Leaving Iraq, Honorably

the "unity government" doesn't govern anything. the members of the unity government are very united and the larger society of sunnis, kurds, and shiites is anything but united.


Your statements are becoming more and more convoluted. The Unity Government most certainly does govern Iraq, as they were elected to do! The members are regular Sunnis, Shiites, and Kurds, who were elected by regular Iraqi citizens in a fair national democratic election. More than 70% of the country participated in this process, so we can assume that at least 70% are supportive of having a Unity Government, and are, in fact, "united."

they may have been elected for the purpose of governing Iraq, but only koolaid soaked bushlickers like you would suggest that they are, in fact, "governing" anything. Again...the fact that 70% of Iraqis voted in the election does not preclude civil war. How many Americans from states north and south of the masonj-dixon line voted in the 1860 election?
 
they may have been elected for the purpose of governing Iraq, but only koolaid soaked bushlickers like you would suggest that they are, in fact, "governing" anything. Again...the fact that 70% of Iraqis voted in the election does not preclude civil war. How many Americans from states north and south of the masonj-dixon line voted in the 1860 election?

wrong thread.......ignore
 
Give me the country life where I can vacate intestinal gas in my yard without getting arrested.
The country where "private" property still has just a bit of meaning.
I can hang up any kind of wreath on my home that I want to without being fined.
 
The fact of the matter is that, regardless of how bad a guy Saddam was, he was not a threat to the United States. He didn't have a FUCKING thing to do with 9/11. And regardless of how bad a guy he was, he was VERY good at keeping the lid on sectarian tensions in his country so that they did not spread to the rest of the middle east - which would and will be bad for the United States. He was VERY good at keeping Islamic extremists out of his country - something the US is incredibly inept at doing. He was very good at keeping a lid on Iranian regional aspirations - something that the US is incredibly inept at doing. As bad a guy as Saddam was, the United States would be better off - on a variety of fronts - if we had NOT invaded Iraq and we had left Saddam alone and concentrated, instead, on rooting out and destroying the terrorist groups who attacked us and are, no doubt, plotting to do so again.
 
It took me two minutes to find out that the photo was in one of the kurdish provinces in a town that is probably close to 100% kurdish. And the photo is OLD VINTAGE ....from right after US forces to the kurdish provinces in 2003.

LMAO... 2003 is now "old vintage?"

Look, let's get something straight. There is no nation of Kurdistan, there are no 'Kurdistani' people, and the persons in the photo are IRAQI CITIZENS. What percentage of them are which group, I don't really give a shit, they look pretty "unified" to me. I know for a fact, Sunnis, Shiites, and Kurds, voted in the elections and have representation in the Unity Government, and I haven't seen a picture of any Iraq ashamed to show off their purple finger.

I guess it's therapeutic for you to look at and post old picutures from 2003 of happy Kurds welcoming american troops. I suppose it can kind of remind you of the glory days, when Democrats were on the wrong side of History and Bush was the next Abe Lincoln.

But, its sad to see you doing this:

Its like watching the middle-aged former high school quarterback flipping through the photos in his school yearbook, and wistfully fingering his dog-eared Lettermens jacket from 1974 - trying to relive his glory days.
 
I was dead against this war from when they first started talking about it. But once we went in, for a time, I thought that we had a moral obligation to stay so as not to leave the people of Iraq with this huge mess.

However, as time has passed, I have realized something very ugly, something that Americans are going to need to come around to understanding. We cannot leave Iraq honorably. We cannot fix things in Iraq. We have destroyed Iraq. It is not fixable. It is destroyed. The entire face of the Mid-east is being changed, and will continue to change, because of what we have done in Iraq. Iran will only get stronger and stronger. Other countries may, and probably will be drawn in as the genocide against the Sunnis widens and finally must be called a genocide. What will the other Sunni nations do in response? What will the final result of a strong Iran be? How far throughout the mid east will this war widen to? Those are the only questions that remain.

America can do nothing, except continue to die, and continue to kill there. Or leave. But it will not be "honorably".

It is destroyed. The true price has yet to be calculated, and perhaps, even to be imagined.

That is bush's legacy. And that is now America's legacy.

But some of this blowback, will blowback our way. And on the day that Americans again die on our own soil, do not forget to be a good American, throw up your arms, and demand of the skies "Why do they hate us?" And when someone tells you, "they hate us because of our freedoms" don't forget to nod thoughtfully, wait a beat, and then say "we must invade!"
 
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darla..... darling....one of your best posts. ever.

no shit.

Well, thanks Mainman. I've been really struggling with what we should do there, now that we've messed it up so badly. It's taken me a long time to come to this conclusion, but I believe that future events will bear it out. And I am very sorry to say that.
 
it is because of THIS, that I truly hate George Bush....for what he has done to us...for what we allowed him to do to us and to Iraq in our name. America will be reaping the whirlwind of this terrible terrible foreign policy debacle for decades and decades into the future. That sort of devastation to our future and to our children's future makes George Bush ultimately deserving of all our hatred and scorn. He has truly earned it. I really and truly hope I live long enough to be able to piss on his grave.
 
it is because of THIS, that I truly hate George Bush....for what he has done to us...for what we allowed him to do to us and to Iraq in our name. America will be reaping the whirlwind of this terrible terrible foreign policy debacle for decades and decades into the future. That sort of devastation to our future and to our children's future makes George Bush ultimately deserving of all our hatred and scorn. He has truly earned it. I really and truly hope I live long enough to be able to piss on his grave.

I agree on all counts, and I plan on donning a red dress myself, if I should be alive to get the good news.
 
they may have been elected for the purpose of governing Iraq, but only koolaid soaked bushlickers like you would suggest that they are, in fact, "governing" anything.

They were elected to govern, and ARE governing presently. I'm sorry you think you have to be a "koolaid soaked bushlicker" to conclude this, but really, you just need a modicum of common sense. Baghdad, Sadr City, and a couple other spots in the Sunni triangle, are the only places you will find widespread violence and attacks, in 80% of the country, there is nothing but peace and harmony among the Iraqi population. The Sunni radicals are being funded, aided, supported and egged on, by Syria, Iran, or both, along with the Liberals and the Left-Wing Media. Cut the outside sources for these radicals, and the other 20% of Iraq becomes peaceful in short order. This isn't an easy solution, it will be difficult to do, and it will take more than military force to accomplish it, but this is the answer to the insurgency problem in Iraq.
 
the extent of the LONG term damage he has singlehandedly caused to our nation borders on the absurd.


Is it possible for you to complete a sentence without becoming overly melodramatic? Bush has not "single-handedly" done anything, presidents do not have that kind of authority and power. I realize you had to play it like that for the elections, but they are over and you won, so let's stop with the over-the-top melodrama, and put things back into realistic perspective here.

In 2056, we can have the debate over whether Bush's invasion of Iraq was for better or worse, and to do so before, is ignorant short-sided emotionalism. You are entitled to this opinion, and you don't have to substantiate it one bit, people believe all sorts of shit, some people still think FDR knew about Pearl Harbor and did nothing to stop it. But to make an informed, objective evaluation of Iraq, there are far too many factors in play, and other things that can happen, and no way of knowing how those things will pan out, so any prediction of how history will see Iraq, or American involvement, the Bush Doctrine, Democracy in the Arab world, or the connection to the War on Terror, is foolish and baseless at this point.

As for your girlfriend's little sweet pontification, I'll just say, I hope she sticks to shopping for boots and flirting with men on the Internet. Geopolitics seem to be completely over her pretty little pinhead.
 
and I DO think that suggesting that our Iraq blunder has opened pandora's box in the middle east and creatred great unrest where there was relatively little...that is has reopened animosities between sunni and shiite that may very well spread to the Lebanese and the Palestinians within the year (as King Abdullah of Jordan has already suggested) is nowhere near as foolish as YOU suggesting back in December that we would not lose even 500 more men, or YOU suggesting that the republicans would not lose any seats in either house of congress in the midterms, or YOU suggesting that Americans would punish democrats for their hands off position vis a vis Terri Schiavo...or even your suggestion that Terri (aka "eggplant") Schiavo was OBVIOUSLY NOT braindead.

I really think that YOU should lay off criticizing people for prognostications made that are as yet not proven wrong, given your track record......

wouldn't YOU agree?
 
The Sunni radicals are being funded, aided, supported and egged on, by Syria, Iran, or both,

would you mind explaining why Iranian persian shiites who are naturally supportive of their shiite brethren in Iraq would EVER support or "egg on" Iraqi sunni arabs who are engaged in a civil war against those very same shiite brethren?

Do you have any idea about the underlying nature of the sects involved in this conflict? Can you really be this numb after all this time?
 
Is it possible for you to complete a sentence without becoming overly melodramatic? Bush has not "single-handedly" done anything, presidents do not have that kind of authority and power. I realize you had to play it like that for the elections, but they are over and you won, so let's stop with the over-the-top melodrama, and put things back into realistic perspective here.

In 2056, we can have the debate over whether Bush's invasion of Iraq was for better or worse, and to do so before, is ignorant short-sided emotionalism. You are entitled to this opinion, and you don't have to substantiate it one bit, people believe all sorts of shit, some people still think FDR knew about Pearl Harbor and did nothing to stop it. But to make an informed, objective evaluation of Iraq, there are far too many factors in play, and other things that can happen, and no way of knowing how those things will pan out, so any prediction of how history will see Iraq, or American involvement, the Bush Doctrine, Democracy in the Arab world, or the connection to the War on Terror, is foolish and baseless at this point.

As for your girlfriend's little sweet pontification, I'll just say, I hope she sticks to shopping for boots and flirting with men on the Internet. Geopolitics seem to be completely over her pretty little pinhead.


"Geopolitics seem to be completely over her pretty little pinhead."

You've been wrong about virtually everything regarding your War from day one. See my sig line for one example.

Darla has been right for the last four years on Iraq, far more often than not. Go back to licking Bushs' boots, and let the adults discuss Iraq.
 
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