Where America's jobs went

Superfreak said:
You are an idiot. AGAIN... this had nothing to due with 'mom and pop' locally produced tea. They CHOSE to ignore the MANDATE of the CROWN that they purchase from the MONOPOLY that was backed by the CROWN. In other words, they did NOT want the GOVERNMENT telling them who to buy from. They chose instead to buy the bulk of their tea not from mom and pop local producers, but from smugglers who were bringing in tea from the DUTCH.... AGAINST the wishes of the crown.



Except again, that is NOT what the Boston Tea Party was about, nor did the colonists buy much from 'mom and pop' merchants as you continue to claim. They bought the BULK of the tea from the DUTCH you friggin idiot. Your OWN link states that. Try reading it some time, it was actually interesting.

You also continue to conflate the Boston Tea Party to 'what our founders believed in'. Again... the Boston Tea Party, while significant, was ONLY ONE EVENT. You ignore the Declaration of Independence, you ignore the Constitution, you ignore everything that shows they were opposed to a CENTRALIZED FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. You continue to warp that in your attempt to build straw men... but in the end, your failure to grasp not only history, but also the present is quite pathetic.
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I did read the link I posted...maybe you missed this part:

The colonists, however, were unswayed by the prospect of legal, affordable tea. Instead they invoked the specter of monopoly, insisting that the East India Company would soon grow too powerful to resist. Colonial merchants would be ruined, the company would tighten its grip on the marketplace, and average consumers would be left at the mercy of a mercantile leviathan.

OR maybe you forgot the words of people who actually participated in the event:

A pamphlet was circulated through the colonies called The Alarm and signed by an enigmatic "Rusticus." One issue made clear the feelings of colonial Americans about England's largest transnational corporation and its behavior around the world:

"Their Conduct in Asia, for some Years past, has given simple Proof, how little they regard the Laws of Nations, the Rights, Liberties, or Lives of Men. They have levied War, excited Rebellions, dethroned lawful Princes, and sacrificed Millions for the Sake of Gain. The Revenues of Mighty Kingdoms have entered their Coffers. And these not being sufficient to glut their Avarice, they have, by the most unparalleled Barbarities, Extortions, and Monopolies, stripped the miserable Inhabitants of their Property, and reduced whole Provinces to Indigence and Ruin. Fifteen hundred Thousands, it is said, perished by Famine in one Year, not because the Earth denied its Fruits; but [because] this Company and their Servants engulfed all the Necessaries of Life, and set them at so high a Price that the poor could not purchase them."
 
Bfgrn said:
It shows...your self centered interests as a stockholder have little or no relation to the economy of a nation where the people are STAKEholders.
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What other reason is there, a capitalist wants the most efficient allocation of his capital. Other than misusing dem talking points, what do u use it for?
 
The Dude said:
What other reason is there, a capitalist wants the most efficient allocation of his capital. Other than misusing dem talking points, what do u use it for?
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Wall Street is not main street. An economy is measured on how it serves all the people...the STAKEholders. The the top 1% control an astounding 19% of the nation's income, the market is less attached to the fortunes of ordinary Americans than ever. In 2004, the wealthiest 1% of Americans owned 36.9% of all stock. The wealthiest 10% controlled 80% of all stock. That means the skips and dips of the market tell you very much about how the best-off are doing, but considerably less about how the great bulk beneath are faring.

To focus on the performance of the market, then, is to zero in on an economic indicator that can do well even as the country does poorly. In 2006, for instance, the Dow Jones industrial average hit highs. According to the just released census data, however, median earnings fell 1%, and millions more Americans entered the ranks of the uninsured. Indeed, from 2000 to 2007, the S&P 500 gained more than 500 points; meanwhile, the median household's income, at least as of 2006, fell by more than $900.
 
Bfgrn said:
Wall Street is not main street. An economy is measured on how it serves all the people...the STAKEholders. The the top 1% control an astounding 19% of the nation's income, the market is less attached to the fortunes of ordinary Americans than ever. In 2004, the wealthiest 1% of Americans owned 36.9% of all stock. The wealthiest 10% controlled 80% of all stock. That means the skips and dips of the market tell you very much about how the best-off are doing, but considerably less about how the great bulk beneath are faring.

To focus on the performance of the market, then, is to zero in on an economic indicator that can do well even as the country does poorly. In 2006, for instance, the Dow Jones industrial average hit highs. According to the just released census data, however, median earnings fell 1%, and millions more Americans entered the ranks of the uninsured. Indeed, from 2000 to 2007, the S&P 500 gained more than 500 points; meanwhile, the median household's income, at least as of 2006, fell by more than $900.
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One of the Seven Deadly Sins......

Envy (also called invidiousness) is best defined as an emotion that "occurs when a person lacks another's (perceived) superior quality, achievement, or possession and either desires it or wishes that the other lacked it."http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envy#cite_note-Parrot.2CSmith.2C1993-0
Envy can also derive from a sense of low self-esteem that results from an upward social comparison threatening a person's self image: another person has something that the envier considers to be important to have. If the other person is perceived to be similar to the envier, the aroused envy will be particularly intense, because it signals to the envier that it just as well could have been he or she who had the desired object.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envy#cite_note-1
 
bravo said:
One of the Seven Deadly Sins......

Envy (also called invidiousness) is best defined as an emotion that "occurs when a person lacks another's (perceived) superior quality, achievement, or possession and either desires it or wishes that the other lacked it."http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envy#cite_note-Parrot.2CSmith.2C1993-0
Envy can also derive from a sense of low self-esteem that results from an upward social comparison threatening a person's self image: another person has something that the envier considers to be important to have. If the other person is perceived to be similar to the envier, the aroused envy will be particularly intense, because it signals to the envier that it just as well could have been he or she who had the desired object.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envy#cite_note-1
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Conservatives

When you understand what conservatism is, every argument they make leads to the same end.

Q: What is conservatism?
A: Conservatism is the domination of society by an aristocracy.

When you understand this and view their words, ask the question; will this lead to some form of an aristocracy?

The answer is always YES...
 
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Bfgrn said:
Conservatives

When you understand what conservatism is, every argument they make leads to the same end.

Q: What is conservatism?
A: Conservatism is the domination of society by an aristocracy.

When you understand this and view their words, ask the question; will this lead to some form of an aristocracy?

The answer is always YES...
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What a load of horseshit. What you want is a gov't dominated society in which individual rights are negated by the all-powerful government. The aristocracy is living in DC.
 
WinterBorn said:
What a load of horseshit. What you want is a gov't dominated society in which individual rights are negated by the all-powerful government. The aristocracy is living in DC.
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BULLSHIT! We have a corporate, Wall Street dominated society. It is time for the people to be in charge. YOU want corporations controlled by Wall Street investors to be able to determine life or death. REAL death panels. You refuse to read, listen or believe what is really going on. You right wing ideologues REFUSE to even hear the truth.
 
Bfgrn said:
BULLSHIT! We have a corporate, Wall Street dominated society. It is time for the people to be in charge. YOU want corporations controlled by Wall Street investors to be able to determine life or death. REAL death panels. You refuse to read, listen or believe what is really going on. You right wing ideologues REFUSE to even hear the truth.
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You do love to tell me what I want, don't you. If it were based on reality it might be relevant. But is based, instead, on what would make your argument more valid.

We have money dominating our society. At least with corporate america (which you helped build) we understand the motivation and can be a part of the growth. With the increasiong gov't intervention we have less choice, less control, and the money still rules the game.

Look at every single politcian in DC and tell me they got their without huge sums of money. And the people that donate that money do not do so out of the goodness of their heart. They do so because they expect something in return.

You want to blame conservatives, but the liberals have crippled generations of poor by keeping them on the gov't payroll.
 
WinterBorn said:
You do love to tell me what I want, don't you. If it were based on reality it might be relevant. But is based, instead, on what would make your argument more valid.

We have money dominating our society. At least with corporate america (which you helped build) we understand the motivation and can be a part of the growth. With the increasiong gov't intervention we have less choice, less control, and the money still rules the game.

Look at every single politcian in DC and tell me they got their without huge sums of money. And the people that donate that money do not do so out of the goodness of their heart. They do so because they expect something in return.

You want to blame conservatives, but the liberals have crippled generations of poor by keeping them on the gov't payroll.
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Do you live on THIS planet? Our economy is in the toilet because of DEregulation and/or lax enforcement of existing laws and regulations. Over the past 30+ years we have witnessed regulatory capture at an epidemic level. That is where corporate lawyers are given the privilege to author legislation and regulations that ONLY benefit them.
 
Bfgrn said:
Do you live on THIS planet? Our economy is in the toilet because of DEregulation and/or lax enforcement of existing laws and regulations. Over the past 30+ years we have witnessed regulatory capture at an epidemic level. That is where corporate lawyers are given the privilege to author legislation and regulations that ONLY benefit them.
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Yes, the deregulation has caused huge problems. Are you claiming that only conservatives are responsible for deregulation?

I know you want the corrupt politicians to regulate every detail of your life, but try and imagine a little freedom for the individual?
 
WinterBorn said:
Yes, the deregulation has caused huge problems. Are you claiming that only conservatives are responsible for deregulation?

I know you want the corrupt politicians to regulate every detail of your life, but try and imagine a little freedom for the individual?
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Republicans WORSHIP deregulation, so figure it out.

I don't want anyone regulating every detail of my life. WHY do you always resort to a polarized argument? It is so ignorant and right wing moronic.

BTW, what group of poor people did liberals keep on the gov't payroll...the elderly, children, the disabled?
 
Bfgrn said:
Republicans WORSHIP deregulation, so figure it out.
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But you are the one ranting and raving about what corporations do, and how they should be regulated out of existance. Although it is more amusing now, considering how you were shown to be, not only a participant, but to have won awards for ruining smaller companies.

Bfgrn said:
I don't want anyone regulating every detail of my life. WHY do you always resort to a polarized argument? It is so ignorant and right wing moronic.
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Probably in response to comments like "YOU want corporations controlled by Wall Street investors to be able to determine life or death. REAL death panels. You refuse to read, listen or believe what is really going on. You right wing ideologues REFUSE to even hear the truth.".

If you are going to make baseless accusations about people, try not to get so upset when the same happens to you.
 
WinterBorn said:
But you are the one ranting and raving about what corporations do, and how they should be regulated out of existance. Although it is more amusing now, considering how you were shown to be, not only a participant, but to have won awards for ruining smaller companies.



Probably in response to comments like "YOU want corporations controlled by Wall Street investors to be able to determine life or death. REAL death panels. You refuse to read, listen or believe what is really going on. You right wing ideologues REFUSE to even hear the truth.".

If you are going to make baseless accusations about people, try not to get so upset when the same happens to you.
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Regulated out of existence? So, NOW you take the polarized argument to the ultimate extreme. You really are a dolt.

You DID stand up for insurance cartels that DO have death panels. I have provided numerous times an interview with a senior VP from Cigna...you refuse to even watch it.
 
Bfgrn said:
Regulated out of existence? So, NOW you take the polarized argument to the ultimate extreme. You really are a dolt.

You DID stand up for insurance cartels that DO have death panels. I have provided numerous times an interview with a senior VP from Cigna...you refuse to even watch it.
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Oh yeah, the debate we had where you asked lots of questions and answered none. I remember that one. You proved absolutely nothing.
 
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