Leaving Iraq, Honorably

[maineman]

could you please indicate to me which of those in the picture are shiites, which are sunnis and which are kurds?

According to the voting numbers, the majority are Shiites, then Kurds, and then Sunnis. They are certainly all reperesented in the Unity Government elected by 12 million Iraqi citizens. Can you show me which Iraqi's are fighting each other in the pictures?

Let's review the conversation....I said:

"You continue to attempt to suggest that there are all of these freedom loving Iraqis - shiites, sunnis, kurds - who have all had this giant group hug, sung three verses of kumbaya and are standing as one against these "foreign backed insurgents". "

to which you replied by posting a picture that shows folks with purple fingers and added this comment:

"I don't know about group hugs or kumbaya, but these Iraqi's seem to be 'standing as one' with their purple fingers. "

By "these Iraqis", I assumed you meant the Iraqis in the photograph. If your photo was meant as a response and riposte to my statement, I ask you again to show me which of those Iraqis are shiites, kurds and sunnis. For all I know, the photo shows a group of all one sect. No one is doubting that members of all three sects voted in elections. For you to suggest that that action precludes any sectarian civil war is as ridiculous as claiming that the voting in America in the 1860 election between Lincoln and Douglas made our civil war impossible to have happened.

 

[Onceler]

Your second picture appears to be taken from Kurdistan, which is almost 100% kurdish. Note the kid holding the PDK sign. PDK is a separatist kurdish independence group. I suspect everyone in that photo is kurdish.

I'm sure Dixie knows that, too; this is probably just another one of his "green zone" things where he's intentionally saying the wrong thing just to test our knowledge...

 

[maineman]

that picture tells the entire story? that picture somehow proves that it is nasty foreign backed insurgents battling this brave groups of sunnis, shiites, and kurds? that picture proves that sunnis and shiites in Iraq are not fighting one another?

I said nothing about "nasty" foreign backed insurgents, or "brave groups" of sunnis, shiites and kurds. Those are your words, and I suppose you chose them for a reason. Perhaps it was to evoke an emotional picture of how you want to twist my words? The Unity Government, certainly represents a "brave group of sunnis, shiites, and kurds" because that is what it's comprised of. The insurgency is certainly being funded and aided by outside influences, regardless of whether they have had a recent bath.

the "unity government" doesn't govern anything. the members of the unity government are very united and the larger society of sunnis, kurds, and shiites is anything but united. the country is coming unglued, dixie. you need to admit that. the sects within Iraq are fighting one another. everyone in the middle east calls it a civil war.... even members of your own party are calling it a civil war. both sides of this civil war are receiving assistance from outside of Iraq. that does not mean that the Iraqis that are fighting each other are not engaged in a civil war....they are.

 

[Cypress]

DIXIE: "According to the voting numbers, the majority are Shiites, then Kurds, and then Sunnis. They are certainly all reperesented in the Unity Government elected by 12 million Iraqi citizens. Can you show me which Iraqi's are fighting each other in the pictures?"

Your second picture appears to be taken from Kurdistan, which is almost 100% kurdish. Note the kid holding the PDK sign. PDK is a separatist kurdish independence group. I suspect everyone in that photo is kurdish.

Yep, that picture is on the freerpublic website, and is from Dohuk, Iraq which is in the northern kurdish provinces. And it appears to be from 2003, shortly after kurdistan was liberated. The photo therefore shows kurdish citizens.



http://www.cfpeople.org/military/GOTTA SEE THIS - 4-12-03.htm

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Oh...I didn't realize! Does that picture represent "the current situation in Iraq" to you? Is that the planet that you reside upon?

Would you like some new pictures, Dix? If you would like, I can find a few that might open your eyes a bit on this subject. Of course, you would actually have to LOOK at them, first...

You mean, like this one...

It's a picture of Iraqis exhuming the remains of corpses in one of Saddam's hundreds of mass graves across Iraq.

 

[Cypress]

DIXIE: "According to the voting numbers, the majority are Shiites, then Kurds, and then Sunnis. They are certainly all reperesented in the Unity Government elected by 12 million Iraqi citizens. Can you show me which Iraqi's are fighting each other in the pictures?"





Yep, that picture is on the freerpublic website, and is from Dohuk, Iraq which is in the northern kurdish provinces. And it appears to be from 2003, shortly after kurdistan was liberated. The photo therefore shows kurdish citizens.



http://www.cfpeople.org/military/GOTTA SEE THIS - 4-12-03.htm

Dixie, anyone can find photos of Kurds worshipping americans. Particualarly in the aftermath of the 2003 invasion. Which is what your photo of kurdistan shows. Kurds have always been pro-american.


It was fairly dishonest of you to try to pass this old photo off as a recent photo of a happy and mulit-ethnic (sunni, shia, kurd) group of Iraqis worshipping america.

 

[Onceler]

"It's a picture of Iraqis exhuming the remains of corpses in one of Saddam's hundreds of mass graves across Iraq."

Yeah, Saddam was a bad dude, alright. No argument there.

It would have been an interesting national debate to have...to take Saddam out NOT because he represented any sort of threat to America or was a part of the war on terror, but to commit 150,000 troops & a half trillion on a strictly humanitarian mission. Is that what your new rationale for all of this is?

Did Bush lie, Dixie?

And what of the other humanitarian crises going on in the world right now, and the other "bad dudes" who are responsible for mass graves...will our military now be used on a neverending mission to rid the world of "badness"?

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Your second picture appears to be taken from Kurdistan...Yep, that picture is on the freerpublic website, and is from Dohuk, Iraq which is in the northern kurdish provinces. And it appears to be from 2003, shortly after kurdistan was liberated. The photo therefore shows kurdish citizens.

I know you are retarded, and I hate to burst your bubble here, but there is no such nation as "Kurdistan". The Kurds are one of the major ethnic groups which comprise Iraq, and to simply discount them as insignificant, speaks volumes for where your heart is. Saddam didn't consider them "Iraqis" either.

 

[uscitizen]

Any WMD's in those pics ? Bush says we still can't leave till the mission is accompolished....

 

[Cypress]

Your second picture appears to be taken from Kurdistan...Yep, that picture is on the freerpublic website, and is from Dohuk, Iraq which is in the northern kurdish provinces. And it appears to be from 2003, shortly after kurdistan was liberated. The photo therefore shows kurdish citizens.

I know you are retarded, and I hate to burst your bubble here, but there is no such nation as "Kurdistan". The Kurds are one of the major ethnic groups which comprise Iraq, and to simply discount them as insignificant, speaks volumes for where your heart is. Saddam didn't consider them "Iraqis" either.

Someone asked you if your photo represented a broad, multicultural and multiethnic snapshot of collegial and happy iraqis - sunni, shia, and kurd.

You lied. You implied that the photo was multiethnic,, and you cited the statistics for the ethnicities in iraq.

It took me two minutes to find out that the photo was in one of the kurdish provinces in a town that is probably close to 100% kurdish. And the photo is OLD VINTAGE ....from right after US forces took the kurdish provinces in 2003.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

the "unity government" doesn't govern anything. the members of the unity government are very united and the larger society of sunnis, kurds, and shiites is anything but united.


Your statements are becoming more and more convoluted. The Unity Government most certainly does govern Iraq, as they were elected to do! The members are regular Sunnis, Shiites, and Kurds, who were elected by regular Iraqi citizens in a fair national democratic election. More than 70% of the country participated in this process, so we can assume that at least 70% are supportive of having a Unity Government, and are, in fact, "united."

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

It took me two minutes to find out that the photo was in one of the kurdish provinces in a town that is probably close to 100% kurdish. And the photo is OLD VINTAGE ....from right after US forces to the kurdish provinces in 2003.

LMAO... 2003 is now "old vintage?"

Look, let's get something straight. There is no nation of Kurdistan, there are no 'Kurdistani' people, and the persons in the photo are IRAQI CITIZENS. What percentage of them are which group, I don't really give a shit, they look pretty "unified" to me. I know for a fact, Sunnis, Shiites, and Kurds, voted in the elections and have representation in the Unity Government, and I haven't seen a picture of any Iraq ashamed to show off their purple finger.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Any WMD's in those pics ? Bush says we still can't leave till the mission is accompolished....

Hey US, I know it's frustrating, but you will have to argue on some other point, that one has been settled. No, there are no WMD's in those pictures, they are probably in Syria, where they've been since we invaded. Can we stick to the current debate of what to do in Iraq now, and stop reverting back to "old vintage" times, as Prissy would say?

 

[Onceler]

"Can we stick to the current debate of what to do in Iraq now, and stop reverting back to "old vintage" times, as Prissy would say?"

You mean like digging up old pictures of Saddam's mass graves when you've been cornered about the current situation in Iraq? Couldn't agree more.

And the WMD question HAS been "settled"...we agree again. You & Bush were wrong. Nice going...sorry if it bugs you that we tend to bring that one up. I've got a hunch you're not going to like the investigation into that one too much, either...

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

And what of the other humanitarian crises going on in the world right now, and the other "bad dudes" who are responsible for mass graves...will our military now be used on a neverending mission to rid the world of "badness"?

You know, I am sure this argument makes perfect sense to a flaming liberal, but I just don't get it. Since when does bad behavior excuse more bad behavior? Do you understand, people made the exact same argument about Hitler in the late 1930's?

From your perspective, you can see no viable reason for going into Iraq, except that Saddam was a "bad guy" and that isn't good enough for you. Well, guess what? It's not good enough for me either, or anyone else, which is why you pull it out of your ass and throw it into the debate. The fact of the matter is, there are many viable and fundamental reasons for removing the Saddam regime and replacing it with Democracy, and you can read Clinton's Iraq Liberation Act of 1998, to get the full picture.

I would say, anytime we have a 'bad guy' who thumbs his nose at UN sanctions and international law, trains, aids and harbors terrorists, and continues to have ambitions of building arsenals of WMD's and nukes, which he has proven to have no problem using on his own people, it's not a bad idea to take his ass out before he becomes a major threat, and before millions have to die.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

And the WMD question HAS been "settled"...we agree again. You & Bush were wrong.

Well, you are free to think this, too bad you can't prove it. Lack of finding, is not proof of non-existence, and never will be. You have bought into an illusion, I am afraid. I can't prove that either, so we have no way of knowing who was right and who was wrong, but the issue is settled because it doesn't matter at this point. It's moot.

 

[DigitalDave]

And the WMD question HAS been "settled"...we agree again. You & Bush were wrong.

Well, you are free to think this, too bad you can't prove it. Lack of finding, is not proof of non-existence, and never will be. You have bought into an illusion, I am afraid. I can't prove that either, so we have no way of knowing who was right and who was wrong, but the issue is settled because it doesn't matter at this point. It's moot.

Saddam is a magic man, yes? I support your War of Terror, and Saddam must stop performing crap magic.

 

[Onceler]

"thumbs his nose at UN sanctions "

Most of the resolutions the UN issued asked Saddam to disarm Iraq of WMD's. He did.

"trains, aids and harbors terrorists"

Why do you continue to lie about that?


"continues to have ambitions of building arsenals of WMD's and nukes"

It's not the dreaming of them that matters, Dixie; it's the HAVING them, and the ability to develop them that really counts when you put so many lives on the line.

Like Powell & Condi Rice both said in 2001 - Saddam was contained, and not even a threat to his immediate neighbors. Because of the decision to take him out, we are not in an almost untenable situation, where our reputation is greatly diminished, and we are actually LESS SAFE. Not sure if you comprehend that, but I've stopped caring about what you can & cannot comprehend. As your signature states, you no longer qualify as a human being...

 

[DigitalDave]

Most of the resolutions the UN issued asked Saddam to disarm Iraq of WMD's. He did.

You are crazy! He still had bullets!

Like Powell & Condi Rice both said in 2001 - Saddam was contained, and not even a threat to his immediate neighbors. Because of the decision to take him out, we are not in an almost untenable situation, where our reputation is greatly diminished, and we are actually LESS SAFE. Not sure if you comprehend that, but I've stopped caring about what you can & cannot comprehend. As your signature states, you no longer qualify as a human being...

AHHH, Once again, Saddam performs crap magic. We put him in a box and he finds way to escape.

 

[Onceler]

And the WMD question HAS been "settled"...we agree again. You & Bush were wrong.

Well, you are free to think this, too bad you can't prove it. Lack of finding, is not proof of non-existence, and never will be. You have bought into an illusion, I am afraid. I can't prove that either, so we have no way of knowing who was right and who was wrong, but the issue is settled because it doesn't matter at this point. It's moot.

Of all the pathetic, desperate arguments you make, this is the MOST pathetic & desperate. You've gotta be on the constant, intravenously pumped koolaid to stick with this one...