StoneByStone
It's OK to Be White
Isn't this a False Equivalence? And I'm not talking about all Conservatives, just the ones that support Trump.
Trump calls for Supreme Court to reconsider flag burning laws amid protests
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Isn't this a False Equivalence? And I'm not talking about all Conservatives, just the ones that support Trump.
Safe spaces are extreme when people are not allowed to express opinions that are offensive to others. And trigger warnings are attempts to limit free speech you claim does not occur. My speech is not free when I am required to preface it with warnings.
But you are right, most colleges do not have crazy speech codes. Some of those that did have been challenged and found unconstitutional (as I'm sure trigger warnings would be).
StoneByStone
It's OK to Be White
So here's what everyone is getting wrong about those things.
Safe spaces are clubs in college where it's agreed that certain things won't be talked about. You're free to express your controversial opinions anywhere on campus, except for this one small room where some people meet.
I don't think it's extreme for a group of people to meet up and decide they're not going to discuss certain topics during that time. We all need a break from politics sometimes.
A trigger warning is just that. It's a warning that the things we're going to be talking about might be upsetting.
For example, if a college class is going to be reading a book involving rape, the syllabus might say "Trigger Warning: rape and violence will be discussed at length." If you still choose to take that class, you have to do the work. You can't take the class and then demand that the professor not make the class read the book. You can't refuse to read the book and still pass the class.
So that being said, are these things so wrong?
No, it is not false equivalence. The Trump supporters would say the same thing about the other side. You choose to be intolerant of one group (46% of voters) because of their political beliefs and denigrate them. That is hate and probably includes false generalizations about their characteristics ("uneducated"). Hate toward others is always bad.
Your description of safe spaces is not typical. Everyone should be free to meet with a group of people in a private place (or reserved room) and not discuss certain topics if all students agree. But some of the conflicts on college campuses is when a topic is being discussed in a public space but when somebody expresses an opinion others find offensive they have violated the safe space of others. That is not acceptable.
A classroom that requires trigger warnings does not have the same free speech protections as public places. However, discussing a political view that someone finds offensive should not require the kind of trigger warnings as more emotional topics. For example, should I have to give a trigger warning to defend voting for Biden but not for Trump?
StoneByStone
It's OK to Be White
Yeah, yeah, there's no difference between Social Democrats and Fascists. They both look down on each other, so they're the same.
StoneByStone
It's OK to Be White
That's not a thing. If you're discussing something in class, nobody is allowed to demand you stop talking because this is their safe space. I can't say that never happens, but generally speaking, a safe space is a previously agreed upon meeting. Professors don't let any student just declare the classroom a safe space.
Essentially, it's subjective. For some people, certain politics are triggering, while others have no strong feelings either way. So whether this or that should qualify as a trigger warning is debatable.
But the point is that trigger warnings don't prevent speech. All they do is give you a heads up. You might think a trigger warning on a syllabus is silly, but you won't be prevented from discussing that in class.
Iolo/Penderyn
Verified User
#FuckOFFCommieTroll
Oh these deep backwoods thinkers! How can Trumpf fail to colonise Greenland? On to glory!
Using the "fascist" label without any of the fascist characteristics is just an attempt to make one group seem "objectively horrible." I have accused several of the "social democrats" on JPP of holding fascist views since they want to deny freedom of expression to some groups. I guess that makes the social democrats fascists also.
It is like saying "communists" (liberals) are not morally equivalent to "loyal American patriots" (Trump supporters). Using negative labels ignores the real issue through simplistic labels; especially when socialist, communist, and fascist are used with little recognition of the meaning of these terms.
When both sides think they are morally superior they are morally equivalent.
I was not referring to classroom as a safe space but to public places where students gather and discuss. People have been accused of "microaggressions" for posting announcements of a controversial speaker or one that some find offensive. They were accused of violating a their safe place.
If a classroom is about to discuss affirmative action do both sides have to issue the warning before they speak? It appears any good classroom discussion would involve views which others would dislike.
What about a syllabus that requires white students to "acknowledge their white privilege" to pass the class?
Fascism is a government that unites dictatorial powers with the power of corporations. That describes Trump. It also criticizes and eventually takes over the press. Trump is doing that. It questions elections and says trust only one, i can fix it. It makes a segment of the people into enemies of the state. Trump has been very successful at that as the horrendous posting by rights shows on this board. Benito Trumpolini has followed the footsteps of thew dictators including Mussolini and Hitler.
The left is far more moral and ethical.
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StoneByStone
It's OK to Be White
Trump tried to cheat in his reelection. That is Fascism. It's using the office of the presidency to determine an election instead of allowing for Democracy.
Check out this link and tell me how many points do NOT apply to Trump, because it's easier to list the ones that don't: http://www.openculture.com/2016/11/umberto-eco-makes-a-list-of-the-14-common-features-of-fascism.html
Again, this is the False Equivalence fallacy. Obama wasn't a Socialist or a Communist. He didn't try to collectivize businesses and he didn't try to eliminate the government. So while it's fair to say Obama had bad politics, or you don't agree with his politics, it's objectively wrong to say that his politics were Socialist or Communist.
And I explained before how the Liberals who want to ban speech are fringe.
Dictatorial powers means beyond our legal and constitutional system. That has not occurred. When executive orders or laws went beyond their constitutional authority the courts have blocked those attempts by Trump, Obama, Bush, etc. So, our legal system has prevented any dictatorial powers.
Presidents and politicians have always criticized the press from the nation's beginning (see Adams and Jefferson). None have ever taken over the press.
Elections have often been criticized in our country including huge controversies over the results (1876). These claims of cheating in elections come from the right and left.
So, all those things you claim constitute fascism do not exist in the U. S.
The right uses these same types of claims but uses labels socialism and communism. That makes both sides far from moral and ethical. They uses the same media methods to smear, divert, swivel, and anything else they think will help win support and elections. Increasingly, both sides seem willing to propagate and believe wild conspiracy theories.
StoneByStone
It's OK to Be White
As I said, I'm sure it happens here and there, but there's no reason to believe this is the norm on campuses.
We can say safe spaces are common, there's evidence of that, but I don't see evidence that students are going around declaring that the entire campus is there personal safe space.
Well once you're in the class, there are no more trigger warnings. You already got the warning before you took the class.
I think it's fair to include discussions of race and racism as a trigger warning.
When it comes to anti-white bias, that actually is huge in academia. It's also huge in the media, both left-wing and right-wing. So it's not really a Left vs Right thing, it's a Western thing.
Criticized the press is not equivalent to Trump's they are enemies of the state. Can you understand that.? Presidents have bitched, but Trump makes it a cause. Trump is threatening freedom of the press. He has eliminated the yearly press conferences. He wants to select and remove who gets credentials based on his whims.
The left believes that elections are reasonably fair. There are investigations regularly and they find almost zero illegal votes. That is not how the right cheats. They do it by stopping likely Dem voters from exercising their right. They shorten voting days. They eliminate polls to Dem and black neighborhoods to make voting lines ridiculously long. They remove minority sounding names from the voter rolls.
So start confessing then. You have done nothing to preserve that freedom. Just a leech on society.
Not quite. Then again, how can anyone take named Jerome seriously?
You are the epitome of a leftist. Cannot support your argument with intellect. Immediately just start repeating yourself. Complete lack of intelligence.
You are good at guessing. And that is about it.