Muslims Save the Day

Dixie said:
It's not a fucking coincidental accident that we haven't been struck again by terrorists, Immie! It's because we now have the essential tools needed to find these people while they hide and plot amongst us, where we didn't have that capacity before.
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You know something? You may be right. Then again, how many "attacks" were thwarted before 9/11? How many threats were stopped before Bush took office that we did not know about? The only attacks we ever found out about pre-9/11 were the successsful ones such as World Trade Center bombing #1, the embassies and the U.S.S. Cole. How many others were stopped before they hit?

You are a fool if you believe that we are safer because of the USA Patriot Act. You are a fool if you believe that allowing the government to listen into your private conversations makes us any safer.

Dixie said:
You are so paranoid that Bush is going to find out about the affair you're having with your wife's best friend or whatever, and have such a total lack of trust in the people we elected to govern, that you can't comprehend giving them the leverage to capture terrorists and foil their plots.
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I see you have sunk to Toby's level. Making wild unsubstantiated claims. You just sunk to the scum of the site, Dixie. Congratulations.


Dixie said:
I don't like giving up certain freedoms, I don't enjoy being patted down at the airport, I wish I didn't have to allow these incursions on my privacy, but honestly, if that is what our government has to do to protect us from the threat of what we witnessed on 9/11, I can live with it for a while.
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Yes, and what will you say when you are the one they accuse of being a terrorist?

Immie
 
When I have full and undeniable proof of this plot I will be a little less untrusting. So far, it is nothing but accusations. Something I have always told Desh... accusations do not mean guilt. That is something that maybe you should think about.

Immie, based on some of the stuff you've been espousing lately, you are just one Reuters story away from being as kooky as Desh. I'm telling you dude, it's time for some serious introspection.

This plot has been going on a while, it was infiltrated by Muslims on our side (those good Muslims uscitizen thinks we don't believe in) and the bust finally came down. Details are still being withheld because they have not captured all involved and the investigation continues. This is not just something Bush and Blair cooked up to detract from Lieberman's loss, in this day and age of media coverage, a conspiracy of that sort is virtually impossible to pull off. Use your brain!

alQaeda was clearly behind it, and you can bet that if they had been successful, Iran and the rest of the radical element would have followed it with a flurry of other terrorist actions to coincide... and I don't think that danger is over with yet, something big is going down and this wasn't all of it... that's my gut instinct.
 
Dixie said:
When I have full and undeniable proof of this plot I will be a little less untrusting. So far, it is nothing but accusations. Something I have always told Desh... accusations do not mean guilt. That is something that maybe you should think about.

Immie, based on some of the stuff you've been espousing lately, you are just one Reuters story away from being as kooky as Desh. I'm telling you dude, it's time for some serious introspection.

This plot has been going on a while, it was infiltrated by Muslims on our side (those good Muslims uscitizen thinks we don't believe in) and the bust finally came down. Details are still being withheld because they have not captured all involved and the investigation continues. This is not just something Bush and Blair cooked up to detract from Lieberman's loss, in this day and age of media coverage, a conspiracy of that sort is virtually impossible to pull off. Use your brain!

alQaeda was clearly behind it, and you can bet that if they had been successful, Iran and the rest of the radical element would have followed it with a flurry of other terrorist actions to coincide... and I don't think that danger is over with yet, something big is going down and this wasn't all of it... that's my gut instinct.
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I trust your gut instinct about as much as I trust George W. Bush with my civil liberties. I will admit that I do trust your instincts more than I trust Dick Cheney with my civil liberties.

Again, you are starting to sound like Desh. "They have been accused. They are therefore guilty."

Welcome Desh.

Immie
 
Just as most of the 'tips' we get in Iraq come from Iraqis....the only difference is in the UK, the Muslim is slightly safer from discovery and retribution....
while in Iraq, the danger to a whistle blower in infinitly greater....
It was a brave and rightous thing to do in either case...
 
Dixie said:
How far are you, Dixie, going to trust them?

Immie, let me explain something to you... If we ever reach a point in this country, where people all have the distrusting attitude you have, we can hang it up. It's over for us. It simply doesn't matter who we elect or what they say or do anyway, because we are not going to ever be able to trust them, and anarchy will erupt. Our very system of government is based on people trusting representation, and if you have lost this, you can't make valid determinations and choices.
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I'm going backwards a bit because I don't think I said this when I read this post. We do need to trust our government. It is sad that I don't believe we can do this anymore. I feel that we need to clean house in Washington. Power has corrupted this lot of leaders. We need a change because we do need to trust the people in Washington.

Unfortunately, I don't forsee this happening.

I fear America will collapse in our lifetimes (I think you are about my age) because our leaders in Washington are no longer deserving of our trust.

Immie
 
Grind said:
A large amount.
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For example:

7/7 bombings 'justified' say a quarter of British Muslims

ALMOST a quarter of British Muslims say the 7/7 bombings can be justified because of the Government's support for the war on terror, according to an opinion poll.

And nearly half of those polled, or 45 per cent, believe the 9/11 attacks on New York were a conspiracy between the United States and Israel.

A third of those questioned said they would rather live under Sharia law in the UK than British law.

http://news.scotsman.com/uk.cfm?id=1145782006
 
Immanuel said:
I'm going backwards a bit because I don't think I said this when I read this post. We do need to trust our government. It is sad that I don't believe we can do this anymore. I feel that we need to clean house in Washington. Power has corrupted this lot of leaders. We need a change because we do need to trust the people in Washington.

Unfortunately, I don't forsee this happening.

I fear America will collapse in our lifetimes (I think you are about my age) because our leaders in Washington are no longer deserving of our trust.

Immie
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America will not collapse in your lifetime or mine, or my 8 year ols neice's lifetime. But The last great century for the US was the 20th. By the end of the current century, the US will be akin to France or Germany now, if we aren't war torn.

The fact is, that wars are a part of humanity. We haven't been war torn since the Civil War, and we are getting complacent. We have forgotten what utter destruction does, because the only time we see it is when we turn on the TV and see it in other parts of the world. We can't appreciate it, thus we take it relatively lightly.

The global political climate is changing, we are funding possible future enemies through aid, trade, whatever, we are acting as though Manifest Destiny is still relevant, but through influence rather than aquisition, we are speading ourselves thin in the theatre's that matter most.

The next century will not be as prosperous as the last, and we may end up bearing the brunt of the warring like Europe and East Asia did last century.

But the way we are excecuting our foreign policy, our trade policy and out domestic big brother policy here and now, will come back to haunt us. We won't die, but we'll feel a lot of pain.

There will come a point when american people will not have the sense of complacency that we currently do, and it will come from agony and destruction.
 
Or... We elect a leader who has vision, who sets us on a course for a new future of riches. Creating a national goal that sets us all on the path toward continued domination of foreign markets by producing the next step in energy management.
 
Damocles said:
Or... We elect a leader who has vision, who sets us on a course for a new future of riches. Creating a national goal that sets us all on the path toward continued domination of foreign markets by producing the next step in energy management.
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Globalism precludes this from happening. Unfortunately, our foresight now isn't nearly as valuable as our foresight 30 and 40 years ago, as it takes about that long for the political and human elements to appreciate the necessity for change.
 
Beefy said:
America will not collapse in your lifetime or mine, or my 8 year ols neice's lifetime. But The last great century for the US was the 20th. By the end of the current century, the US will be akin to France or Germany now, if we aren't war torn.

The fact is, that wars are a part of humanity. We haven't been war torn since the Civil War, and we are getting complacent. We have forgotten what utter destruction does, because the only time we see it is when we turn on the TV and see it in other parts of the world. We can't appreciate it, thus we take it relatively lightly.

The global political climate is changing, we are funding possible future enemies through aid, trade, whatever, we are acting as though Manifest Destiny is still relevant, but through influence rather than aquisition, we are speading ourselves thin in the theatre's that matter most.

The next century will not be as prosperous as the last, and we may end up bearing the brunt of the warring like Europe and East Asia did last century.

But the way we are excecuting our foreign policy, our trade policy and out domestic big brother policy here and now, will come back to haunt us. We won't die, but we'll feel a lot of pain.

There will come a point when american people will not have the sense of complacency that we currently do, and it will come from agony and destruction.
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Thank you Beefstradomus!
 
Everybody is getting well ahead of themselves.

It seems that everyone has convicted the 24 already, even though 2 have already been released.

Given the number of times that the British police have arrested / shot people on charges of terrorism in the past, to much hue and cry, only for it to be revealed that it was a mistake and the charges dropped.

It is normal practice not to assume guilt in the UK until it has been demonstrated.
 
yeah, but i'm not in the uk. I think their guilty terrorist muslim scumbags.

That's because you don't understand justice but you are young and a little slow, so...

An accusation isn't guilt.

If I accuse you of sucking off Robdawg does that make you guilty of it?
 
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Look, I am not saying they don't deserve a trial. I am not saying that they are legally right now, guilty.

But what do you think the evidence supports?
 
Beefy said:
America will not collapse in your lifetime or mine, or my 8 year ols neice's lifetime. But The last great century for the US was the 20th. By the end of the current century, the US will be akin to France or Germany now, if we aren't war torn.

The fact is, that wars are a part of humanity. We haven't been war torn since the Civil War, and we are getting complacent. We have forgotten what utter destruction does, because the only time we see it is when we turn on the TV and see it in other parts of the world. We can't appreciate it, thus we take it relatively lightly.

The global political climate is changing, we are funding possible future enemies through aid, trade, whatever, we are acting as though Manifest Destiny is still relevant, but through influence rather than aquisition, we are speading ourselves thin in the theatre's that matter most.

The next century will not be as prosperous as the last, and we may end up bearing the brunt of the warring like Europe and East Asia did last century.

But the way we are excecuting our foreign policy, our trade policy and out domestic big brother policy here and now, will come back to haunt us. We won't die, but we'll feel a lot of pain.

There will come a point when american people will not have the sense of complacency that we currently do, and it will come from agony and destruction.
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I can see America being divided into several different countries within our lifetimes. Not because of the war but because of what our politicians are doing to us. They are dividing us and conquering us. Or should I say they have conquered us. We have given them the reigns and let them run us off of a cliff.

America as we know is may not survive our lifetimes. We have our politicians to blame for this but when the end finally comes we will have no one to blame but ourselves because we allowed it to happen.

Immie
 
AnyOldIron said:
Everybody is getting well ahead of themselves.

It seems that everyone has convicted the 24 already, even though 2 have already been released.

Given the number of times that the British police have arrested / shot people on charges of terrorism in the past, to much hue and cry, only for it to be revealed that it was a mistake and the charges dropped.

It is normal practice not to assume guilt in the UK until it has been demonstrated.
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Everyone?

Do I need to go back and find my posts stating that this is 100% incorrect?

Isn't the scenario you mention about shooting a terrorist suspect exactly what happened to that person in London after the bombings? I don't remember the exact specifics of the case, but didn't your authorities kill an "arabic" man not long after the bombings and then later found out that he was not a terrorist? These are the reasons that we cannot allow the Bush hysteria to take hold of us here in America. They are telling us that eveyone is out to get us and without Bush we are doomed. God help us all!

Help me out Care, I know you remember this case.

Immie
 
Grind said:
Look, I am not saying they don't deserve a trial. I am not saying that they are legally right now, guilty.

But what do you think the evidence supports?
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Evidence has been known to lie before... well, not the evidence, but the interpretation of the evidence... then you also have to rely on the interpretor of the evidence.

So, just because the evidence points at these people as being terrorists, they must be given a fair hearing and they should be presumed innocent until the facts prove them otherwise.

Immie
 
Immanuel said:
Everyone?

Do I need to go back and find my posts stating that this is 100% incorrect?

Isn't the scenario you mention about shooting a terrorist suspect exactly what happened to that person in London after the bombings? I don't remember the exact specifics of the case, but didn't your authorities kill an "arabic" man not long after the bombings and then later found out that he was not a terrorist? These are the reasons that we cannot allow the Bush hysteria to take hold of us here in America. They are telling us that eveyone is out to get us and without Bush we are doomed. God help us all!

Help me out Care, I know you remember this case.

Immie
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it was a man from Brazil, I believe immie...and they slaughtered him...by accident of course... :(

also, a mentally ill man was slaughtered by our air marshalls not long ago too, so the usa is guilty as hell when it comes to over reacting and killing innocent people...
 
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