Rapture Doctrine invented by John Darby in 1830 AD

kudzu said:
Most of the Roman Empire spoke Greek.

Speaking in tongues is nonsense.. Even today most people in the Middle East speak 3 languages...


Here's a time line of Paul's travels.. He wasn't in Rome long.

http://christianityinview.com/paulstimeline.html


61 Spring: Arrives at Rome Embassy of Jews comes from Jerusalem to petition about the wall.
62 At Rome•Spring: Writes PHILEMON, COLOSSIANS, EPHESIANS
•Autumn: Writes PHILIPPIANS.
Burrus dies; Albinus succeeds Festus as procuratory of Judea; Nero marries Poppaea.
63 Paul acquitted at Rome; goes to Macedonia and Asia Minor Daughter Claudia born to Poppaea
64 Paul goes to Spain (?) Great fire at Rome; Roman Christians blamed and persecuted by Nero.
65 In Spain (?) Gessius Florus made procurator of Judea; conspiracy of Piso and death of Seneca.
66 Summer: from Spain (?) to Asia Jewish War begins.
67 •Summer: Writes 1 TIMOTHY from Macedonia
•Autumn: Writes TITUS from Ephesus.
•Winter: At Nicopolis
-
68 •Spring:In prison at Rome, writes 2 TIMOTHY
•Summer: Paul executed at Nero's orders.
Death of Nero in middle of June.
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Being a non-believer of course you don't believe the scriptures
 
kudzu said:
Paul was a prisoner in Rome.. and died about 64-68 AD before the destruction of the Temple and the tribulation. Its a good question.. I don't know... probably some.
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This is what I found, all my books on the matter are still packed away. I have not found a book shelf yet, thinking of having custom one built. This renews my need to get busy on it. I miss my reference books.

[FONT=&quot]The language of Apostle Paul (who was a Pharisee - Philippians 3:5) was Aramaic. Not Hebrew and Greek.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Acts 1:19, Field of Blood was known to all the inhabitants of Jerusalem in their own language as Akeldama which is the transliteration of Aramaic words "Haqal Dama." (Source - Book "What do Jewish People think about Jesus?" by Dr. Michael Brown, Page 39) [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]According to First century Jewish Priest & Historian Josephus, Greek wasn't spoken in first century Israel. Josephus also points out the extreme rarity in terms of a Jew knowing Greek in first century AD.

https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/5630/how-many-languages-did-apostle-paul-speak[/FONT]
 
Phantasmal said:
This is what I found, all my books on the matter are still packed away. I have not found a book shelf yet, thinking of having custom one built. This renews my need to get busy on it. I miss my reference books.

[FONT="]The language of Apostle Paul (who was a Pharisee - Philippians 3:5) was Aramaic. Not Hebrew and Greek.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#848D95][FONT="]In Acts 1:19, Field of Blood was known to all the inhabitants of Jerusalem in their own language as Akeldama which is the transliteration of Aramaic words "Haqal Dama." (Source - Book "What do Jewish People think about Jesus?" by Dr. Michael Brown, Page 39) [/FONT]
[FONT="]According to First century Jewish Priest & Historian Josephus, Greek wasn't spoken in first century Israel. Josephus also points out the extreme rarity in terms of a Jew knowing Greek in first century AD.

https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/5630/how-many-languages-did-apostle-paul-speak[/FONT]
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That's seems weird to me since the Decapolis was Hellenized Jews and much of the NT was written in Greek..

Or maybe it wasn't.. Maybe it was translated from Aramaic into Greek.

I had always read that Greek was the language of commerce.

Take a look at the dates and language.

http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/matthew.html
 
kudzu said:
That's seems weird to me since the Decapolis was Hellenized Jews and much of the NT was written in Greek..

Or maybe it wasn't.. Maybe it was translated from Aramaic into Greek.

I had always read that Greek was the language of commerce.

Take a look at the dates and language.

http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/matthew.html
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Luke, the companion of Paul wrote and spoke in Greek, they believe his original writings were in Greek. It is stated in Acts that Paul spoke and wrote Greek. It seems educated merchants did speak the language.
 
Michael Mazon said:
Being a non-believer of course you don't believe the scriptures
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Are you a holy roller?

1. Speaking in tongues is not the definitive evidence of the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Not all the Corinthians spoke in tongues (1 Corinthians 1:5), but they had all been baptized into the body of Christ (1 Corinthians 1:13).

2. The fruit of the Holy Spirit (Galatians 5:22) does not include speaking in tongues. Therefore, Christlikeness does not require speaking in tongues.

"The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness,
goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control."

3. Most of the New Testament writers are silent on tongues. Only three books (Acts, 1 Corinthians, and Mark) mention it. (Note: Mark 16:17 is not in the two best Greek manuscripts.) Significantly, many of the other New Testament books speak a great deal about the Holy Spirit, but fail to even mention speaking in tongues.

4. There are more important gifts than tongues, and these are to be sought (1 Corinthians 12:28).
 
kudzu said:
Are you a holy roller?

1. Speaking in tongues is not the definitive evidence of the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Not all the Corinthians spoke in tongues (1 Corinthians 1:5), but they had all been baptized into the body of Christ (1 Corinthians 1:13).

2. The fruit of the Holy Spirit (Galatians 5:22) does not include speaking in tongues. Therefore, Christlikeness does not require speaking in tongues.

"The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness,
goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control."

3. Most of the New Testament writers are silent on tongues. Only three books (Acts, 1 Corinthians, and Mark) mention it. (Note: Mark 16:17 is not in the two best Greek manuscripts.) Significantly, many of the other New Testament books speak a great deal about the Holy Spirit, but fail to even mention speaking in tongues.

4. There are more important gifts than tongues, and these are to be sought (1 Corinthians 12:28).
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I never said everyone spoke in tongues,probably few.
Why do you quote scripture that you don't believe in?
Strange?
 
kudzu said:
The return of Jesus is a central teaching in the New Testament and is foundational for Lutherans and other Christians. But this isn’t the same as the rapture, a word that isn’t in the Bible.
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so your quote proves me right and you wrong.......you said Lutherans believed in the a Scofield type rapture......you poor sick fuck.....please, win all my arguments for me in the future.....
 
kudzu said:
The Decapolis was Greek speaking and evidently far more prosperous and cosmopolitan than Israel or Judah.

In fact.. the Thessalonians were Hellenized Jews.
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????.....no, Thessalonika was in Greece.....they were Greek.....the Hellenized Jews were the ruling class in Judea.......
 
kudzu said:
LOLOL.. That's BS. What OTHER people? They all spoke Hebrew or Greek or Aramaic.
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the first instance of speaking in tongues was on Pentacaust.....the people in the market place heard the apostles speaking in their native languages even though they were from all parts of the world.........
 
PostmodernProphet said:
the first instance of speaking in tongues was on Pentacaust.....the people in the market place heard the apostles speaking in their native languages even though they were from all parts of the world.........
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1. At the time of the Exodus, God required all male Israelites to attend three annual services at a specific place which later, became the city of Jerusalem. "Three times a year all your men must appear before the Lord your God at the place he will choose: at the Feast of Unleavened Bread, the Feast of Weeks [later called Pentecost] and the Feast of Tabernacles. No man should appear before the Lord empty-handed" (Deuteronomy 16:16, )



4. The disciples did something that had never been done before. They spoke to the congregants about Jesus using the native languages and dialects of the congregants: "Then how is it that each of us hears them in his own native language? Parthians, Medes and Elamites; residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene; visitors from Rome (both Jews and converts to Judaism); Cretans and Arabs – we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!" (Acts 2:8-11, emphases mine)


https://www.wake-up.org/church/speaking-in-tongues.html

Interesting that God doesn't do this any more.
 
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