Until We Find ONE WMD in Iraq, Republicans Should Really Calm Down About “Obamacare"
- Thread starter poet
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maineman
Banned
If I am working to rebuild a replica of the taj mahal made entirely of butterscotch candy... does that mean I have completed it? does it even mean I have, at this point, even one single piece of butterscotch candy in hand, or is my work, to this point been entirely in working with candy makers to line up a future supply?
If I am working to increase my capacity to be able to fly by merely flapping my arms, can I fly?
the english language, in the hands of artists, is a wonderful thing... George Bush was a house painter by comparison.
Yeah, C engaged in talks with the Bush gang.
You don't think "perceiving a shift in attitude" is opinion ?....I certainly do.
You realize that NONE OF THIS MEMO contains direct quotes from RD.
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So my guess is confirmed in the above paragraph from wiki
because of a remark attributed to Richard Dearlove (then MI6 head) that "the intelligence and facts were being fixed [by the U.S.] around the policy" of removing Saddam Hussein from power,
The policy Dearlove was referring to was the policy of removing Saddam from power...the policy the came from the Clinton Administration....right ?
which was taken to show that US intelligence on Iraq prior to the war was deliberately falsified, rather than simply mistaken
These words "which was taken to show" certainly says that this entire line and conclusion is conjecture, an opinion, ....a guess.
There is not now or in the past that US intelligence on Iraq prior to the war was deliberately falsified....
On the contrary, US intell. agreed with what those infamous Dem. quotes were saying....and agreed with what what a common thread in German, French, English, etc
intell about Iraq....
Do you think it was falsified to make those whining Democrats look like they were telling the truth...??? and at the same time,
show Bush a liar for saying exactly the same thing.
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This whole barrel of bullshit was dreamed up by the left wingers...DNC, KOS, and all the rest of media that supports the left....
You're the only leftie I know that seems to have actually taken a more critical look at the memo....the only 'smoking gun' in that memo
is in the imaginatin of the Bush hating partisan left wing .......
christiefan915
Catalyst
I decided to google Dearlove and he looks like a smoking gun. Can't wait to read his record.
Sir Richard Dearlove, Former MI6 Chief, Threatens To Expose Iraq War Details
Posted: 07/22/2013 12:02 pm EDT | Updated: 07/22/2013 12:54 pm EDT
The former head of Britain's intelligence agency has threatened to expose new details about the state of affairs leading up to the Iraq war.
Sir Richard Dearlove, who helmed the MI6 from 1999 to 2004, told the UK's Mail On Sunday that he has spent the last year writing "a record of events surrounding the invasion of Iraq from my then professional perspective." Dearlove told the Mail that he has been planning to leave his account as a record for scholars, but may reveal the details sooner if he doesn't agree with the findings of Britain's Chilcot Inquiry, which is investigating the country's role in the lead-up to the Iraq War:
'My intention is that this should be a resource available to scholars, but after my decease (may be sooner depending on what Chilcot publishes). I have no intention, however, of violating my vows of official secrecy by publishing any memoir.'
Dearlove, now Master at Pembroke College, Cambridge University, has taken a sabbatical from academic life to work on this account, and is said to be "extremely aggrieved" that Prime Minister Tony Blair and his chief spokesman Alastair Campbell overstated the possibility that Saddam Hussein's chemical weapons could jeopardize British troops in Cyprus, according to the Mail.
A security source told the Mail on Sunday that the account is "Sir Richard's time-bomb."
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/22/richard-dearlove_n_3635208.html
From his perspective ?....His opinion might prove interesting but the DSM as it stands, means nothing, and reveals nothing he didn't know before.
and comes much too late ..... whats done is done. Saddam is a thing of the past as is anymore whining about him from those Democrats....
Hes sure had plenty of time to develop a story and I doubt anyone will challenge whatever his story is.....I know nothing about the UKs concern about Saddam and wmd
being a danger to British troops in Cyprus....and frankly, have no interest in it.
Got any comments about my previous post ? If not, its been fun.
Traitor
SJJRSJJS
Verified User
You are so out of touch with reality, everyone butt you knows that I am a cowboy with horse, butt of course you are a know it all, who lives in never never land. I ain't claiming nothing, so you made that up too, what else is new. I do not want to drive you to drink cheap wine or smoke dope so I will release you, you are free, so be gone with your dumb ass. SJJRSJJS has spoken.......
Why did you have to use the word 'working'....the quote said "worked".....words have meaning you know.
Without further clarification, that could mean the work is done....
Thats the way you usually respond, with a little lie here and there to change the entire meaning of whats actually said.....or you assume words that aren't there....etc.
Didn't they speak 'normal' English in Maine ? Even you attemps at strawman is getting lame.
maineman
Banned
OH! Let me rephrase: (I betcha Dubya wishes he had had a chance to rephrase that knowingly false statement of fact into an opinion!)
"If I say I have worked to rebuild a replica of the taj mahal made entirely of butterscotch candy... does that mean I have completed it? does it even mean I have, at this point, even one single piece of butterscotch candy in hand, or is my work, to this point been entirely in working with candy makers to line up a future supply?"
The meaning is the same, I think you would have to agree. And for someone who is incapable from discerning the difference between a fact and an opinion, you are the last one on fucking earth to criticize my use of the language. You're a housepainter of a writer, just like your butt buddy Dubya.
and I find it hilarious for you to accuse me of assuming words that are not on the record. YOU want to say that when Bush said, THERE IS NO DOUBT" he really MEANT to say "THERE IS NO DOUBT IN MY MIND" or "I HAVE NO DOUBT"... both of those are statements of opinion. The sad thing is, he did not. He said what he said. He did not add any complexity or nuance to the remarks to change their meaning from a simple statement of fact into a personal opinion regardless of how dearly you wish he had.
"there is no doubt that the red sox will win the world series next year", is a lie, because I know full well that doubt does, in fact, exist about that very thing.
The truth of the matter is that Bush knowingly stated as fact something that was not factual. When people do that, we have a very precise word for it in our language. IT'S A FUCKING LIE!!!!!
He was our president. He lied and he he and his team made insinuations about Saddam's pre-9/11 involvement with the hijackers...
OMG!!!! Saddam absolutely without doubt has stockpiles of WMD's and his folks were meeting with the hijackers months before they flew planes into the WTC! OMG!!! The next time it could be a mushroom cloud!!!! OMG!!!! OMG!!!!! YIKES!!!!! WE HAVE TO ATTACK RIGHT THIS VERY MINUTE!!!!! OMG!!!!
He misled us into war. Shame on him forever, and shame on you for continuing to carry his empty bucket of water.
You NAUSEATE me. You are SO dismissed. Get the fuck out.
The rest of your rant was just the natural plain bullshit I expect from a partisan Bush hating idiot....pathetically desh-like....
poet
Banned
Oh, no bitch.....I'm the one who will dismiss you, not you I. You have several more "readings" coming, so have a seat. Have several.
maineman
Banned
This is getting tedious Bravo.... Let me try and explain it to you yet again.
You say:
If my goal is to build a replica of the Taj Mahal entirely out of candy, and I have worked hard to draw up the plans, and I have worked hard at negotiating agreements with candy makers, and I have worked hard to procure a spot of land on which to build my masterpiece, and I have worked hard to contract with some people who specialize in building things out of candy, and I have worked hard to build a storage building onsite that will accommodate the the tons of candy that I intend to purchase from the candy makers.... I've worked pretty hard at my project, but, at that point in time, I don't own a single butterscotch drop and the plot of land sits empty. I've worked hard, but there is nothing there yet. Saddam's hard work did not mean that that work had resulted in any stockpiles of WMD's... nor did the speaker claim otherwise.
Next, you say:
Please show me where he was referring to his or anyone's mind. He was stating a fact. "There is no doubt the earth rotates around the sun" That is a simple statement of fact. "There is no doubt that the droplets of water falling out of the clouds in the sky this morning are called 'rain'". Not opinion. Fact. Whether you like it or not, in our language, the phrase "There is no doubt" has a subtle, but significant difference from "I have no doubt". The former is a statement of fact, the latter, a statement of opinion. That's just the way our language works. If one is the president of THIS country, one has to speak the english language with complete clarity because many of this country's citizens UNDERSTAND the language - and all its subtle nuances - with complete clarity. Obviously not you.... but many do.
And then....
Well... I must agree. Being wrong in making a statement of fact merely makes you wrong....not a liar... but THEN you make my case for me:
Bush DID KNOW FULL WELL THAT DOUBT EXISTED. He had been extensively briefed on all the NIE's concerning Saddam's supposed stockpiles. He KNEW FULL WELL that there were many in the intelligence community who doubted the veracity of many of the HUMINT sources, that there were doubts concerning the interpretation of photographic evidence - the trailer that MIGHT have been a chemical lab or it might have just been a weather monitoring station - that intelligence we had on the programs was so old that it was no longer reliable... and on and on. BUSH DID KNOW FULL WELL THAT DOUBT EXISTED. Obviously, he was able to personally overlook and discount those doubts, but that did not mean that those doubts did not exist. If George Bush had said, "There is little doubt", or I have little doubt" or "I believe"... I would not have a problem with any of those statements.
But you understand... it's only a lie when you say there is no doubt when you actually know full well that doubt did, in fact, exist. YOU paint Bush out to be the liar that he is by YOUR OWN WORDS.
Thank you. We're done here.
You say:
If my goal is to build a replica of the Taj Mahal entirely out of candy, and I have worked hard to draw up the plans, and I have worked hard at negotiating agreements with candy makers, and I have worked hard to procure a spot of land on which to build my masterpiece, and I have worked hard to contract with some people who specialize in building things out of candy, and I have worked hard to build a storage building onsite that will accommodate the the tons of candy that I intend to purchase from the candy makers.... I've worked pretty hard at my project, but, at that point in time, I don't own a single butterscotch drop and the plot of land sits empty. I've worked hard, but there is nothing there yet. Saddam's hard work did not mean that that work had resulted in any stockpiles of WMD's... nor did the speaker claim otherwise.
Next, you say:
Please show me where he was referring to his or anyone's mind. He was stating a fact. "There is no doubt the earth rotates around the sun" That is a simple statement of fact. "There is no doubt that the droplets of water falling out of the clouds in the sky this morning are called 'rain'". Not opinion. Fact. Whether you like it or not, in our language, the phrase "There is no doubt" has a subtle, but significant difference from "I have no doubt". The former is a statement of fact, the latter, a statement of opinion. That's just the way our language works. If one is the president of THIS country, one has to speak the english language with complete clarity because many of this country's citizens UNDERSTAND the language - and all its subtle nuances - with complete clarity. Obviously not you.... but many do.
And then....
Well... I must agree. Being wrong in making a statement of fact merely makes you wrong....not a liar... but THEN you make my case for me:
Bush DID KNOW FULL WELL THAT DOUBT EXISTED. He had been extensively briefed on all the NIE's concerning Saddam's supposed stockpiles. He KNEW FULL WELL that there were many in the intelligence community who doubted the veracity of many of the HUMINT sources, that there were doubts concerning the interpretation of photographic evidence - the trailer that MIGHT have been a chemical lab or it might have just been a weather monitoring station - that intelligence we had on the programs was so old that it was no longer reliable... and on and on. BUSH DID KNOW FULL WELL THAT DOUBT EXISTED. Obviously, he was able to personally overlook and discount those doubts, but that did not mean that those doubts did not exist. If George Bush had said, "There is little doubt", or I have little doubt" or "I believe"... I would not have a problem with any of those statements.
But you understand... it's only a lie when you say there is no doubt when you actually know full well that doubt did, in fact, exist. YOU paint Bush out to be the liar that he is by YOUR OWN WORDS.
Thank you. We're done here.
No, he's just THAT incredibly stupid. This is a required condition for those who voted for Obama and continue to defend him.
You wouldn't know the truth if it slapped you on your repugnant dimwitted head.
Bush believed what everyone else believed. If he had KNOWN Saddam didn't have WMDs he would not have claimed he did because, as an intelligent person, which you are not, he knows that everyone would know he lied when they did not find the stockpiles he believed Saddam had.
But you're a repugnantly ignorant partisan asshat who cannot comprehend the simplest of facts.
Rational people do not knowingly lie to acheive an objective, particularly when soldiers lives are at stake, because they know that sooner or later the facts will get out. In Obamas case, hes too stupid and arrogant to care because he knows repugnantly stupid dimwits like you will continue voting for him and supporting him...because you really are THAT incredibly stupid.
Here's a tidbit for you asshole; Saddam himself admitted he misled the West because he feared Iranians more than he feared the west and wanted the Iranians to also believe he has massive stockpiles in order to prevent any Iranian ideas to attack.
But you're a hyper partisan moron of epic proportions; why would you care about facts, truth or reality.
Moron.
maineman
Banned
No one has ever said that Bush KNEW that Saddam did NOT have WMD's. What is incontrovertible is the fact that he said there WAS NO DOUBT that Saddam had WMD's when he knew that there was, in fact doubt about that. Saying there was no doubt, when his own intelligence community had many doubts, was a lie.
English... in the hands of artists, a thing of beauty... in the hands of housepainters, not so much.
You continue to remove all doubt what a remarkable moron you are. You can't even comprehend the irony and stupidity in your own comments.
You're an asshat of epic proportions who gives "stupid" a bad name. Anyone with half a brain reading your nonsense is shaking their head in wonder.
Yes, you really are THAT stupid and that repugnant.
maineman
Banned
you do understand that Bush claiming that doubt did not exist about Saddam's WMD's when he was aware of doubts about that very subject.... that was a lie? It wasn't true. There WERE doubts and he knew about them. You understand that, don't you?
ESL must have been hard for you.
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maineman
Banned
If I were to say, "there is no doubt that Truth deflector has the IQ of a carrot", that would be a lie... because I am quite certain that you and your gang of sycophants all believe that you are, in fact, somewhat smarter than a carrot.
If I were to say, "I have no doubt that Truth deflector has the IQ of a carrot", that would NOT be a lie.
English... once you get past the ESL stage, it really is a pretty remarkable language. Keep studying... you'll get there.
If I were to say, "I have no doubt that Truth deflector has the IQ of a carrot", that would NOT be a lie.
English... once you get past the ESL stage, it really is a pretty remarkable language. Keep studying... you'll get there.
What I am aware of is that you are an incredibly dumb hyper partisan dimwit who cannot comprehend the irony in your own dimwitted claims.
Yes, you really are THAT stupid and a repugnant hyper partisan asshat. You're a liar of epic proportions so clueless that you can't comprehend what constitutes a lie and what is a mistake.
Youre so repugnantly stupid that you believe that Bush was too stupid to comprehend the political ramifications if he was wrong and defend Obamas lies by fabricating your own version of events contrary to all the facts.
You're a repugnant uninformed hyper partisan dullard prone to lying in order to defend the failure of a leftist ideology you're stupid enough to believe in.
I find your ignorance repugnant. I find your lies repugnant. I find your existence repugnant.
This is your brain on stupid; dont do stupid.
If I say there is no doubt and I have no doubt that mainman has the IQ of an ant, that would not be a lie. It might be incorrect in that ants may actually possess MORE intelligence than you have exhibited here.
Moron.