what was the best time in American history?

Any case for changing regulations in any way has to be done on a individual case basis.


If it is NOT done that way then its done stupidly


GET IT.

every time you just scream "its too big"

you might as well be screaming


"Im too stupid to understand it so make it go away".

fuck you
 
Sorry Simp old chum. It could easily be interpreted either way.

No, it could not. He had already commented on Bush senior not being that bad. We know from our history on this board that he was referring to GW Bush...

The recession caused by Bush I was severe enough that I was able to negotiate house purchases in which the seller was willing to pay the balance between how much of the mortgage I was willing to assume, and what they actually owed. That is pretty severe, and I did it multiple times during that recession. You were what? 19 years old then?

LMAO...

1) that is purely anecdotal.
2) the recession in 1990 was not caused by Bush. The US was in the process of raising rates to slow the pace of growth and inflation when the oil shock occurred from Saddam invading Kuwait. The recession was one of the most mild we had seen. It was nothing compared to the economic crash caused by Clinton repealing Glass Steagall.
 
well if you don't think being in good economic shape is part of the dynamic then that is your choice.


what was the best functioning time in this countries history according to you.

Mine would include a good economy


You have yet to tell us what YOUR time frame is Desh. Why is that? Everyone else has answered the question... How about you do the same?
 
every time you talk this country into deregulation for deregulations sake the people get fucked.

remember the savings and loan debacle?


Enron


to name couple

What was deregulated about Enron? You are dangerously close to discussing things about which you know nothing about.

What is this deregulation meme you keep talking about?

Name 5 businesses that have ZERO state, local or federal regulation impacting it. Just five. Should be a piece of cake for a wiki expert like you.
 
"the governments too big"

that is deregulation for deregulation sake.
Its NOT too big.
It is the size the American people want it to be.
You not liking that doesn't make is wise to not like it.
It means you don't understand anything in detail and just want life to be more simple.
If your too stupid to help design it and understand it then let the smart people run things

When you get done rambling incoherently, let us know.
 
Any case for changing regulations in any way has to be done on a individual case basis.
If it is NOT done that way then its done stupidly
GET IT.
every time you just scream "its too big"
you might as well be screaming
"Im too stupid to understand it so make it go away".
fuck you

ROFLMAO...
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis

why did you NOT know this had to do with the Enron mess idiot?




Involvement of Enron[edit source]

Main article: Enron

One of the energy wholesalers that became notorious for "gaming the market" and reaping huge speculative profits was Enron Corporation. Enron CEO Kenneth Lay mocked the efforts by the California State government to thwart the practices of the energy wholesalers, saying, "In the final analysis, it doesn't matter what you crazy people in California do, because I got smart guys who can always figure out how to make money." The original statement was made in a phone conversation between David Freeman (Chairman of the California Power Authority) and Kenneth Lay (CEO of Enron) in 2000, according to the statements made by Freeman to the Senate Subcommittee on Consumer Affairs, Foreign Commerce and Tourism in April[24] and May 2002.[25]

S. David Freeman, who was appointed Chair of the California Power Authority in the midst of the crisis, made the following statements about Enron's involvement in testimony[25] submitted before the Subcommittee on Consumer Affairs, Foreign Commerce and Tourism of the Senate Committee on Commerce, Science and Transportation on May 15, 2002:
"There is one fundamental lesson we must learn from this experience: electricity is really different from everything else. It cannot be stored, it cannot be seen, and we cannot do without it, which makes opportunities to take advantage of a deregulated market endless. It is a public good that must be protected from private abuse. If Murphy’s Law were written for a market approach to electricity, then the law would state 'any system that can be gamed, will be gamed, and at the worst possible time.' And a market approach for electricity is inherently gameable. Never again can we allow private interests to create artificial or even real shortages and to be in control."Enron stood for secrecy and a lack of responsibility. In electric power, we must have openness and companies that are responsible for keeping the lights on. We need to go back to companies that own power plants with clear responsibilities for selling real power under long-term contracts. There is no place for companies like Enron that own the equivalent of an electronic telephone book and game the system to extract an unnecessary middleman’s profits. Companies with power plants can compete for contracts to provide the bulk of our power at reasonable prices that reflect costs. People say that Governor Davis has been vindicated by the Enron confession."
Enron eventually went bankrupt, and signed a US$1.52 billion settlement with a group of California agencies and private utilities on July 16, 2005. However, due to its other bankruptcy obligations, only US$202 million of this was expected to be paid. Ken Lay was convicted of multiple criminal charges unrelated to the California energy crisis on May 25, 2006, but he died due to a heart attack on July 5 of that year before he could be sentenced. Because Lay died while his case was on federal appeal, his conviction was vacated and his family was allowed to retain all his property.

Enron traded in energy derivatives specifically exempted from regulation by the Commodity Futures Trading Commission. At a Senate hearing in January 2002, Vincent Viola, chairman of the New York Mercantile Exchange—the largest forum for energy contract trading and clearing—urged that Enron-like companies, which don't operate in trading "pits" and don't have the same government regulations, be given the same requirements for "compliance, disclosure, and oversight." He asked the committee to enforce "greater transparency" for the records of companies like Enron. In any case, the U.S. Supreme Court had ruled "that FERC has had the authority to negate bilateral contracts if it finds that the prices, terms or conditions of those contracts are unjust or unreasonable." Nevada was the first state to attempt recovery of such contract losses.[citation needed]
 
"the governments too big"

that is deregulation for deregulation sake.


Its NOT too big.


It is the size the American people want it to be.


You not liking that doesn't make is wise to not like it.


It means you don't understand anything in detail and just want life to be more simple.

If your too stupid to help design it and understand it then let the smart people run things


Who are these smart people we should willingly turn our lives over to?

You did say something right though, if only by accident. The gobblement is the size the American people want it to be. The fight these days isn't so much about principle as it is about who controls the levers. That is why I have checked out. Neither the GOP or democrat party (Republicrats) represent my interests.
 
Who are these smart people we should willingly turn our lives over to?

You did say something right though, if only by accident. The gobblement is the size the American people want it to be. The fight these days isn't so much about principle as it is about who controls the levers. That is why I have checked out. Neither the GOP or democrat party (Republicrats) represent my interests.


maybe people smart enough to remember what caused the fucking messes in the first place.


ERON MUCH????
 
I know full well you guys likely do remember all these messes and their causes.

You just lie like fucking rugs about everything because your likely sociopaths
 
No, it could not. He had already commented on Bush senior not being that bad. We know from our history on this board that he was referring to GW Bush...



LMAO...

1) that is purely anecdotal.
2) the recession in 1990 was not caused by Bush. The US was in the process of raising rates to slow the pace of growth and inflation when the oil shock occurred from Saddam invading Kuwait. The recession was one of the most mild we had seen. It was nothing compared to the economic crash caused by Clinton repealing Glass Steagall.

Of course it is anecdotal, yet I was actually there, in business, you were not. You are relying on history books written by the winners for your mis-information.

The mini, fake recession of '01 (created only by Bush II saying "we are in a recession" so he could lower taxes for his wealthy friends was in fact much less severe as witnessed by me, and
my inability to apply the exact same, formerly successful tactics (since we were not in a real recession, no one was scared enough to short sell themselves).

Call it anecdotal, yet what you offer; opinion is equally unsubstantiated.
 
What was deregulated about Enron? You are dangerously close to discussing things about which you know nothing about.

What is this deregulation meme you keep talking about?

Name 5 businesses that have ZERO state, local or federal regulation impacting it. Just five. Should be a piece of cake for a wiki expert like you.

Thanks for proving you are an idiot.

Why should I waste my time talking to you?
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis

why did you NOT know this had to do with the Enron mess idiot?




Involvement of Enron[edit source]

Main article: Enron

One of the energy wholesalers that became notorious for "gaming the market" and reaping huge speculative profits was Enron Corporation. Enron CEO Kenneth Lay mocked the efforts by the California State government to thwart the practices of the energy wholesalers, saying, "In the final analysis, it doesn't matter what you crazy people in California do, because I got smart guys who can always figure out how to make money." The original statement was made in a phone conversation between David Freeman (Chairman of the California Power Authority) and Kenneth Lay (CEO of Enron) in 2000, according to the statements made by Freeman to the Senate Subcommittee on Consumer Affairs, Foreign Commerce and Tourism in April[24] and May 2002.[25]

S. David Freeman, who was appointed Chair of the California Power Authority in the midst of the crisis, made the following statements about Enron's involvement in testimony[25] submitted before the Subcommittee on Consumer Affairs, Foreign Commerce and Tourism of the Senate Committee on Commerce, Science and Transportation on May 15, 2002:
"There is one fundamental lesson we must learn from this experience: electricity is really different from everything else. It cannot be stored, it cannot be seen, and we cannot do without it, which makes opportunities to take advantage of a deregulated market endless. It is a public good that must be protected from private abuse. If Murphy’s Law were written for a market approach to electricity, then the law would state 'any system that can be gamed, will be gamed, and at the worst possible time.' And a market approach for electricity is inherently gameable. Never again can we allow private interests to create artificial or even real shortages and to be in control."Enron stood for secrecy and a lack of responsibility. In electric power, we must have openness and companies that are responsible for keeping the lights on. We need to go back to companies that own power plants with clear responsibilities for selling real power under long-term contracts. There is no place for companies like Enron that own the equivalent of an electronic telephone book and game the system to extract an unnecessary middleman’s profits. Companies with power plants can compete for contracts to provide the bulk of our power at reasonable prices that reflect costs. People say that Governor Davis has been vindicated by the Enron confession."
Enron eventually went bankrupt, and signed a US$1.52 billion settlement with a group of California agencies and private utilities on July 16, 2005. However, due to its other bankruptcy obligations, only US$202 million of this was expected to be paid. Ken Lay was convicted of multiple criminal charges unrelated to the California energy crisis on May 25, 2006, but he died due to a heart attack on July 5 of that year before he could be sentenced. Because Lay died while his case was on federal appeal, his conviction was vacated and his family was allowed to retain all his property.

Enron traded in energy derivatives specifically exempted from regulation by the Commodity Futures Trading Commission. At a Senate hearing in January 2002, Vincent Viola, chairman of the New York Mercantile Exchange—the largest forum for energy contract trading and clearing—urged that Enron-like companies, which don't operate in trading "pits" and don't have the same government regulations, be given the same requirements for "compliance, disclosure, and oversight." He asked the committee to enforce "greater transparency" for the records of companies like Enron. In any case, the U.S. Supreme Court had ruled "that FERC has had the authority to negate bilateral contracts if it finds that the prices, terms or conditions of those contracts are unjust or unreasonable." Nevada was the first state to attempt recovery of such contract losses.[citation needed]


Who ran the CA legislature during the partial deregulation of their electric market Desh?

Who has said they don't recall Enron? Can you give us an example?

I can tell you who was President during the Enron debacle. I can also tell who ran the CA legislature... DEMOCRATS.
 
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