DO LIBERALS SUFFER FROM COGNITIVE DISSONANCE?????

[RB 60]

How much though? Because many have been evaluated, and it's not "much". https://getoutofdebt.org/47479/welfare-and-benefit-fraud-statistics-show-a-disturbing-pattern



Any taxes on the middle class will be marginal compared to the taxes on the ultra rich. There's also savings to them as well depending on which program we're talking about.



Waste is inevitable, there's never a guarantee of 100% efficiency. Yes we should not fund fraud or waste, but the massive cuts presented by the GOP are not a proportional response.



It can be argued in some instances questioning the nature of recipients is a waste of money. https://thinkprogress.org/states-co...cants-welfare-2018-results-data-0fe9649fa0f8/

I see it here in small towns, it must be prevalent in large cities. The waste is there, why not eliminate it?

So you admit the middle class would get taxed. I thought it was just the "rich"?

Questioning recipients is not a waste of money, not questioning them is. Why should I give you the dollar I earned if you are not a citizen or can earn one yourself?

 

[Casual Leftist]

I see it here in small towns, it must be prevalent in large cities. The waste is there, why not eliminate it?

It's about accurately measuring the scope of fraud, your perception bias doesn't interest me. Welfare offices usually have fraud detection departments. Once it is discovered it's usually cut off. But the statistically rare occurrence of fraud is used as a boogieman to justify massive spending cuts to social programs that have proven cost savings to society. The same party is more concerned about the potential waste generated through welfare spending far more than they're concerned about waste from ever expanding the Pentagon budget. Not to mention they turn a blind eye to corporate welfare and outdated subsidies.

So you admit the middle class would get taxed. I thought it was just the "rich"?

It obviously depends on what income bracket we're defining as rich vs middle class. According to Bernietax.com if I'm single and make $75,000 per year with the average annual healthcare spending I'll actually have $127 more in disposable income compared to the current system. https://www.bernietax.com/#75000;2639;s If there are additional taxes they are outweighed by the savings, thus a non-issue IMO.

Questioning recipients is not a waste of money, not questioning them is. Why should I give you the dollar I earned if you are not a citizen or can earn one yourself?

So Jesus wasted his time in not questioning those who he fed and healed? Well at least we've settled Jesus's position on welfare. The question you've asked has been asked by many before, and the motivation is based in assuming welfare recipients are lazy and fraudulent despite the lack of evidence. It's like when people say we need tighter election security because millions of illegals vote when in reality there's no evidence of such wide spread abuse and tightening election rules comes at the cost of making it harder for citizens to vote. You don't help people by assuming they're lazy criminals and instituting massive cuts that cost the people way more than it saves them. There's trimming the fat versus cutting off the limb. If conservatives really cared about fraud and waste without wanting to attack the program itself they'd invest more in fraud detection, not sweeping cuts to the programs themselves.

 

[Casual Leftist]

I thought it was just the "rich"?

Also if you look at my original post, I didn't say "just".

 

[CFM]

It's about accurately measuring the scope of fraud, your perception bias doesn't interest me. Welfare offices usually have fraud detection departments. Once it is discovered it's usually cut off. But the statistically rare occurrence of fraud is used as a boogieman to justify massive spending cuts to social programs that have proven cost savings to society. The same party is more concerned about the potential waste generated through welfare spending far more than they're concerned about waste from ever expanding the Pentagon budget. Not to mention they turn a blind eye to corporate welfare and outdated subsidies.



It obviously depends on what income bracket we're defining as rich vs middle class. According to Bernietax.com if I'm single and make $75,000 per year with the average annual healthcare spending I'll actually have $127 more in disposable income compared to the current system. https://www.bernietax.com/#75000;2639;s If there are additional taxes they are outweighed by the savings, thus a non-issue IMO.



So Jesus wasted his time in not questioning those who he fed and healed? Well at least we've settled Jesus's position on welfare. The question you've asked has been asked by many before, and the motivation is based in assuming welfare recipients are lazy and fraudulent despite the lack of evidence. It's like when people say we need tighter election security because millions of illegals vote when in reality there's no evidence of such wide spread abuse and tightening election rules comes at the cost of making it harder for citizens to vote. You don't help people by assuming they're lazy criminals and instituting massive cuts that cost the people way more than it saves them. There's trimming the fat versus cutting off the limb. If conservatives really cared about fraud and waste without wanting to attack the program itself they'd invest more in fraud detection, not sweeping cuts to the programs themselves.

When Jesus fed and healed people, he didn't go about funding it by taking something from someone else. Glad you could be educated on that, sock.

 

[Daddyo]

Social programs as in welfare spending, the thing you claim is being wasted on the illegals and lazy.



Is this some sort of reference to trickle down economics? The middle class is far removed from the multi-billionaire class.



You say "too much" as if you know what it is. Do small amounts of waste justify massive cuts or outright ending the programs? And if you acknowledged the percent of waste is small, what does that say about the majority of social programs?



Rome didn't have a comparable welfare system to the modern US. When they gave bread to the poor it was to avoid class riots. But are you implying the US should be more like Rome and question the nature of recipients?

Why should I work to support someone ANYONE capable of working?

Why should I work to support someone ANYONE here illegally?

Why do you feel it ok to steal via taxation money that I earned? Did you help me earn it? Did you provide me a service?

When someone ANYONE makes a bad life choice why am I punished for it as if I had done it myself?

This is why I could never be a liberal. In this life the only thing we have is our sweat equity. What we can earn with our labor. To take that sweat and give it to someone unwilling to sweat for themselves is simply despicable.

You liberals are nothing more than parasites. We are the host. You wanna be sucked on by capable people give up your life blood your sweat.

I dont give a shit what jesus would do. It's not a very realistic question given his ability to make chicken salad out of chicken shit. What helps the lazy or illegal is taken stolen removed by threat or force from the worker. Jesus likely would have a problem with that I'm sure.

 

[Daddyo]

I see it here in small towns, it must be prevalent in large cities. The waste is there, why not eliminate it?

So you admit the middle class would get taxed. I thought it was just the "rich"?

Questioning recipients is not a waste of money, not questioning them is. Why should I give you the dollar I earned if you are not a citizen or can earn one yourself?

Fraud and waste is rampant and a big chunk of any budget. I see it everyday in my business. From the selling of food stamps to false reporting to qualify for bennies. Doctors defraud government. SSI fraud just incredible. The list would shock us but its billions per year.

Example I worked at a pawnshop decades ago. Government gave free window shaker air conditioners to public housing residents for free. They had a government program back then. These units began to get pawned. Dozens we had to stop taking them for fear of a glut.

Was also approached 100's of times to purchase food stamps for 1/2 price.

A sorta friend changed his address and claimed to be seperated from his wife for SSI bennies.

The list is long. Liberals dont care because many of them are on welfare or in the fraud game. The rest are just idiots to the game.

 

[Iolo/Penderyn]

How about you be a good kid and give us a working example of such a wonderful socialist society.[/

How could I when your storm-troopers massacre the participants when they start, from the Paris Commune on? Capitalism = murder, always.

 

[RB 60]

It's about accurately measuring the scope of fraud, your perception bias doesn't interest me. Welfare offices usually have fraud detection departments. Once it is discovered it's usually cut off. But the statistically rare occurrence of fraud is used as a boogieman to justify massive spending cuts to social programs that have proven cost savings to society. The same party is more concerned about the potential waste generated through welfare spending far more than they're concerned about waste from ever expanding the Pentagon budget. Not to mention they turn a blind eye to corporate welfare and outdated subsidies.



It obviously depends on what income bracket we're defining as rich vs middle class. According to Bernietax.com if I'm single and make $75,000 per year with the average annual healthcare spending I'll actually have $127 more in disposable income compared to the current system. https://www.bernietax.com/#75000;2639;s If there are additional taxes they are outweighed by the savings, thus a non-issue IMO.



So Jesus wasted his time in not questioning those who he fed and healed? Well at least we've settled Jesus's position on welfare. The question you've asked has been asked by many before, and the motivation is based in assuming welfare recipients are lazy and fraudulent despite the lack of evidence. It's like when people say we need tighter election security because millions of illegals vote when in reality there's no evidence of such wide spread abuse and tightening election rules comes at the cost of making it harder for citizens to vote. You don't help people by assuming they're lazy criminals and instituting massive cuts that cost the people way more than it saves them. There's trimming the fat versus cutting off the limb. If conservatives really cared about fraud and waste without wanting to attack the program itself they'd invest more in fraud detection, not sweeping cuts to the programs themselves.

Your overlooking waste doesn't interest me. Nor does your digression from the topic.

So then, don't say it's just the "rich" who will ultimately get the burden of your "plan." The middle class will also suffer. That is a fact.

Jesus's position will never be settled since he isn't here to give his opinion. I highly doubt you can speak for him.
It's not difficult to determine if someone isn't a citizen or has been on the rolls for an extended period of time.

 

[Scut Farkus]

That wasn't an option. Loving91390 said "If you aren’t for a wall ... than you are for open borders ....."

Between those two options, Jesus would have been for open borders. The Bible is pretty clear about that. Personally, I'm for a wall, but I'm not Christian.

jesus would have sharted on your party shoes.

 

[Scut Farkus]

these christian haters quote jesus more than anyone. ignorance is a rush, they feel.

 

[Iolo/Penderyn]

these christian haters quote jesus more than anyone. ignorance is a rush, they feel.

American 'Christians', as far as one can tell, have never read the New Testament except for Revelations. Those who have reacted against the various strange sects do tend to respect Jesus because they have.

 

[Scut Farkus]

American 'Christians', as far as one can tell, have never read the New Testament except for Revelations. Those who have reacted against the various strange sects do tend to respect Jesus because they have.

ok, betsy. keep crying.

 

[Iolo/Penderyn]

ok, betsy. keep crying.

Sorry, mate - don't speak Backwoods.

 

[Phantasmal]

these christian haters quote jesus more than anyone. ignorance is a rush, they feel.

Do you love Jesus? You use to condemn religion, were you “saved”?

 

[Casual Leftist]

Your overlooking waste doesn't interest me. Nor does your digression from the topic.

What digression? I've presented my points clearly with citation. Seeing how you've been misquoting both Jesus and I, I don't think anything I type interests you over your preferred strawman interpretation.

So then, don't say it's just the "rich" who will ultimately get the burden of your "plan." The middle class will also suffer. That is a fact.

As I pointed out in post #123 I never said "just" the rich. And how is there suffering if there's net financial gain?

Jesus's position will never be settled since he isn't here to give his opinion. I highly doubt you can speak for him.

And yet you had no trouble making up a quote from him to help your argument.

It's not difficult to determine if someone isn't a citizen or has been on the rolls for an extended period of time.

Indeed, and yet you've failed to even attempt to show what percentage of welfare spending goes to these people.

 

[RB 60]

What digression? I've presented my points clearly with citation. Seeing how you've been misquoting both Jesus and I, I don't think anything I type interests you over your preferred strawman interpretation.



As I pointed out in post #123 I never said "just" the rich. And how is there suffering if there's net financial gain?

Jesus's position will never be settled since he isn't here to give his opinion. I highly doubt you can speak for him.

And yet you had no trouble making up a quote from him to help your argument.



Indeed, and yet you've failed to even attempt to show what percentage of welfare spending goes to these people.

You blurted off on the Pentagon budget, corporate welfare and outdated subsidies. None of which has anything to do with social program's waste.
I never quoted Jesus and never misquoted you. It was you who said "Well at least we've settled Jesus's position on welfare" when in fact it was
I who said it wasn't "settled" because Jesus isn't here to speak. Again, you need not divert from the topic being discussed. It's a sign you're losing.

Why shouldn't we find and remove these people who are wasting our tax dollars? What percentage of theft and fraud allowable?

 

[RB 60]

When Jesus fed and healed people, he didn't go about funding it by taking something from someone else. Glad you could be educated on that, sock.

He's a sock, there's no denying that.

 

[CFM]

He's a sock, there's no denying that.

That is clear based on his join date.

katzgar and Micawber are banned but don't think for a minute that the ones behind those two profiles are gone.

 

[Saudade]

Bernie Sanders understood that at one point. I hope he still does. I really hope he's only pretending to be for open borders to get the nomination.

That's possible, but Sanders has caved on many things before.

 

[Nordberg]

I guess you rightys are swamp prone. Trump SAID he was going to clean the swamp and you dorks believed it. Trump has poured industry insiders into the agencies . But at rallies, he says he has cleaned the swamp and you idiots applaud and scream. I know you will never learn. https://www.opensecrets.org/trump/lobbyists Trump has buried is in lobbyists, He is using you low info voters like the children you are.