Capitalism Has Destroyed / Is Destroying American Family Values

[Ross Dolan]

Poli...now for few specific comments on your post.

In the past, new technologies have generated more jobs to take care of machines and to manage new possibilities presented by using the machines. AI is poised to change that, because the machines will build themselves, service themselves, even design better machine replacements.

Yup. There will always be a place for humans…but far fewer than we need now. Human bartenders will always be a better shoulder to cry on; humans will always make hand-made silk ties; humans will almost always be better at some nursing jobs (dispensers of TLC)…but for the most part, any job that can be done by a machine…should be done by a machine. They will get the jobs done better, more efficiently, and more cheaply.

Machines don't pay taxes, generate no revenue. Without millions of workers getting paychecks and paying taxes the government will go bankrupt, and the would-be workers will starve. The only solution is to tax the rich heavily…

Yes. The rich…and the corporations.

…to pay for a government-issued 'free' salary for everyone - whether they work or not. The basic universal income is our only future under this scenario. Claims that new jobs will magically appear are but wishful thinking.

I've been an advocate for the BUI for almost 3 decades...from before it was a popular item to discuss. In any case, taking it a step further...work should be a reward for the capable and extremely willing. I do not advocate for communism. Those who actually are rewarded with WORK...should get very well compensated.

Capitalism seeks to maximize profits and minimize costs. Labor is targeted…

Labor is targeted first…and in the extreme. It will only get worse…not better. Labor cannot be treated as expendable.

We are going to have to change these attitudes slowly, one at a time, to nudge the nation closer to what it needs to be.

Slowly will get the job done peacefully.

But I am not sure this is going to happen peacefully…nor that we have the time to do it slowly. Jury is still out on that.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

if you WANT capitalism to work, you MUST totally destroy crony capitalism.

 

[Ross Dolan]

if you WANT capitalism to work, you MUST totally destroy crony capitalism.

I can think of no way to "destroy" crony capitalism. It seems to be a function of humans working as humans.

If you can suggest a way you see as having possibilities...I'd love to hear and consider the idea.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

I can think of no way to "destroy" crony capitalism. It seems to be a function of humans working as humans.

If you can suggest a way you see as having possibilities...I'd love to hear and consider the idea.

with the amount of money in government, maybe we should not be allowing government agency heads to contract for projects......

 

[Truth Detector]

American families are clearly on the decline. Divorce rates and out-of-wedlock child birth rates are up. Capitalism has played a crucial role in this evolution.

LIE; liberal policies have played a crucial role in this. When you pass laws that support paying for losers to do stupid things, you get more losers.

Decades ago, it took just one income to support a family. That included a 40 hour week, full health care, vacations, savings and retirement. Unions won most of those family-enhancing struggles. This represented a bit of a loss for capitalism as many of those family-beneficial victories came at the expense of additional profits for the richest.

LIE; unions have never been large enough to impact salaries and pay scales. Liberal policies that promoted women not staying home to raise children and WWII resulting in a massive influx of women into factory roles were primarily the cause of this. When you had a huge work force willing to work for less entering the market, it had a downward pressure on wages and in industries formerly dominated by men.

The liberal establishment told women they were foolish to rely on men for their livelihood and stay home to raise good children. The Liberal establishment also promoted the dissolution of the notion of family and the murder on demand policies of abortion.

But capitalism relentlessly seeks to maximize the profitability of any situation. A war on unions and worker rights was the response from capitalism to all those family-enhancing detriments to profitability. Good jobs with family-supporting benefits have routinely been downsized, offshored, mechanized, computerized, and broken into several part time positions with no benefits.

This is nothing more than a massive amount of leftist bullshit. What is it about you leftists and your propensity to lie and emotional spout bullshit?

The traditional male/female roles where he works, brings home the bacon, and she is the home maker have now been relegated to the rich who can afford nannies, cooks, gardeners, etc.

LIE; The traditional female role was destroyed by Liberal policies and the Marxist leaning women's rights movement.

Family values have become luxuries only affordable to the rich. Capitalism is the culprit.

LIE; this is nothing more than unadulterated bullshit, which seems to be your forte'.

Clearly, in order to make America great again, families are going to need something more than empty words of support.

LIE; but I am amused by the moronic notion that American families need Government in order to support themselves. It truly is the most ignorant, stupid and false talking point the left has.

Capitalism is a wonderful and powerful wealth-generating tool, but it is also dangerous to American family values.

LIE; much like the majority of your post, this is pure unadulterated bullshit.

The lesson is apparent: Capitalism must be balanced with the proper amount of socialism. Capitalism is like a powerful engine. The engine of capitalism, without socialism as a governor, and left to run at wide open throttle, is bound to blow up. Our challenge is not a choice between capitalism and socialism, it is clearly one of how to blend the two.

STRAWMAN; there you go again with this moronic argument no one has made about unfettered capitalism. This country has never experienced this since the 19th century. Stop lying.

Our young nation is at a point where we are falling behind the other older nations which have already figured this out. It is now time for us to accept this challenge and show that we can do it better.

LIE; the older nations lag us in just about everything other than massive taxation and regulations. You're certainly free to prove me wrong with any statistics that might support your laughably stupid assertions.

 

[Truth Detector]

Hello cawacko,

Republicans support the right of powerful corporations to suppress worker rights, thus making life difficult for workers. This leads to monetary and time pressure on stressed families, which respond by breaking up.

More bullshit; you appear to be quite full of it.

 

[Truth Detector]

I am a capitalist...but unfettered, capitalism is recipe for a society of "the elite" and "the serfs."

Could you provide links to any Conservative who has made an argument for unfettered capitalism? Of course you can't because we know you are full of bull.

 

[Ross Dolan]

with the amount of money in government, maybe we should not be allowing government agency heads to contract for projects......

Good thought, Smarter, but SOMEONE would have to "contract for projects"...and the process would begin with whomever that is...or they are.

I imagine "tightening up" the process for contracting could be done (and that might impact on the government side)...but it seems to me that the heavy pressure in the process comes not from the government side...but from the business side. And often the "influence" is guarded by constitutional rights...and is rather indirect...often transcending "contracting for projects."

It large measure, for instance, the impact of NRA lobbying...is part of crony capitalism. Gun manufacturers want to sell as many guns as possible...but the pressure the NRA injects is not only protected by the Constitution...it is not as obvious as a guy passing an envelope to a potential contract negotiator.

Any other thoughts?

Anyone else?

 

[PoliTalker]

Walmart? Flea Market crapola? US flags made in China or Shoes made in communist sweatshops by 8 year olds endorsed by the NBA...etc.? It was the Collusion with Big Government (Bill and Hillary Clinton, and Sam Walton) that purchased the NAFTA deal that resulted in Cheap Knock Off imitations of Name Brand goods that has resulted in the one sided trade imbalance where the American Workers are paying the price for your cheap left wing products.

Its not Capitalism that is the culprit but Big Government "overregulation" that resulted in the NEW NORMAL claimed by BHO were the GDP stagnated at an average of 1.9%. True capitalism is the engine that drives the US economy not some knockoff overregulated "left wing" ideology CHRONIE CAPITALISM WHERE BIG BROTHER GETS TO PICK WINNERS AND LOSERS AND DICTATE WHO IS TO BIG TO FAIL.

In other words.....Keynesian Economics did not work during the 30s and it sure as hell did not work in the 2000s under both Bush and Obama. The problem with this nation the fact its being led around by the nose by people who know jack shit about the private sector.

As Jeff Foxworthy declares: "We live in a country founded by Geniuses but run by IDIOTS......IF" You can get arrested for hunting without a license but not for entering the country illegally.

If your child has to get your signed permission to go on a field trip or take an OTC aspirin.....BUT NOT TO GET AN ABORTION....YOU MIGHT HAVE IDIOTS FOR LEADERS.

If you must show your ID to board a plan, cash a check, buy liquor, or check out a library book......but consider it "intimidation" to be asked to ID yourself before you exercise the greatest right allowed in this nation......VOTING for who gets to RUN THIS NATION as its leaders, you have idiots for leaders.

Or.....if a government wants to prevent well adjusted, stable individuals from owning firearms that hold 10 rounds in their weapons, but thinks its OK to sell F-16 fighter jets to crazy new terror backed leaders in Egypt.....you have a nation founded by geniuses but run by idiots.

Or if you live in a liberal city where you can purchase 2, 3 or more 16 ounce colas with sugar....but you can't purchase 1 24 ounce drink because the sugar might make you fat....you live in a city run by idiots.

Or....if you go to an airport and an 80 old white grandmaw is singled out of the pack along with a 3 year old in a wheel chair for "strip searches" so the employee can fill their quota for the flight....but refuse to search below the neck line of a 20 something female Muslim because of her faith.....you might live in a nation run by idiots.


My favorite.....concerning IDIOT LEADERS. If you live in a country where the leaders declare the best way to "eradicate" Trillions of dollars of DEBT is to borrow Trillions more.....you live in a country of IDIOT LEADERS.

More? Your 7 year old can be suspended from school because he called his teacher "cute"........but next week the same school provides a platform for a speaker talking about accepting sexual diversity and how some students have 2 daddies or 2 mommies.....your school system is run by idiots.

If HARD WORK and SUCCESS are met by higher taxes, more regulations and government intrusion....while NOT WORKING is rewarded with cell phones, housing assistance, food stamps, money, babysitting services...etc., you are governed by IDIOTS.




YOU MIGHT LIVE IN A NATION FOUNDED BY GENIUSIS BUT RUN BY LEFTISTS IF.........the plan is to make incentives for people to work by paying them not to look for work by granting them a 99 week paid vacation.....or, you pay your home mortgage without missing a single payment faithfully while denying yourself the extras that make life easier such Big Screen TVs another car..phone..etc., .....while you neighbor (a minority) purchased a home that his income could never pay back on time....goes out and purchases Iphones, huge tvs, new cars, etc......but allowed his home to get to the point of being in foreclosure.....and YOUR TAX DOLLARS bail him out .....you might live in a nation run by leftist idiot leaders.

Hello Ralph,

If capitalism is the engine driving the US economy, then removing regulation is like leaving the throttle wide open. It's gonna blow up unless it has a governor. Guess why it is called a governor?

NAFTA is not responsible for globalization. Capitalism is.

Capitalism has led to extreme wealth inequality. This means millions at the low end of the scale are barely scraping by even with multiple family incomes from numerous jobs held by both spouses. People are distraught just trying to make it and stay off the dole. People who work all the time and have their time eaten up by commuting to several dead end jobs are so stressed out they do not make very good parents. Families are under financial stress.

Extreme wealth inequality is a problem for our society. The break up of families is an indicator of how bad it is.

Conservatives who think the problem is all about values are not considering the actual consequences of the class war.

Families are the victims of the class war.

Our future depends on raising good kids.

Blaming the poor for their own condition exacerbates that.

It does no good to stand on a street corner and yell: "I told you so!" and claim that conservatives have been trying to tell people to have better family values. Words are cheap. Actions are far more effective.

The action needed is to regulate our economy with the goal of achieving more equitable wealth distribution. We must take steps to reduce dangerous wealth concentration. After all, the populace can't spend what they don't have. The economy depends on spending. The populace simply must have a greater share of wealth in order for spending to increase. When spending increases, that's our GDP going up. It can't go up without consumer spending from all sectors. When we blame the poor we are merely making excuses for not helping them. When we don't help them they don't spend. And that's why we cannot have a strong and resilient economy.

 

[Truth Detector]

"Unfettered capitalism" is a continuum, ca.

We are a hell of a lot closer to it than anyone else around...so your suggestion that "we have nothing close to (it) in this country"...rings very hollow.

And if the Trump sycophants get their way...we will be even closer before we are done with this national nightmare we are enduring.

Best we avoid "getting closer" in almost any way possible.

BULL SHIT

 

[PoliTalker]

Lots of really great stuff in this post of yours, Poli. You actually see the problem...which affords you insights into real solutions. I’m going on to some thoughts of my own here, and will get back to comment specifically on yours at some point.

Eventually, probably sooner than most think, we will have to eliminate the “Protestant work ethic”…the idea of having to work for one’s living. There will not be enough decent paying jobs for everyone who needs and wants one. Human labor already is not cost efficient…and with each passing day (each new technological achievement) gets less and less cost efficient.

You are getting at a form of the move needed…with “guaranteed basic income.” But it should go even further. Something more along the lines of only allowing people to WORK…as a reward for skill, ability, and determination to do the most productive work possible.

This is complicated…and needs lots of ‘splainin’. But suffice for right now to say that if we give as much of the work that has to be done over to machines…and only allow the most productive (or most determined) of humans to do the human work required (which would result in vastly expanded productivity) we will have more of everything to go around. We already have enough to go around…but we would have EVEN MORE.

And that, ultimately, is what we want: More to go around so that EVERYONE can have “sufficient”…and perhaps even “more than just sufficient, but rather, plenty.”

If we get to the point where we have “plenty to go around”…each of us will be able to have plenty…even if it means some of us will not work...or even, will not be allowed to work. (Some people should NOT be allowed to work; they are too inefficient...too costly to productivity!)

That essentially would change the problem we are facing from “how do we create enough decent paying jobs for everyone who needs and wants one" (an almost impossible problem to solve)… to a problem of distributing PLENTY to everyone (a relatively easy problem to solve.)

Hello Frank,

Oh yes. I agree with all of that. It appears inevitable. That's where we are going to end up.

The thing is: this all has to happen very gradually. There won't be a day where all of a sudden we realize all this and flip a switch. How do we get from where we are to where we will be?

And I agree it should be relatively easy to distribute 'plenty to all,' but I'm sure we will find a way to screw that up. Greed would not simply vanish.

 

[Truth Detector]

If capitalism is the engine driving the US economy, then removing regulation is like leaving the throttle wide open. It's gonna blow up unless it has a governor. Guess why it is called a governor?

BULL SHIT; who is arguing to remove regulation?

NAFTA is not responsible for globalization. Capitalism is.

BULL SHIT.

Capitalism has led to extreme wealth inequality. This means millions at the low end of the scale are barely scraping by even with multiple family incomes from numerous jobs held by both spouses. People are distraught just trying to make it and stay off the dole. People who work all the time and have their time eaten up by commuting to several dead end jobs are so stressed out they do not make very good parents. Families are under financial stress.

BULL SHIT; the argument of wealth inequality is one of the most moronic talking points from the Marxist left. There will always be inequality in wealth as well as pay and the notion that Government can force us all to have the same identical wealth and pay is that of a moron.

It is just as moronic as it's sister argument the economy is some zero sum game that if someone gets a lot, someone else has to get less. It is a LIE that only the most ignorant and uneducated among us can believe.

Extreme wealth inequality is a problem for our society. The break up of families is an indicator of how bad it is.

BULL SHIT.

Conservatives who think the problem is all about values are not considering the actual consequences of the class war.

BULL SHIT; the only one's making a class envy/war over this are liars on the left like you.

Families are the victims of the class war.

BULL SHIT.

Our future depends on raising good kids.

That depends, what is your definition of "good kids"?

Blaming the poor for their own condition exacerbates that.

It does no good to stand on a street corner and yell: "I told you so!" and claim that conservatives have been trying to tell people to have better family values. Words are cheap. Actions are far more effective.

This is another fabricated strawman claim; what is with you lying leftists and your propensity to fabricate pure unadulterated bullshit?

The action needed is to regulate our economy with the goal of achieving more equitable wealth distribution. We must take steps to reduce dangerous wealth concentration. After all, the populace can't spend what they don't have. The economy depends on spending. The populace simply must have a greater share of wealth in order for spending to increase. When spending increases, that's our GDP going up. It can't go up with consumer spending from all sectors. When we blame the poor we are merely making excuses for not helping them. When we don't help them they don't spend. And that's why we cannot have a strong and resilient economy.

MORE BULL SHIT; once again, the notion that Government is supposed to ensure that wealth is equitably distributed in order to ensure fairness is the argument of morons and individuals who have ZERO economic and human behavior education.

In FACT; the reason for the incredible disparities can be directly attributed to Government actions and attempts to somehow manipulate and manage the economy to BUY the votes of ignoramuses who think they should get something for doing nothing.

EVERY commune ever attempted has failed.

 

[Truth Detector]

Hello Frank,

Oh yes. I agree with all of that. It appears inevitable. That's where we are going to end up.

The thing is: this all has to happen very gradually. There won't be a day where all of a sudden we realize all this and flip a switch. How do we get from where we are to where we will be?

And I agree it should be relatively easy to distribute 'plenty to all,' but I'm sure we will find a way to screw that up. Greed would not simply vanish.

 

[PoliTalker]

if you WANT capitalism to work, you MUST totally destroy crony capitalism.

Hello and greetings SmarterthanYou,

An admirable goal, but unrealistic. I support any effort which can be practically made. We should overturn Citizens United. Would require a new Amendment at the very least. And even then it would be quite tricky to word it to allow the things you want while still excluding crony capitalism. Realistically we are going to have to accept some crony capitalism and deal with it.

Also, for Capitalism to avoid the implosion it is currently headed for there must be socialism to balance out the downsides of capitalism. We like capitalism, keep that, but blend in the right amount of socialism. That's the only way to prevent capitalism from melting down like a runaway engine on full throttle.

 

[PoliTalker]

LIE; liberal policies have played a crucial role in this. When you pass laws that support paying for losers to do stupid things, you get more losers.



LIE; unions have never been large enough to impact salaries and pay scales. Liberal policies that promoted women not staying home to raise children and WWII resulting in a massive influx of women into factory roles were primarily the cause of this. When you had a huge work force willing to work for less entering the market, it had a downward pressure on wages and in industries formerly dominated by men.

The liberal establishment told women they were foolish to rely on men for their livelihood and stay home to raise good children. The Liberal establishment also promoted the dissolution of the notion of family and the murder on demand policies of abortion.



This is nothing more than a massive amount of leftist bullshit. What is it about you leftists and your propensity to lie and emotional spout bullshit?



LIE; The traditional female role was destroyed by Liberal policies and the Marxist leaning women's rights movement.



LIE; this is nothing more than unadulterated bullshit, which seems to be your forte'.



LIE; but I am amused by the moronic notion that American families need Government in order to support themselves. It truly is the most ignorant, stupid and false talking point the left has.



LIE; much like the majority of your post, this is pure unadulterated bullshit.



STRAWMAN; there you go again with this moronic argument no one has made about unfettered capitalism. This country has never experienced this since the 19th century. Stop lying.



LIE; the older nations lag us in just about everything other than massive taxation and regulations. You're certainly free to prove me wrong with any statistics that might support your laughably stupid assertions.

And welcome to my Permanent Ignore List. I hope you enjoy this feeble endorphin rush of any response at all to your venting, as it will be the last you get from me. Have a good life (if possible.)

#Intellectual discussion sought

 

[evince]

if you WANT capitalism to work, you MUST totally destroy crony capitalism.

by fettering it

 

[evince]

Truth is corporations fight capitalism to the death. Back when we had it, it was not so bad. We actually had competition. Companies had price wars. They spent money on product improvement. They offered excellent service. Now we have morphed into oligopoly. We have few corporations dominate industries. Like Cable. The prices are essentially identical.The products are the same . Service is abysmal. They can get away with it if they all offer the same shit. They just divide the country into zones.

These oligopolies were created by mergers and buyouts. The regulation agencies were silent. The same for banking, credit card companies, grocery stores, department stores and gasoline.

I am sure Frank remembers gas price wars and the days of great service. But most of you have never seen competition.

when its republicans running things


when its Democrats running things they maintain and improve the regulations

 

[evince]

Walmart? Flea Market crapola? US flags made in China or Shoes made in communist sweatshops by 8 year olds endorsed by the NBA...etc.? It was the Collusion with Big Government (Bill and Hillary Clinton, and Sam Walton) that purchased the NAFTA deal that resulted in Cheap Knock Off imitations of Name Brand goods that has resulted in the one sided trade imbalance where the American Workers are paying the price for your cheap left wing products.

Its not Capitalism that is the culprit but Big Government "overregulation" that resulted in the NEW NORMAL claimed by BHO were the GDP stagnated at an average of 1.9%. True capitalism is the engine that drives the US economy not some knockoff overregulated "left wing" ideology CHRONIE CAPITALISM WHERE BIG BROTHER GETS TO PICK WINNERS AND LOSERS AND DICTATE WHO IS TO BIG TO FAIL.

In other words.....Keynesian Economics did not work during the 30s and it sure as hell did not work in the 2000s under both Bush and Obama. The problem with this nation the fact its being led around by the nose by people who know jack shit about the private sector.

As Jeff Foxworthy declares: "We live in a country founded by Geniuses but run by IDIOTS......IF" You can get arrested for hunting without a license but not for entering the country illegally.

If your child has to get your signed permission to go on a field trip or take an OTC aspirin.....BUT NOT TO GET AN ABORTION....YOU MIGHT HAVE IDIOTS FOR LEADERS.

If you must show your ID to board a plan, cash a check, buy liquor, or check out a library book......but consider it "intimidation" to be asked to ID yourself before you exercise the greatest right allowed in this nation......VOTING for who gets to RUN THIS NATION as its leaders, you have idiots for leaders.

Or.....if a government wants to prevent well adjusted, stable individuals from owning firearms that hold 10 rounds in their weapons, but thinks its OK to sell F-16 fighter jets to crazy new terror backed leaders in Egypt.....you have a nation founded by geniuses but run by idiots.

Or if you live in a liberal city where you can purchase 2, 3 or more 16 ounce colas with sugar....but you can't purchase 1 24 ounce drink because the sugar might make you fat....you live in a city run by idiots.

Or....if you go to an airport and an 80 old white grandmaw is singled out of the pack along with a 3 year old in a wheel chair for "strip searches" so the employee can fill their quota for the flight....but refuse to search below the neck line of a 20 something female Muslim because of her faith.....you might live in a nation run by idiots.


My favorite.....concerning IDIOT LEADERS. If you live in a country where the leaders declare the best way to "eradicate" Trillions of dollars of DEBT is to borrow Trillions more.....you live in a country of IDIOT LEADERS.

More? Your 7 year old can be suspended from school because he called his teacher "cute"........but next week the same school provides a platform for a speaker talking about accepting sexual diversity and how some students have 2 daddies or 2 mommies.....your school system is run by idiots.

If HARD WORK and SUCCESS are met by higher taxes, more regulations and government intrusion....while NOT WORKING is rewarded with cell phones, housing assistance, food stamps, money, babysitting services...etc., you are governed by IDIOTS.




YOU MIGHT LIVE IN A NATION FOUNDED BY GENIUSIS BUT RUN BY LEFTISTS IF.........the plan is to make incentives for people to work by paying them not to look for work by granting them a 99 week paid vacation.....or, you pay your home mortgage without missing a single payment faithfully while denying yourself the extras that make life easier such Big Screen TVs another car..phone..etc., .....while you neighbor (a minority) purchased a home that his income could never pay back on time....goes out and purchases Iphones, huge tvs, new cars, etc......but allowed his home to get to the point of being in foreclosure.....and YOUR TAX DOLLARS bail him out .....you might live in a nation run by leftist idiot leaders.

you just proved you have no idea what you are talking about


your idiots deregulate every asshole


North America free trade agreement


that had nothing to do with china you idiot

 

[SmarterthanYou]

by fettering it

no, 'fettering' does jack shit because lawmakers always make exemptions and exceptions that benefit them. DESTROY crony capitalism, it's the only way.

 

[evince]

no, 'fettering' does jack shit because lawmakers always make exemptions and exceptions that benefit them. DESTROY crony capitalism, it's the only way.

how

whats your plan?