Climate change is pure bullshit!!

[IBDaMann]

Watch the news occasionally.

That's not a record. Time of occurrence isn't even notable. Beryl was completely run-of-the-mill. You are simply trying to overhype a nothing burger because you only operate on fear and panic.

There's nothing to see here. Move along, move along. The show was cancelled.

I'll let you know when there's an actual record-breaker.

 

[Crepitus]

That's not a record.

That is not what the experts say.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

It's amazing how you managed to create a gas that never expands, contracts or is endothermic or exothermic. How did you manage to do it?
Does this prove that hurricanes can not be real since the energy of a gas can never change and no work can be performed by a change in pressure?
I'm surprised that meteorologists haven't figured out there is no such thing as a high pressure system or a low pressure system like you have.

For once, I'm on your side. They don't understand thermodynamics. The First Law has to do with heat-work and usually associated with the Carnot heat engine cycle. That is you have a mass at the 'cold leg,' add energy by various means raising the temperature of the mass, then transfer that on the 'hot leg' to perform 'work.' The energy expended in doing 'work' causes the mass to cool, and the cycle starts over.

Q (or W) = m(∆T)

That is, the amount of stored energy in some mass is directly related to temperature. The higher the temperature of the mass, the more energy it stores. In a closed system, pressure makes a difference too. An open system can have pressure too, but this is variable, as it is in say, the planet's atmosphere.

Changes in atmospheric temperature doesn't violate the First Law in any way, it works by it. That in and of itself has little to do with Gorebal Warming.

 

[IBDaMann]

Oh look. Someone already wrote it up.

This is exactly the experiment I described ... except that it is completely different and totally unrelated.

Bo Zhen, Chia Wei Hsu, Ling Lu, A. Douglas Stone and Marin Soljačić didn't perform any experiment with any initial hypothesis. They wrote a paper about some non-repeatable observations, perhaps because they wanted to publish something in their downtime. The general gist is that photonic crystal slabs don't trap/store/contain light in any way, but rather "guide" light along in the same way that fiber optic cable guides light, or how train tracks "guide" a train, ... except that at random times, parts of the train "leak" away, ... and that is the topic of the paper.

I can't wait to see your expert criticism.

I won't keep you waiting.

Or you could just go ahead and tip your king since you are so good at that.

I have never lost to you, and unless you get demonstrably better in a hurry, I won't be losing to you anytime soon.

 

[IBDaMann]

[to Poor Richard Saunders] For once, I'm on your side.

Big mistake. You will rue the day.

They don't understand thermodynamics.

Let's relish the moment, shall we? Yes, we shall. You, of all people, want to go toe-to-toe with me on thermodynamics. Awesome! Bring it on, baby, bring it on. This promises to be loads of fun for the entire family.

The First Law has to do with heat-work

Nope. The 1st LoT has to do with conservation of energy. Heat is not energy and doesn't come into play. It's a good thing that science proficiency is not required to be an electrician.

and usually associated with the Carnot heat engine cycle.

Too Funny! Did someone get his laws of thermodynamics confused? Hint: this is when you say "Why, yes I did!" The Carnot cycle is based on the 2nd LoT, not the 1st. The good news is that as an electrician, you can get these laws confused and the quality of your work won't suffer.

In a closed system, pressure makes a difference too. An open system can have pressure too, but this is variable, as it is in say, the planet's atmosphere.

In what way are you claiming that the earth/sun/moon/surrounding-space is somehow an open system?

Changes in atmospheric temperature doesn't violate the First Law in any way, it works by it.

Changes in earth's average global equilibrium temperature without any change in total thermal energy violate the 1st LoT. I get the impression that you are begging to disagree. Are you?

That in and of itself has little to do with Gorebal Warming.

... but you believe that Earth's average global temperature is increasing, without any changes to Earth's total thermal energy. You would seem to be a science denier.

 

[IBDaMann]

That is some funny shit. Can you post a link to where I confused Stefan-Boltzmann with Kirchoff's law?

I don't feel like doing any looking. You can do the looking. Go find your post in which you discussed the emissivity of materials/substances. Then you'll have your answer.

 

[Into the Night]

Watch the news occasionally. I'm tired of showing you that water is wet.

So the air is colder than usual for the Atlantic. Makes sense, considering the long and wet spring.

 

[Into the Night]

That is some funny shit. Can you post a link to where I confused Stefan-Boltzmann with Kirchoff's law?

Trying to deny your own posts never works, Poorboy.

I will bet you cannot do so. Once again, you just fantasize about errors you think I made while denying errors you make.

Trying to deny your own posts never works.

How was I not adhering to the experiment?

RQAA.

Are you claiming that light only consists of visible light?

RQAA

It seems you are the one that is not adhering to your parameters you laid out.

Paradox. Irrational.

Or is it that you don't know the difference between light and visible light?

RQAA.

 

[IBDaMann]

That is not what the experts say.

Nope. The experts recognize Beryl as very ordinary.

Hey everybody, hurricane Beryl knocked out power in Texas! Oooooh! Aaaaah! People were inconvenienced! Ooooooh! Aaaaah!

Crepitus, you are so totally correct. This is earth-shattering. We should create a new religion: Global Blowing and Climate Wind. We could refer to Hurricane Acidification and Low Pressure Forcings as an existential threat to humanity.

It's such a good thing that you listen to "experts" who do your thinking for you, and I am so fortunate that I have you bringing these things to my attention. Thank you, from the bottom of my Climate Ground Zero.

Question: How are we going to blame Trump for Climate Change if we steal the election again?

 

[Into the Night]

That is not what the experts say.

'Expert' worship. News organizations are not 'expert's, dude. Void reference fallacy.

 

[Into the Night]

For once, I'm on your side. They don't understand thermodynamics. The First Law has to do with heat-work and usually associated with the Carnot heat engine cycle.

The 1st law of thermodynamics has nothing to do with the Carnot engine or heat.
E(t+1) = E(t) - U where 'E' is energy, 't' is time, and 'U' is work, or force applied over time. The presence of a gas is not a force and is not energy, therefore E(t+1) = E(t).

Heat is not energy. Heat is not even described or defined by this equation.

That is you have a mass at the 'cold leg,' add energy by various means raising the temperature of the mass, then transfer that on the 'hot leg' to perform 'work.' The energy expended in doing 'work' causes the mass to cool, and the cycle starts over.

Perpetual motion is not possible.

Q (or W) = m(∆T)

That is, the amount of stored energy in some mass is directly related to temperature.

Nope. A thrown baseball has kinetic energy, and it's temperature remains basically the same. A rocket that has accelerated to a high speed (relative to some observer) has tremendous kinetic energy, but it is not even burning. The rocket engine is cold.

Hold a rock high above you. It has potential energy. Does that make it warmer?

The higher the temperature of the mass, the more energy it stores.

Nope. I already provided example that falsify that notion.

In a closed system, pressure makes a difference too.

A closed system does not need a pressure vessel.

An open system can have pressure too, but this is variable, as it is in say, the planet's atmosphere.

A planet atmosphere is a closed system.

Changes in atmospheric temperature doesn't violate the First Law in any way, it works by it. That in and of itself has little to do with Gorebal Warming.

Where is the energy coming from?

 

[T. A. Gardner]

The 1st law of thermodynamics has nothing to do with the Carnot engine or heat.
E(t+1) = E(t) - U where 'E' is energy, 't' is time, and 'U' is work, or force applied over time. The presence of a gas is not a force and is not energy, therefore E(t+1) = E(t).

Heat is not energy. Heat is not even described or defined by this equation.

Perpetual motion is not possible.

Nope. A thrown baseball has kinetic energy, and it's temperature remains basically the same. A rocket that has accelerated to a high speed (relative to some observer) has tremendous kinetic energy, but it is not even burning. The rocket engine is cold.

Hold a rock high above you. It has potential energy. Does that make it warmer?


Nope. I already provided example that falsify that notion.

A closed system does not need a pressure vessel.

A planet atmosphere is a closed system.

Where is the energy coming from?

So much wrong here...

You confuse thermal energy and kinetic energy and try to make them interchangeable. They aren't. You then conflate the two in examples and make an affirming the consequent fallacy out of them.

A planetary atmosphere / climate system follows Carnot Heat Engine theory and is an open system.

Thermodynamics of the climate system

To understand Earth’s climate, think of it as a giant, planetary-scale heat engine that drives the circulation of the oceans and atmosphere.

pubs.aip.org

Whether the system is open or closed has nothing to do with where the energy in it comes from.

Khan Academy

www.khanacademy.org

I'm trying to keep this basic and simple, but it's clear you and IBDM don't understand thermodynamics and physics. Most of the time I just ignore yours and his posts because I don't want this fight. I think Gorebal Warming is mostly bullshit and more a religion than science, but that's separate from trying to explain why it is using wrong or bad science like the two of you do.

 

[Into the Night]

So much wrong here...

You cannot falsify any theory of science that way!

You confuse thermal energy and kinetic energy and try to make them interchangeable.

Never did. Word stuffing won't work.

They aren't. You then conflate the two in examples and make an affirming the consequent fallacy out of them.

Fallacy fallacy. Inversion fallacy. You cannot blame your fallacy on me or anybody else.

A planetary atmosphere / climate system follows Carnot Heat Engine theory and is an open system.

An atmosphere is a closed system. It is not a Carnot engine. All laws of thermodynamics apply to ALL systems open or closed.

Thermodynamics of the climate system

To understand Earth’s climate, think of it as a giant, planetary-scale heat engine that drives the circulation of the oceans and atmosphere.

pubs.aip.org

Whether the system is open or closed has nothing to do with where the energy in it comes from.

Yes it does. You cannot consider any energy source or sink from outside any given system.

Khan Academy

www.khanacademy.org

Science is not the Khan academy or any other website, book, paper, pamphlet, search engine, journal, academy, society, government agency, degree, title, certification, license, or any other blessing or sanctification by government or anyone else.

False authority fallacy.

I'm trying to keep this basic and simple, but it's clear you and IBDM don't understand thermodynamics and physics.

No, that apparently would be YOU, since you just recently tried to construct a perpetual motion machine of the 1st order.

Most of the time I just ignore yours and his posts because I don't want this fight.

Well, you joined a wacky religion and you denied science and mathematics, and now you have this fight. Deal with it.

I think Gorebal Warming is mostly bullshit and more a religion than science, but that's separate from trying to explain why it is using wrong or bad science like the two of you do.

The 1st and 2nd laws of thermodynamics are theories of science. They are not 'bad' science. Science is not like a bad dog.

Sorry dude, but YOU are the one that tried to construct a perpetual motion machine of the 1st order.
YOU are the one denying theories of science.

I didn't write them. I'm only showing you what they are.

At this point I have to consider you a dangerous electrician. You obviously don't know how to handle heating in wires and conduit or in devices properly. I only hope that your errors are not bad enough to start fires.

 

[Into the Night]

Nope. The 1st LoT has to do with conservation of energy. Heat is not energy and doesn't come into play. It's a good thing that science proficiency is not required to be an electrician.

A certain amount of science proficiency IS required to become an electrician in most States.

While most of the questions on State tests are about regulations and the electrical code, there ARE some questions about thermodynamics (I guess he flunked them).

Since no wire is a perfect conductor, running a current through them meets resistance to the flow. According to Ohm's law, P = I^2 R. This means current across that resistance results in watts being converted into thermal energy. The wire gets hotter.

If the wire is long enough, or if there are too many wires in an enclosed space (such as a conduit or circuit box), wires can get hot enough to damage their insulation over time and you get shorts, either to another wire or to the conduit itself (if a metal conduit).

This can cause a fire, perhaps within the enclosed space where it's difficult to get at. It can also cause a dangerous exposure to voltage, particularly if you are standing in a wet area. This is why GFCI is being required more and more. This circuit works by detecting differences of current flowing on a 'hot' wire and a 'neutral' wire. Any difference indicates current that is flowing where it shouldn't be (such as through YOU!), and GFCI shuts off the current.

Thermodynamics DOES come into electrical work. You MUST allow for proper dissipation of thermal energy. I you don't, things can get dangerous.

Transformers are windings of wire around an iron core (at these frequencies). This iron core is also a conductor, and a current flows in the core as well. This is called an 'eddy current', and it is purely wasted energy, heating the entire transformer. The more current the transformer handles, the greater the heating in the core. That typical Can that you see on a utility pole is an oil cooled transformer. It's oil cooled for a reason.

Bigger transformers found a distribution yards (where high tension wires feed transformers that in turn feed distribution lines street by street, are also oil cooled, and have that oil running through radiator fins with fans on them.

Overheating one of those suckers can get to be a spectacular display in the distribution yard! Fortunately, they have thermal shutoffs in them as well, cutting power when they get too hot.


Yes, thermodynamics is a pretty big part of electrical work. Understanding it properly is important to safe design and installation.


That said, the IBC, IRC, and NFPA76 (the electrical code) all specify what kind of wire is used where and how thick it must be, both for copper and aluminum wire, for runs typical of a house or building. These simple charts cover many situations pretty well, but they don't cover all of them. They do save you from doing the math for common installations. Fortunately, in the appendix, there is listed the resistance of certain sizes of wire in copper and again in aluminum. No other material is described. So, you CAN fake it, as long as you don't get into too weird a situation during the installation. You might say it's designed to keep dumb electricians (there are certainly very smart ones!) from getting into too much trouble.

 

[serendipity]

That is not what the experts say.

Are they experts or "experts"?

 

[IBDaMann]

A certain amount of science proficiency IS required to become an electrician in most States.

I actually don't mean to poo-poo any legal profession adding value to society, and electricians add significant value.

Having said that, I know too many immigrants who understand no science who nonetheless learned basic electrical work in their home countries and are now working as electricians here.

While most of the questions on State tests are about regulations and the electrical code, there ARE some questions about thermodynamics (I guess he flunked them).

I have never taken any electrician's exam. My gut feeing is that knowing the regulations, codes and standards is enough to get one certified.

Since no wire is a perfect conductor,

Nothing is a perfect conductor. Wait.

Wait.

If the wire is long enough, or if there are too many wires in an enclosed space (such as a conduit or circuit box), wires can get hot enough to damage their insulation over time and you get shorts, either to another wire or to the conduit itself (if a metal conduit).

I hope you're not going to tell me that there are such things as electrical fires.

This can cause a fire, perhaps within the enclosed space where it's difficult to get at.

Is there anything we can do to save our communities?

This is why GFCI is being required more and more. This circuit works by detecting differences of current flowing on a 'hot' wire and a 'neutral' wire. Any difference indicates current that is flowing where it shouldn't be (such as through YOU!), and GFCI shuts off the current.

If your house hasn't burned down, thank an electrician.

Thermodynamics DOES come into electrical work.

Don't tell anyone, but thermodynamics comes into play whenever time passes. For the moment, let's just keep this close to the vest.

Transformers are windings of wire around an iron core (at these frequencies).

I have some friends that are/were electrical engineers who built power supplies at one point (which involve transformers). I called them "wire-wrappers."

Yes, thermodynamics is a pretty big part of electrical work. Understanding it properly is important to safe design and installation.

I still think that understanding the regulations, guidelines and best practices will do the most for safe design and installation in electrical work.

That said, the IBC, IRC, and NFPA76 (the electrical code) all specify what kind of wire is used where and how thick it must be, both for copper and aluminum wire, for runs typical of a house or building. These simple charts cover many situations pretty well, but they don't cover all of them. They do save you from doing the math for common installations. Fortunately, in the appendix, there is listed the resistance of certain sizes of wire in copper and again in aluminum. No other material is described. So, you CAN fake it, as long as you don't get into too weird a situation during the installation. You might say it's designed to keep dumb electricians (there are certainly very smart ones!) from getting into too much trouble.

Absolutely. There is a lot to know and electricians are responsible for keeping it all straight. Just remember to pull the permit first.

 

[IBDaMann]

Are they experts or "experts"?

Either "experts" or "climate scientists."

 

[moon]

Not the point. The hole in the ozone layer at the S. Pole is naturally occurring. Scientists claimed it is man-made. That has been proven wrong.

4 ways the ozone hole is linked to climate, and 1 way it isn’t

The ozone hole didn't cause global warming, but climate and the ozone hole are related in other ways.

www.climate.gov

2023 ozone hole ranks 12th largest on record, find NOAA and NASA

Hunga-Tonga eruption likely contributed to this year's ozone depletion

www.noaa.gov

That is, the hole gets bigger and smaller, but it exists.

On the other hand, the scientists have moved the goal posts. When their original claims that the hole would close by 2000-ish and that didn't happen. Now they're claiming 2050. Well, we're halfway there and the hole is the same goddamned size it's been, sometimes even bigger. Seems to me that they're full of shit and in 2050 they'll just move the goal posts to say, 2100...

So you're happy to stroll around Australian beaches in your jocks then. Good luck. Rub in some cooking oil.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

I don't feel like doing any looking. You can do the looking. Go find your post in which you discussed the emissivity of materials/substances. Then you'll have your answer.

As per your usual modus operandi, you simply make claims without any supporting evidence. And then simply tell others to do your work.

 

[Crepitus]

So the air is colder than usual for the Atlantic. Makes sense, considering the long and wet spring.

The what is what now?

Are you functionally retarded or just brainwashed?