The Big Liar

[Dutch Uncle]

Hello Dutch,

Sometimes people have to be saved from themselves. Determining when that type of drastic action is necessary is not easy, and should not be undertaken lightly.

And then, how exactly does one go about saving deplorable from deplorable?

When it begins to threaten others would be a good measure.

Suppose you're sitting in an airliner and somebody freaks out so bad they move to open the emergency exit at 30,000 feet. It becomes imperative to subdue them and ensure the door stays closed. There comes a time.

What moral right does a person have to "save" a people from themselves? Isn't that what the Christians did to Native American children? Ripped them away from their villages and bestowed the gift of Euro Culture upon them?

Subduing a person because they are endangering others is logical. I can see why killing off a culture, like al-Qaeda after 9/11, is necessary too.

I don't see the correlation between those examples and you disenfranchising Americans simply because you think they vote stupidly. Please explain.

 

[Tranquillus in Exile]

Do you remember how Democrats claimed election fraud in EVERY election Republican's win since Billy Bob Clintons philandering Presidency?

Republicans have had three wins since then - 2000, 2004, 2016 - and two of those were on a minority vote. Are you saying that the Dem candidates refused to concede? True, Al Gore waited a month because the outcome hung on a few hundred votes in one state.

It didn't hang on a few hundred votes in 2020 - Trump was beaten by 7 million and won't concede. That's the only time that has happened in US history.

Still, all good for Trump's ego, eh? Something that size needs a lot of stroking. MAGA!

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Do you remember how Democrats claimed election fraud in EVERY election Republican's win since Billy Bob Clintons philandering Presidency?

Republicans have had three wins since then - 2000, 2004, 2016 - and two of those were on a minority vote. Are you saying that the Dem candidates refused to concede? True, Al Gore waited a month because the outcome hung on a few hundred votes in one state.

It didn't hang on a few hundred votes in 2020 - Trump was beaten by 7 million and won't concede. That's the only time that has happened in US history.

Still, all good for Trump's ego, eh? Something that size needs a lot of stroking. MAGA!

Yes, that's what he's claiming. Truth Detector is a dumbass and $20 says he doesn't have keys to outside his "home".

 

[Nordberg]

Yea, sure. Tuesday proves you dead, flat, wrong.

How did it do that?

 

[PoliTalker]

Hello Dutch,

What moral right does a person have to "save" a people from themselves?

Lots of self-destructive people have been saved from themselves. They usually become grateful afterward. Saving lives is consider moral.

Isn't that what the Christians did to Native American children? Ripped them away from their villages and bestowed the gift of Euro Culture upon them?

Subduing a person because they are endangering others is logical. I can see why killing off a culture, like al-Qaeda after 9/11, is necessary too.

I don't see the correlation between those examples and you disenfranchising Americans simply because you think they vote stupidly. Please explain.

Refusing to acknowledge the climate crisis is slow burn humanicide. The moral responsibility falls upon those clear-headed people who can see the danger to take action against the will of those short-sided people who refuse to admit the gravity of the situation.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Hello Dutch,



Lots of self-destructive people have been saved from themselves. They usually become grateful afterward. Saving lives is consider moral.



Refusing to acknowledge the climate crisis is slow burn humanicide. The moral responsibility falls upon those clear-headed people who can see the danger to take action against the will of those short-sided people who refuse to admit the gravity of the situation.

We're not talking about a lone nutjob endangering themselves and everyone else by trying to open an airline emergency exit**, we're talking about a culture of 80 million people+.

How do you plan to strip all of those Americans of their rights and bend them to your will? Stalin ended up killing about 30M of them, Mao about the same.




**As soon as the cabin door is shut, the aircraft is automatically slightly pressurized. Those emergency doors are plug-type doors and held in place with air pressure from about .5 PSI on the ground up to 8 PSI at cruising altitude.

Given a door is 24"X36" (864 sq inches), at .5 PSI, that's 432 lbs of pressure holding the door in place. Please don't kill someone just because they are panicking and trying to open a door inflight.

Only if the aircraft is depressurized, regardless of altitude, will those doors open.

 

[PoliTalker]

Hello Dutch,

We're not talking about a lone nutjob endangering themselves and everyone else by trying to open an airline emergency exit**, we're talking about a culture of 80 million people+.

How do you plan to strip all of those Americans of their rights and bend them to your will? Stalin ended up killing about 30M of them, Mao about the same.




**As soon as the cabin door is shut, the aircraft is automatically slightly pressurized. Those emergency doors are plug-type doors and held in place with air pressure from about .5 PSI on the ground up to 8 PSI at cruising altitude.

Given a door is 24"X36" (864 sq inches), at .5 PSI, that's 432 lbs of pressure holding the door in place. Please don't kill someone just because they are panicking and trying to open a door inflight.

Only if the aircraft is depressurized, regardless of altitude, will those doors open.

Good point about an airliner emergency exit.

Nobody needs to 'be stripped of their rights.'

We simply need to get as many people vaccinated as possible. Nobody has any Constitutional right to refuse to be vaccinated. There is simply nothing in the Constitution which gives them that specific right. The Supreme Court ruled that the individual right to freedom does not give an individual the right to endanger the freedom of others to live and be free of the threat of preventable disease.

If a State creates a vaccine mandate then everyone must comply.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Hello Dutch,



Good point about an airliner emergency exit.

Nobody needs to 'be stripped of their rights.'

We simply need to get as many people vaccinated as possible. Nobody has any Constitutional right to refuse to be vaccinated. There is simply nothing in the Constitution which gives them that specific right. The Supreme Court ruled that the individual right to freedom does not give an individual the right to endanger the freedom of others to live and be free of the threat of preventable disease.

If a State creates a vaccine mandate then everyone must comply.

Sorry, dude, but that's complete bullshit. By your logic, no one has a specific right to not get shot in the ass with a pellet gun. "There is simply nothing in the Constitution which gives them that specific right."


First, the Constitution limits the powers of government, not the rights of citizens. All citizens have unalienable rights including not being forced to be vaccinated.

Second, the State can protect citizens by requiring masks or vaccinations in public areas or work spaces. Still can't deprive citizens of their rights.

 

[PoliTalker]

Hello Dutch,

Sorry, dude, but that's complete bullshit. By your logic, no one has a specific right to not get shot in the ass with a pellet gun. "There is simply nothing in the Constitution which gives them that specific right."

First, the Constitution limits the powers of government, not the rights of citizens. All citizens have unalienable rights including not being forced to be vaccinated.

Second, the State can protect citizens by requiring masks or vaccinations in public areas or work spaces. Still can't deprive citizens of their rights.

Not BS at all. The limitation on such personal freedom is established by the Supreme Court.

Somebody already took that argument to the Supreme Court and lost.

Supreme Court Majority Opinion author Justice Harlan explained it.

Individuals have rights, but so does a State:

"But the liberty secured by the Constitution of the United States to every person within its jurisdiction does not import an absolute right in each person to be, at all times and in all circumstances, wholly freed from restraint. There are manifold restraints to which every person is necessarily subject for the common good.”

Supreme Court Case Precedent: Jacobson, 1905

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Hello Dutch,



Not BS at all. The limitation on such personal freedom is established by the Supreme Court.

Somebody already took that argument to the Supreme Court and lost.

Supreme Court Majority Opinion author Justice Harlan explained it.

Individuals have rights, but so does a State:

"But the liberty secured by the Constitution of the United States to every person within its jurisdiction does not import an absolute right in each person to be, at all times and in all circumstances, wholly freed from restraint. There are manifold restraints to which every person is necessarily subject for the common good.”

Supreme Court Case Precedent: Jacobson, 1905

Where does that allow forced vaccination, forced sterilization, forced medical experimentation, etc?

If that state forces a child to have a vaccination and the child dies, do the parents and siblings have rights? Or just "Too bad, so sad, fuck the little bastard for being genetically unfit"?

 

[PoliTalker]

Hello Dutch Uncle,

Where does that allow forced vaccination, forced sterilization, forced medical experimentation, etc?

If that state forces a child to have a vaccination and the child dies, do the parents and siblings have rights? Or just "Too bad, so sad, fuck the little bastard for being genetically unfit"?

It doesn't allow those other things. It says vaccination mandates are legal and not a violation of the Constitution because while individuals have rights, so does the State have the right to protect the public by requiring vaccinations. If you would read the case you would understand that.

 

[Truth Detector]

Republicans have had three wins since then - 2000, 2004, 2016 - and two of those were on a minority vote.

When have we ever elected a President based on popular vote? This statement illustrates a glaring ignorance about how we choose Presidents and what the background of the Constitutional arguments behind why we do this. Once again, your argument is incoherent babble.

Are you saying that the Dem candidates refused to concede?

They've done far worse. After the 2000 election, Democrats smeared GWB as "selected" not elected. When GWB beat Kerry four years later, many on the left claimed that voting machines in Ohio had been rigged. HBO created a documentary called Hacking Democracy claiming to show how votes can be stolen without a trace.

After Trump's victory, we were treated to lie filled narratives that Trump was perhaps a Russian asset and that Trump colluded with Russia to steal the election. Democrat's declared he was not their President. Then we discovered that the Russia story was fabricated out of the Clinton campaign and we watched a desperate effort to destroy a legitimately elected President's agenda with the Mueller probe and then an impeachment along straight party lines on the flimsiest of charges.

Spare me your disingenuous crocodile tears over how the opposition reacts to election losses.

True, Al Gore waited a month because the outcome hung on a few hundred votes in one state.

Al Gore and the Democratic Party of Lying Jackasses NEVER accepted the results. You're a very shitty liar.

It didn't hang on a few hundred votes in 2020 - Trump was beaten by 7 million and won't concede. That's the only time that has happened in US history.

Once again, when have we ever elected a President based on popular vote? This statement illustrates a glaring ignorance about how we choose Presidents and what the background of the Constitutional arguments behind why we do this. Once again, your argument is incoherent babble.

Still, all good for Trump's ego, eh? Something that size needs a lot of stroking. MAGA!

Absurdity; the last desperate refuge for the ignorant, the dishonest and the stupid. Yay you!

 

[Truth Detector]

Yes, that's what he's claiming. Truth Detector is a dumbass and $20 says he doesn't have keys to outside his "home".

Please, let the adults in the room debate junior. Life is too short for your special brand of thread trolling stupidity.

 

[Truth Detector]

We're not talking about a lone nutjob endangering themselves and everyone else by trying to open an airline emergency exit**, we're talking about a culture of 80 million people+.
How do you plan to strip all of those Americans of their rights and bend them to your will? Stalin ended up killing about 30M of them, Mao about the same.

Spoken like a true nut job loon. See a shrink you dimwitted mental case.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Hello Dutch Uncle,

It doesn't allow those other things. It says vaccination mandates are legal and not a violation of the Constitution because while individuals have rights, so does the State have the right to protect the public by requiring vaccinations. If you would read the case you would understand that.

You and I aren't discussing "vaccination mandates". We're discussing your belief that a person can be held down and vaccinated against their will.

I'm saying "no, they can't" and "It would be wrong to do so".

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Post a picture of your room key. LOL

 

[Truth Detector]

Post a picture of your room key. LOL

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Is there any doubt you dream about me at night, son?

Here; you are feeling verrrrry sleepy:

 

[Dutch Uncle]

 

[Truth Detector]

Is there any doubt you dream about me at night, son?