom dragged you unwittingly to some Fundy church?

I just went to Public School and learned about History.

You seem to have missed a few classes. The Church destroyed the Wisdom of the Ancient Past, and you try to turn it around and tell yourself that the Church 'saved' it. You go on and on about how great the thousand year reign of religion was, while others refer to it as the Dark Ages. A thousand years is a long time to be ruled by Autocrats that will kill you for having any doubt about what they claim is 'Truth'. It's amazing how when you are confronted by any of this, you immediately begin throwing out names of Greek Philosophers as though any of them agree with you.

"How Christians Destroyed the Ancient World"
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/08/books/review/catherine-nixey-darkening-age.html

"Using the mutilation of faces, arms and genitals on the Parthenon’s decoration as one of her many, thunderingly memorable case studies, Nixey makes the fundamental point that while we lionize Christian culture for preserving works of learning, sponsoring exquisite art and adhering to an ethos of “love thy neighbor,” the early church was in fact a master of anti-intellectualism, iconoclasm and mortal prejudice."

You've been brainwashed. It is interesting how you try to pass yourself off as an Intellectual, but come off more like a Sunday School teacher. (not trying to make this personal)

 

[Cypress]

The most popular version of the big bang says that the universe popped into existence from a quantum fluctuation. But since it is more likely for quantum fluctuations to produce simpler things, it is more likely that your solitary brain popped into existence from a quantum fluctuation. (After all, if the big bang could produce a universe filled with billions of brains, producing one brain with false memories is much simpler.)

While most big bang supporters do not actually believe such a conclusion, it is the logical outcome of the theory.

Dr. Jason Lisle, an astrophysicist working at Answers in Genesis, notes that self-refutation is a common defect in nonbiblical worldviews. “If a theory leads to conclusions that are contrary to the theory,” Lisle notes, “then the theory refutes itself. If the big bang were true, it would lead to a conclusion that is not true!”

Do you always post other people's words and pass them off as your own, neglecting to cite a link?

Your claim that Jesus created the Big Bang is known in classic rhetoric as the logical fallacy, appeal to ignorance.

Quantum fluctuations at least reasonably rises to the level somewhere between an educated guess and a legitimate hypothesis- because quantum mechanics demonstrates to us that is is physically possible for something to be created from nothing; that not all causes have to have a first causer.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

I understand stand you have a relentless need, a jihad in fact, to assume religion is always wrong, always evil, always terrible, a blight on humanity which has never offered a single, solitary benefit to humanity.

And that is exactly how I knew you were lying your ass off about supposedly being a detached agnostic.


I am actually one of the few genuine agnostics here: I don't choose sides, I don't play on a team, I attempt to be balanced. and I stick to the historical facts as best as I can understand them .

I even have a record of respect for atheistic thought, and have the posts to prove them.

As a matter of interest, what is the source of your unrelenting and highly emotional anti- religion jihad? Traumatized because Mom dragged you unwittingly to some Fundy church?

$20 says "What is Bipolarism, Alex".

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Then why is it hard for you to imagine an existence where matter has always existed and everything that exists is just a result of matter interacting over time


If you accept that something has just always existed


There is No need for the theory of gods

True in theory but the Universe hasn't always existed. The Oscillating Universe theory has evidence against it since Dark Matter and/or Dark Energy are causing the Universe to expand and accelerate in that expansion.

All current evidence indicates we are a One-shot Universe with a defined beginning and a very cold, very dark end.

https://astronomy.com/news/magazine...the-universe-the-big-crunch-vs-the-big-freeze

These days, astronomers think normal matter comprises just 5 percent of the universe’s contents. Meanwhile, dark matter makes up some 26 percent, and dark energy accounts for the final 69 percent. Dark energy, it turns out, seems to be the real-world force behind Einstein’s cosmological constant, which plays a major role in preventing a Big Crunch-style collapse.

Thanks to the expansion caused by dark energy, within a couple of trillion years, all but the closest galaxies will be too far away to see. Then, perhaps 100 trillion years later, star formation will cease, as dense stellar remnants like white dwarfs and black holes lock up any remaining material.

About a googol years from now — that’s a 1 followed by 100 zeroes — the last objects in the universe, supermassive black holes, will finish evaporating via Hawking radiation. After this, the universe enters a so-called Dark Era, where matter is just a distant memory.

The second law of thermodynamics suggests that entropy will keep increasing in a system (such as the cosmos) until it hits a maximum level. In real terms, that means that at some point, the universe will ultimately reach a state where all energy — and, hence, heat — is uniformly distributed. The final temperature of the entire universe will hover a smidge above absolute zero.

So, rather than mirroring Revelation, the death of our cosmos will likely resemble the beginning of Genesis: All will be empty and dark.