Litmus
Verified User
I thought you were debating about whether or not your group should be exposed to the truth or not, my bad.
do you think building 7 coming straight down with little apparent damage is at least curious?
From Freedom To Fascism
- Thread starter Beefy
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I thought you were debating about whether or not your group should be exposed to the truth or not, my bad.
do you think building 7 coming straight down with little apparent damage is at least curious?
I am not an engineer. I have spoken to engineers who do not believe it was curious, and others who believe it was. Not being an engineer myself, I am not qualified to make a conclusion one way or the other.
The damage was apparent. What this denies is the actual code that requires the buildings in that area to be designed to drop within their footprint because failure otherwise would cause damage and death to thousands more because the building would damage nearby structure.
That the building fell as it did was a testimony to the designer, not to some odd conspiracy to destroy that building in particular.
Litmus
Verified User
How about orders to fighter pilots to stand down? also lies and manipulation?
That is what my fiance said at the time, and he is an engineer. I have since talked to others who are also engineers, and they do not all agree, but enough seem to, and again, how the hell am I supposed to know?
But, if any one of those buildings had toppled, or God forbid one of the towers, the death toll would be unimaginable, so it makes sense they were designed that way.
Litmus
Verified User
http://patriotsquestion911.com/engineers.html
"Research proves the current administration has been dishonest about what happened in New York and Washington, D.C. The World Trade Center was almost certainly brought down by controlled demolitions and that the available relevant evidence casts grave doubt on the government's official story about the attack on the Pentagon."
"Research proves the current administration has been dishonest about what happened in New York and Washington, D.C. The World Trade Center was almost certainly brought down by controlled demolitions and that the available relevant evidence casts grave doubt on the government's official story about the attack on the Pentagon."
The same military that can't keep stacks of naked muslims quiet can, in this case, keep such an order quiet so that the only place it appears is on the blogspots? Rubbish.
If such an order actually came down, it would be far more widely publicized than on conspiracy-related blogspots. The Press would have orgasms as they wrote about it.
Litmus
Verified User
problem is, people turn their minds off to uncomfortable thoughts, so even when it comes down, they screen out everything that makes them uncomfortable.
SO all those engineers who find problems are just partisan liars? is that it? Or maybe there's a shred of doubt here.
These people are retarded. Especially about the attack on the Pentagon. Can you imagine the amount of people that would have to be "in on" a Conspiracy of this size?
The Air Traffic Controllers would have to "pretend" that they didn't see a different airplane than what was supposed to take off. The "passengers" would all have to be killed, slaughtered really, and actors or the "passengers" themselves, before being slaughtered by the government-controlled conspiracy, would have to make all those phone calls that were clearly made from the "airplanes". Three airplanes, from different airlines, would have to be destroyed somehow when they had never taken off, yet were clearly seen through airport windows as "passengers" boarded.
We can go on and on and on... But by the time you were done thousands of people would have to be in on the "conspiracy" and it somehow would still be quiet?
I am not that gullible.
I personally never said there wasn't a shred of doubt.
It doesn't matter. It would never be proved. If there is something there, they will still be arguing about it 100 years from now, and it will change nothing. All it does is make you look crazy, and a peace activist cannot afford to look crazy, whereas, looking crazy is obviously not a concern of yours.
And, the people I know who believe this, this woman being a prime example of it, are all crazy. All of them. Bug fuck nuts. About all kinds of things. So, that too tells me something.
I personally do not believe this adminstration to be competent enough to pull this off, but if I am wrong, and decided I was wrong, and ran around screaming "9/11 was an inside job!" what would I change? Nothing. I would not stop one war, end one war, save one life, change one mind.
Litmus
Verified User
It's not quiet, you have your ears clogged with stubborness. IT'S OUT, but you're too much of a goody two shoes.
please stop embarrassing yourself.
"patriotsquestion911.com"???
Surly you jest. Just as with the global warming denialists, anyone can make a website no one's ever heard of, and round up a few people with engineering degrees from around the planet to support your case.
That's not science.
Highly reputable, and credible scientific sources have already published studies on the WTC collapse. With the backing of mainstream american engineering associations and trade groups.
I noticed a lot of the people on your website weren't even civil or structual engineers. I mean, a geologic engineer? Don't make me laugh. This is the game the global warming denialists play.
No, you gullible paranoid, it isn't "out there". Such a conspiracy wouldn't have the "grassy knoll" type of thing, it is simply too large. There would be people out there talking on MSM regularly, it would be all over, impeachment long ago would have happened.
You have to be super gullible to believe that only blogspots would be on this, including foreign media. You have to ignore way too much that is still "questionable" because there is no smoking gun. There wouldn't have just been one, but many, many, many "smoking guns" by now.
Litmus
Verified User
It's not too large. That's just an irrational statement. Many people of science find problems. To consider all of them stupid or partisan for bringing up legitimate questions is too far for me. Take off the rose colored glasses. Truth is beter than lies.
On one side we have:
The National Institute of Standards and Technology
supported by
Structural Engineering Institute of the American Society of Civil Engineers (SEI/ASCE)
Society of Fire Protection Engineers (SFPE)
National Fire Protection Association (NFPA)
American Institute of Steel Construction (AISC)
Council on Tall Buildings and Urban Habitat (CTBUH)
Structural Engineers Association of New York (SEAoNY)
*ON THE OTHER SIDE WE HAVE:
anonymous poster Asshat
and "Patriotsquestion911.com"
LOL
The National Institute of Standards and Technology
supported by
Structural Engineering Institute of the American Society of Civil Engineers (SEI/ASCE)
Society of Fire Protection Engineers (SFPE)
National Fire Protection Association (NFPA)
American Institute of Steel Construction (AISC)
Council on Tall Buildings and Urban Habitat (CTBUH)
Structural Engineers Association of New York (SEAoNY)
*ON THE OTHER SIDE WE HAVE:
anonymous poster Asshat
and "Patriotsquestion911.com"
LOL
Litmus
Verified User
the engineers at the link i gave are also legitimate. Your brain is utterly switched off. get on.
You are a gullible who will believe anything at all so long as it makes any government entity look "evil". It doesn't mean that there aren't real conspiracies, just that you will fall for even the most incredulous ones that are possible and thus make ones with actual evidence look like "wide-eyed nuts" are the only ones that believe them.
Your Geologic Engineer has no idea how to design a building, or of the zoning laws where high-rise buildings exist. It is stupid to take their word over a large group of actual structural engineers who studied this and point out exactly what I say to be true. The buildings there are ALL designed to collapse into themselves to limit damage to nearby buildings int he case of failure.
I can find people with "science degrees" that still deny global warming, moron.
And I can find wierdo sites no ones ever heard of, that deny global warming with said "scientists".
That's neither a valid, nor adequate use of the scientific method or engineering analysis.
Litmus
Verified User
That was one dude. There are hundreds with questions. this case isn't closed.
btw, that was an adhominem defense. deal with the issues.
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In my opinion, it is quite rational to believe that when you put together the PNAC listing as the event needed to initiate their mid-east makeover, being "another pearl harbor", the fact that there is documented evidence that this administration was warned, and unlike the previous administration and as documented by Richard Clarke, did not go into a prevent mode, and in fact did nothing, and many other reasons, all of which indicate that this administration knew there was a high-probablity of a terrrorist attack that summer, and allowed it to happen by doing nothing to prevent it.
And that is enough, that more than enough, that is more terrible than most will ever allow themselves to imagine, but I believe that is what happened, and you cannot even go there, because then you are put into the category of someone who believes that the fbi, on direct orders from bush, was stacking the lobby of the wtc with explosives for 3 weeks before 9/11.
And that is enough, that more than enough, that is more terrible than most will ever allow themselves to imagine, but I believe that is what happened, and you cannot even go there, because then you are put into the category of someone who believes that the fbi, on direct orders from bush, was stacking the lobby of the wtc with explosives for 3 weeks before 9/11.