Right Wingers~ Explain Socialism to me

[Essence]

Well, I'm not a socialist-thinking poster, but I've got an answer for you. I'm going to start from the bottom and work up:

What is there aside from capitalism and socialism?

Let's better define the question here. You're really limiting the options. "Pure" Capitalism is the world's only real remaining form of Market Economy, but we've had Mercantilism in the past. Command Economies include Socialism, but also include Communism, Theocratic Economies, and many Monarchies and Dictatorships where the government dictates who is allowed to transact with whom. Traditional Economies are basically every tribal and many smaller religious communities around the world -- rules governing transactions generally spring from several generations of tradition and often make no sense at all to outsiders. Most first-world economies, however, are Mixed Economies that allow consumers to choose who to transact with (as in "Pure" Capitalism), but only under restrictions placed by the government (as in Command Economies).

So right off the bat, your entire attitude presents itself as a false dichotomy.

If they're not CAPITALISM what are they? Why are they not SOCIALISM?

They're artifacts of a Mixed Economy.

Which of the preceding definitions...

Neither. That's the false dichotomy. The world is more complex than your post allows for. There is more to an economy than "socialist things" and "capitalist things". The idea that everything ought to -- or even can -- be broken down that way is the result of hyperactive media working on ignorant minds.

 

[Anti-Party]

Interesting. You just explained how something DIDN'T work without even explaing what IT IS. LOL


AP is right. You don't know what socialism is. Most right wingers don't know what Socialism is. To most it means either, anything you believe that I don't agree with is socialism or if the government provides any services at all, it is socialism. Both are utterly stupid but that's what most people think socialism is.


I'm going to end AP's misery and define it for those who don't know what Socialism is. Simply stated, socialism is a socio-economic system in which the State controls the means of production.

They don't know big words. Thanks for keeping the thread alive.

 

[Anti-Party]

Let me try again and see if Anti-Fox, AKA AP has the balls to reply.

SOCIALISM: a political theory or system in which the means of production and distribution are controlled by the people and operated according to equity and fairness rather than market principles {Encarta English Dictionary)

CAPITALISM: an economic system based on the private ownership of the means of production and distribution of goods, characterized by a free competitive market and motivation by profit (Encarta English Dictionary)

Which of the preceding definitions defines Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Welfare, OSHA, 40 hour work week, National Holidays for workers and all other government social economic laws and programs? If they’re not CAPITALISM what are they? Why are they not SOCIALISM? What else is there aside from capitalism & socialism?

Did you copy/paste that "last edited" so easy

Thanks for learning Right Wingers. See you in "the future" that you are scared of.

 

[Anti-Party]

Another incredibly stupid post from the dullard class. You really are THAT stupid.

The irony here is that you think others are ignorant. Profits over humanity? Where do you get this crap; pull it out of your ass like most of your inane posts?

Re-read post 81 dimwit; become informed.

Once again; what is your point? To remove all doubt you're an ignoramus. Congrats; you have succeeded.

Yea, my thread was full of stupid from the start. Because the people who use the term "Socialism" the most don't have a clue what it means. And when asked what it means they scream "TROLL! OBAMA LOVER!" and pretty much everything else necessary to protect them from the fact that they don't know what Socialism actually is.

This is the basics of Uneducation.

 

[Anti-Party]

Well child, first your so-called “VERY basic question” was addressed by you to ”right wingers” which would of course exempt me from the question since I’m not a right winger. Secondly, I have provided Encarta English Dictionary definitions and my own interpretations of those definitions several times on threads here and even this one. Apparently you don’t like the TRUTHFUL answer/definitions, huh Goober?

To end, my very basic question had an OP attached to it. The OP asked if any Right Winger could answer this without a copy/paste internet search. You came along after HUNDREDS of idiots didn't know what Socialism was. You ran a copy/paste which clearly by the op was not the intention of the thread.

The point was to point out that the Right Wing has NO CLUE what the Left wing is thinking. And the things the Right Wing thinks the Left wing is thinking pushed through Fox News is uneducation. And further, this uneducation was exposed by this thread. So you are basically 3x wrong here.

 

[cawacko]

To end, my very basic question had an OP attached to it. The OP asked if any Right Winger could answer this without a copy/paste internet search. You came along after HUNDREDS of idiots didn't know what Socialism was. You ran a copy/paste which clearly by the op was not the intention of the thread.

The point was to point out that the Right Wing has NO CLUE what the Left wing is thinking. And the things the Right Wing thinks the Left wing is thinking pushed through Fox News is uneducation. And further, this uneducation was exposed by this thread. So you are basically 3x wrong here.

It's a good thing we have you on this board to educate us dude because you clearly have your pulse on what both those on the right and left are thinking and are able to break through both sides talking points. I don't think you get enough credit for this.

 

[Robo]

Well, I'm not a socialist-thinking poster, but I've got an answer for you. I'm going to start from the bottom and work up:



Let's better define the question here. You're really limiting the options. "Pure" Capitalism is the world's only real remaining form of Market Economy, but we've had Mercantilism in the past. Command Economies include Socialism, but also include Communism, Theocratic Economies, and many Monarchies and Dictatorships where the government dictates who is allowed to transact with whom. Traditional Economies are basically every tribal and many smaller religious communities around the world -- rules governing transactions generally spring from several generations of tradition and often make no sense at all to outsiders. Most first-world economies, however, are Mixed Economies that allow consumers to choose who to transact with (as in "Pure" Capitalism), but only under restrictions placed by the government (as in Command Economies).

So right off the bat, your entire attitude presents itself as a false dichotomy.




They're artifacts of a Mixed Economy.




Neither. That's the false dichotomy. The world is more complex than your post allows for. There is more to an economy than "socialist things" and "capitalist things". The idea that everything ought to -- or even can -- be broken down that way is the result of hyperactive media working on ignorant minds.

Oh sure! I’m sure we could still go back up the Amazon someplace and find natives who’s money is actually the last monkey they brought down with their poison dart who have to decide to eat it themselves or trade it for some boiled roots and of course the economies of yesteryear can be depicted as something other than capitalist or socialist market places if we allow our imaginations to willy-nilly convince us of that, but fact is your hard pressed today to find any of those mysterious old economies still in action and even harder pressed to explain how the American economy doesn’t fit much more accurately into the dictionary definition of socialism rather than capitalism.

“Much more complicated” you say? Only if you choose to ”complicate” the truth to insinuate that the truth is actually fiction. Of course that’s exactly the agenda of the left and the tactic of the fucking idiot that created this thread. There’s nothing complicated about it! Your only rational argument is that today’s American economy is a hybridized construct of a crony capitalist market place severely controlled by socialist principles rather than true capitalist principles.

Government by its very nature and definition is FORCE. Government by its very nature is socialist authoritarianism and corruption. The BIGGER the government the greater the socialist authoritarianism and the corruption.

 

[Robo]

Did you copy/paste that "last edited" so easy

Thanks for learning Right Wingers. See you in "the future" that you are scared of.

Exactly as I would have predicted, you have no rational argument so you reply with a frustrated babbling, immature immaterial, irrelevant bucket of puke.

 

[Robo]

To end, my very basic question had an OP attached to it. The OP asked if any Right Winger could answer this without a copy/paste internet search. You came along after HUNDREDS of idiots didn't know what Socialism was. You ran a copy/paste which clearly by the op was not the intention of the thread.

“Internet search?” “Copy paste?” Exactly what are you accusing me of searching the internet for and copying and pasting? The only thing I copied and pasted was two dictionary definitions and my dictionary isn’t on the internet and the only reason I copied and pasted them was to prove my point which you haven’t a fucking clue how to refute.

The point was to point out that the Right Wing has NO CLUE what the Left wing is thinking. And the things the Right Wing thinks the Left wing is thinking pushed through Fox News is uneducation. And further, this uneducation was exposed by this thread. So you are basically 3x wrong here.

First Goober there’s no such word as “uneducation.” Secondly, you never responded to the challenge to articulate who exactly you are identifying as “right-wingers.” Thirdly I can’t recall anywhere in this thread where you identified your agenda as “Right Wing has NO CLUE what the Left wing is thinking. And the things the Right Wing thinks the Left wing is thinking pushed through Fox News is uneducation.” To my recollection, your agenda here was to prove that the right-wing, (whoever the fuck they are), didn’t know what socialism was.

Well Goober, I’m not a right-winger so I reckon that’s why I know what socialism is and that’s why I proved it on this thread and on several threads of yours long before this one since it seems to be an infatuation of yours.

So let’s get back to my challenge to you that you continuously ignore and are petrified to attempt to answer.

SOCIALISM: a political theory or system in which the means of production and distribution are controlled by the people and operated according to equity and fairness rather than market principles {Encarta English Dictionary)

CAPITALISM: an economic system based on the private ownership of the means of production and distribution of goods, characterized by a free competitive market and motivation by profit (Encarta English Dictionary)

Which of the preceding definitions defines Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Welfare, OSHA, 40 hour work week, National Holidays for workers and all other government social economic laws and programs? If they’re not CAPITALISM what are they? Why are they not SOCIALISM? What else is there aside from capitalism & socialism?

 

[Essence]

Oh sure! I’m sure we could still go back up the Amazon someplace and find natives who’s money is actually the last monkey they brought down with their poison dart who have to decide to eat it themselves or trade it for some boiled roots and of course the economies of yesteryear can be depicted as something other than capitalist or socialist market places if we allow our imaginations to willy-nilly convince us of that, but fact is your hard pressed today to find any of those mysterious old economies still in action and even harder pressed to explain how the American economy doesn’t fit much more accurately into the dictionary definition of socialism rather than capitalism.

Translation: "My brain refuses to allow new facts, even those well-established by the rest of the world, in. You must describe the world in terms that my brain already has in it, because nothing else makes sense to me."

“Much more complicated” you say? Only if you choose to ”complicate” the truth to insinuate that the truth is actually fiction.

Translation: "The world is a scary place, and I refuse to let it in. I want my simplistic worldview because I don't want to have to go through the intellectual effort required to get beyond my fear."

Your only rational argument is that today’s American economy is a hybridized construct of a crony capitalist market place severely controlled by socialist principles rather than true capitalist principles.

Yes, that is in fact my argument. Thank you for restating it for me. Do you care to actually offer any sort of counter-point, or are you just ranting to hear yourself rant?

Government by its very nature and definition is FORCE. Government by its very nature is socialist authoritarianism and corruption. The BIGGER the government the greater the socialist authoritarianism and the corruption.

So you're claiming then that every government ever is inherently socialist? From the actual socialists back to the monarchs of old Europe and the tribal elders of the Native Americans? And you believe that the alternative is...what?

 

[Truth Detector]

Yea, my thread was full of stupid from the start. Because the people who use the term "Socialism" the most don't have a clue what it means. And when asked what it means they scream "TROLL! OBAMA LOVER!" and pretty much everything else necessary to protect them from the fact that they don't know what Socialism actually is.

This is the basics of Uneducation.

It’s a generalized term that describes a movement much like the ignorant canard you like to foist about "right wingers." And regardless of all the posts acurately describing what Socialism is, you're still too dense to comprehend it.

But what you actually want is to engage in semantics in a desperate bid to mask the ignorance you spout on this forum about "right wingers" while giving a complete pass to "left wingers" and supporting Socialist efforts like the ACA.

Perhaps if you actually READ the Constitution and UNDERSTOOD how our Government is supposed to NOT work, you would not be such a brain dead dullard who makes incredibly stupid claims, engage in stupid meaningless canards and start incredibly stupid meaningless threads.

Yes, you really are THAT stupid.

 

[Truth Detector]

To end, my very basic question had an OP attached to it. The OP asked if any Right Winger could answer this without a copy/paste internet search. You came along after HUNDREDS of idiots didn't know what Socialism was. You ran a copy/paste which clearly by the op was not the intention of the thread.

The point was to point out that the Right Wing has NO CLUE what the Left wing is thinking. And the things the Right Wing thinks the Left wing is thinking pushed through Fox News is uneducation. And further, this uneducation was exposed by this thread. So you are basically 3x wrong here.

What a boringly stupid post; you really are THAT stupid. Fox news "uneducation." You have achieved the pinnacle of ignorance.

 

[Essence]

Fox news "uneducation". Yup.


[edit]Wow...a day and a half of silence. Guess the Fox watchers lack a decent reply to the facts. Again.[/edit]

 

[Anti-Party]

“Internet search?” “Copy paste?” Exactly what are you accusing me of searching the internet for and copying and pasting? The only thing I copied and pasted was two dictionary definitions and my dictionary isn’t on the internet and the only reason I copied and pasted them was to prove my point which you haven’t a fucking clue how to refute.



First Goober there’s no such word as “uneducation.” Secondly, you never responded to the challenge to articulate who exactly you are identifying as “right-wingers.” Thirdly I can’t recall anywhere in this thread where you identified your agenda as “Right Wing has NO CLUE what the Left wing is thinking. And the things the Right Wing thinks the Left wing is thinking pushed through Fox News is uneducation.” To my recollection, your agenda here was to prove that the right-wing, (whoever the fuck they are), didn’t know what socialism was.

Well Goober, I’m not a right-winger so I reckon that’s why I know what socialism is and that’s why I proved it on this thread and on several threads of yours long before this one since it seems to be an infatuation of yours.

So let’s get back to my challenge to you that you continuously ignore and are petrified to attempt to answer.

SOCIALISM: a political theory or system in which the means of production and distribution are controlled by the people and operated according to equity and fairness rather than market principles {Encarta English Dictionary)

CAPITALISM: an economic system based on the private ownership of the means of production and distribution of goods, characterized by a free competitive market and motivation by profit (Encarta English Dictionary)

Which of the preceding definitions defines Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Welfare, OSHA, 40 hour work week, National Holidays for workers and all other government social economic laws and programs? If they’re not CAPITALISM what are they? Why are they not SOCIALISM? What else is there aside from capitalism & socialism?

After 100 comments you finally know what Socialism is vs Capitalism. Good for you. Your explanation of what it is, is pretty articulate. I know you didn't copy/paste this, you are SMART! You just thought of it because you knew it even if it was late..............

 

[Annie]

“Internet search?” “Copy paste?” Exactly what are you accusing me of searching the internet for and copying and pasting? The only thing I copied and pasted was two dictionary definitions and my dictionary isn’t on the internet and the only reason I copied and pasted them was to prove my point which you haven’t a fucking clue how to refute.

First Goober there’s no such word as “uneducation.” Secondly, you never responded to the challenge to articulate who exactly you are identifying as “right-wingers.” Thirdly I can’t recall anywhere in this thread where you identified your agenda as “Right Wing has NO CLUE what the Left wing is thinking. And the things the Right Wing thinks the Left wing is thinking pushed through Fox News is uneducation.” To my recollection, your agenda here was to prove that the right-wing, (whoever the fuck they are), didn’t know what socialism was.

Well Goober, I’m not a right-winger so I reckon that’s why I know what socialism is and that’s why I proved it on this thread and on several threads of yours long before this one since it seems to be an infatuation of yours.

So let’s get back to my challenge to you that you continuously ignore and are petrified to attempt to answer.

SOCIALISM: a political theory or system in which the means of production and distribution are controlled by the people and operated according to equity and fairness rather than market principles {Encarta English Dictionary)

CAPITALISM: an economic system based on the private ownership of the means of production and distribution of goods, characterized by a free competitive market and motivation by profit (Encarta English Dictionary)

Which of the preceding definitions defines Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Welfare, OSHA, 40 hour work week, National Holidays for workers and all other government social economic laws and programs? If they’re not CAPITALISM what are they? Why are they not SOCIALISM? What else is there aside from capitalism & socialism?

Wow, a couple days later, the 'knowing one' decides to confer kudos upon this. the eyes are not to CL but to the twit that was unable to articulate what he was clamoring for. A true ijit.

 

[canceled.2021.1]

Interesting. You just explained how something DIDN'T work without even explaing what IT IS. LOL


AP is right. You don't know what socialism is. Most right wingers don't know what Socialism is. To most it means either, anything you believe that I don't agree with is socialism or if the government provides any services at all, it is socialism. Both are utterly stupid but that's what most people think socialism is.


I'm going to end AP's misery and define it for those who don't know what Socialism is. Simply stated, socialism is a socio-economic system in which the State controls the means of production.

A couple of points of clarification?

Do they have to control 100% of the means of production? Or could they control 5% or 10%, or can it be 100%?

Additionally do they have to physically own the means of production, or can "effective" control through regulation and taxation suffice?

The key word you used is control. Production can be controlled in many ways without the government taking full ownership.

In that sense one could argue that Obamas actions regarding GM were in and of themselves socialist. Sure there are those who will claim it was "necessary" to save the economy, but we are talking about definitions here. Obama took over the means of production. He decided what dealerships would remain open and which would close. He decided what brands would get built and would not.

Another example would be the coal industry. Utilizing the power of the EPA, Obama is effectively shitting down the coal industry making it too difficult for the production of cost effective coal.

So without a shadow of a doubt using your definition, Obama is a socialist and by extension those who support him socialists as well

 

[The Dude]

Socialism is another party system which anti party wouldn't get a job either

 

[Robo]

My brain refuses to allow new facts, even those well-established by the rest of the world, in. You must describe the world in terms that my brain already has in it, because nothing else makes sense to me.

The world is a scary place, and I refuse to let it in. I want my simplistic worldview because I don't want to have to go through the intellectual effort required to get beyond my fear."

Yes, that is in fact my argument.

How interesting!

 

[Robo]

After 100 comments you finally know what Socialism is vs Capitalism. Good for you. Your explanation of what it is, is pretty articulate. I know you didn't copy/paste this, you are SMART! You just thought of it because you knew it even if it was late..............

My comments related to socialism and capitalism have been all over this forum and this thread from the get-go Goober. Never, ever have you bothered to even try to refute what I've posted. Mostly your replies, (if you reply), are nothing more than mindless babble.

 

[Robo]

A couple of points of clarification?

Do they have to control 100% of the means of production? Or could they control 5% or 10%, or can it be 100%?

Additionally do they have to physically own the means of production, or can "effective" control through regulation and taxation suffice?

The key word you used is control. Production can be controlled in many ways without the government taking full ownership.

In that sense one could argue that Obamas actions regarding GM were in and of themselves socialist. Sure there are those who will claim it was "necessary" to save the economy, but we are talking about definitions here. Obama took over the means of production. He decided what dealerships would remain open and which would close. He decided what brands would get built and would not.

Another example would be the coal industry. Utilizing the power of the EPA, Obama is effectively shitting down the coal industry making it too difficult for the production of cost effective coal.

So without a shadow of a doubt using your definition, Obama is a socialist and by extension those who support him socialists as well

Right On ILA!!! You’ve articulated those nasty little facts that the leftist bastard racketeers struggle to keep under secret cover. They preposterously propose that socialism is an “all or nothing absolute.” when in fact “socialism by degree” is the worldwide norm and has been throughout the centuries. The old Roman Empire was a very good example of how a massive world power can bankrupt itself through socialism by degree.


"The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance." (Marcus Tullius Cicero)