Would the US be better off without the South?

[Mott the Hoople]

Nope. As a matter of fact I am still young enough (at heart anyway ) that I prefer good winter weather in season. I could definitely live in a northern state as long as the setting was rural, had some good access to public land for hunting and fishing, and my neighbors didn't mind my occasional target practice off my back porch.

Tons of places like that in the great lakes region.

If you could really deal with cold winters then you'd love Minnesota and Wisconson......the UP is pretty cool too but......it's in michigan if you know what I mean?

 

[Mott the Hoople]

FYI Mutt... ohio ranked 44th on the recent 'quality of life' rankings. LMAO... below MS, WV, SC and AR

That's because Cincinnati is the gate way to the south and those fuckers have infested southern Ohio and have drug the State down. Once you hit south border of Franklin county we do just fine thank you.

What's really funny is your only using quality of life factors that are important to corporations. That's a hoot! Yea....real objective there SF!

 

[Cancel 2016.11]

Wow, Mott you sent Sf into an actual meltdown! LMAO Awesome!

Me, I wouldn't leave the Northeast, I love the Northeast. I might possibly leave it for the west coast under certain circumstances, but never anywhere else. My niece is determined that she is going to move to California, (she wants to attend college there too). I told her I would come out and visit her, and she got so mad. She's so funny. She actually gets mad about that and almost yells "why would you do that? why wouldn't you just move there?". LOL I told her that was a good point, and who knows maybe I would.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

That's because SF is being obtuse (surprise, surprise) or dishonest again. Across the board the south trails behind the rest of the nation in the major quality of life factors as health, family life, community life, material well being, political stability, job security, political freedom and gender equity. I'll be generous and give the south climate/geography. That's one out of the 9 major quality of life factors in the Souths favor mainly cause it's about the only one they can't fuck up!

So lets go down that objective list.

LMAO at your objectivity... again... no data to back up any of the following????

Health. The south leads the nation in the incidence of obesity, heart disease, cancer and diabetes and has the highest child mortality rate in the nation.

Link to data.

Family life - The south has the highest divorce rates in the nation.

Link to data.

Community life - The south systematically refuses to invest in community infrastructure such as education, public utilities, roads, public health, etc.

link to data.

Material well being - The highest rates of poverty in the nation are in the South.

link to cost of living adjusted data

Political Stability - The south is the most politically corrupt region in the US.

link to data

Job Security - The south has systematically undermined workers rights. Most right to work States are southern.

link to data... note... only 7% or so of the population (outside of public unions) is union... so good luck showing job security in the region is worse overall.

Political Freedom - No region puts as much obstacles in the paths of minorities to fair political represntation as the south does.

Link to data

Gender equity - The south has consistantly fought and denied women their reproductive rights and resist equal pay measures for women.

link to datas

Climate/Geography - OK....I'll give that to some of the southern States but not across the board. Florida is a fucking swamp. I'd take a bitter cold Ohio winter any day over a Texas summer and the Mississippi delta region blows chunks big time but for the sake of argument I'll give you climate/geography.

So of the 9 objective quality of life criteria I listed the South trails the rest of the nation in 8 of those objective quality of life criteria. So yes, by the objective measures listed above, the South, as a region, has a lower quality of life than the rest of the nation does.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

That's because Cincinnati is the gate way to the south and those fuckers have infested southern Ohio and have drug the State down. Once you hit south border of Franklin county we do just fine thank you.

What's really funny is your only using quality of life factors that are important to corporations. That's a hoot! Yea....real objective there SF!

No, I did not... that is factors according to CNBC

 

[cawacko]

That's because SF is being obtuse (surprise, surprise) or dishonest again. Across the board the south trails behind the rest of the nation in such quality of life factors as Health, Family life, community life, material well being, political stability, job security, political freedom and gender equity. I'll be generous and give the south climate/geography. That's one out of the 9 major quality of life factors in the Souths favor mainly cause it's about the only one they can't fuck up!

How are you coming to those conclusion?

Edit: Sorry, I see this is already being discussed.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

How are you coming to those conclusion?

Edit: Sorry, I see this is already being discussed.

it is a valid question... he keeps saying it, but refuses to actually back it up with anything but his own rhetoric.

 

[leaningright]

Cost of living has to mean something...

http://www.missourieconomy.org/indicators/cost_of_living/

Like SF said, we all have our biases and reasons for them.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Cost of living has to mean something...

http://www.missourieconomy.org/indicators/cost_of_living/

Like SF said, we all have our biases and reasons for them.

That is the thing that is most ridiculous... many states with low cost of living get dinged on 'quality' of life because of it. Seriously... how do you judge quality of life? My clients just in CO are highly variant in what each deems important. One loves to fly fish, has a place in Denver, one in the mountains near a river he loves to fish. Outside of fishing he loves hiking and biking. Both homes paid for... he does not need much income to live that lifestyle, but it is the perfect life in his eyes. Another couple loves to travel. There lifestyle is very expensive, but they have the means to do so. They would not choose to live the lifestyle of the first, nor he theirs. But they still get together for Turkey day.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Cost of living has to mean something...

http://www.missourieconomy.org/indicators/cost_of_living/

Like SF said, we all have our biases and reasons for them.

It is but it isn't as big a factor. I know when I lived in Arkansas the cost of living was a little lower but to live in a similiar sized house with a similiar kind of car and the cost of food, clothes, utilities, etc, etc, the difference wasn't really that great. The main cost difference being housing. Most everything else cost about the same and even the difference in housing costs wasn't that big. A house of comparable size, age and quality that would cost about $200,000 where I currently live in suburban Columbus (Dublin) would cost about $175,000 in Blytheville, AR.

Anyways SF is just rationalizing to be argumentative and not recognizing the real quality of life factors outside of those approved by the Chamber of Commerce.

 

[Jarod]

Here you go Candy, I finally had a chance to type a couple words into the Google to prove the point I already knew to be true.


http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2004/09/red_states_feed.html

 

[cawacko]

It is but it isn't as big a factor. I know when I lived in Arkansas the cost of living was a little lower but to live in a similiar sized house with a similiar kind of car and the cost of food, clothes, utilities, etc, etc, the difference wasn't really that great. The main cost difference being housing. Most everything else cost about the same and even the difference in housing costs wasn't that big. A house of comparable size, age and quality that would cost about $200,000 where I currently live in suburban Columbus (Dublin) would cost about $175,000 in Blytheville, AR.

Anyways SF is just rationalizing to be argumentative and not recognizing the real quality of life factors outside of those approved by the Chamber of Commerce.

Serious question, what are factors you consider that the Chamber of Commerce doesn't?

 

[leaningright]

That is the thing that is most ridiculous... many states with low cost of living get dinged on 'quality' of life because of it. Seriously... how do you judge quality of life? My clients just in CO are highly variant in what each deems important. One loves to fly fish, has a place in Denver, one in the mountains near a river he loves to fish. Outside of fishing he loves hiking and biking. Both homes paid for... he does not need much income to live that lifestyle, but it is the perfect life in his eyes. Another couple loves to travel. There lifestyle is very expensive, but they have the means to do so. They would not choose to live the lifestyle of the first, nor he theirs. But they still get together for Turkey day.

That's true. I have received a fine education within driving distance of where I live and my job is 6 miles away. I can take my boy fishing in the morning and enjoy a community meal (every other Tuesday) at 11:30 wi his grandpa. I have time to hunt in October after I get off work. There are plenty of places for me to ride my horses and hunt my dogs. I have a 2500 sq. ft. home, two vehicles, three boats and a 25 ft. RV. There are a couple of motorcycles on my carport as well. I make in the neighborhood of 45K per year. I can't think of many places I could live and do as well. So, like SF said and I have repeated, we all have our preferences and priorities.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

It is but it isn't as big a factor. I know when I lived in Arkansas the cost of living was a little lower but to live in a similiar sized house with a similiar kind of car and the cost of food, clothes, utilities, etc, etc, the difference wasn't really that great. The main cost difference being housing. Most everything else cost about the same and even the difference in housing costs wasn't that big. A house of comparable size, age and quality that would cost about $200,000 where I currently live in suburban Columbus (Dublin) would cost about $175,000 in Blytheville, AR.

Anyways SF is just rationalizing to be argumentative and not recognizing the real quality of life factors outside of those approved by the Chamber of Commerce.

LMAO... can't help but notice that you have not provided ANYTHING to show us where YOU are getting your data from. Why is that Mutt?

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Here you go Candy, I finally had a chance to type a couple words into the Google to prove the point I already knew to be true.


http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2004/09/red_states_feed.html

Dearest Garud... if you are not going to pay attention, then try to stay out of the conversation. No one disputed that. We are discussing WHY that is. So go back and read the thread to find out what we are actually discussing.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Serious question, what are factors you consider that the Chamber of Commerce doesn't?

I have asked him several times to provide what it is he is using for his data and he refuses to provide it.

 

[Minister of Truth]

Let's see what the Military has to say about cost of living. Comparison of Basic Allowance for Housing (based upon my rank and zero dependants) :

Federal Way, WA: $1272 (I'm only getting $1104, so this must be a projection for next year)
Dublin, OH: $1029
Blytheville, AR: $762
New Haven, CT: $1854

For whatever reason, my BAH would go up about $380 with dependents versus $180 for Dublin and Blytheville.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Serious question, what are factors you consider that the Chamber of Commerce doesn't?

The CoC is constitutionally incapable of thinking outside of a framework of what is good for them is what is good for the country. Economic considerations about quality of life don't just apply to businesses.

 

[cawacko]

The CoC is constitutionally incapable of thinking outside of a framework of what is good for them is what is good for the country. Economic considerations about quality of life don't just apply to businesses.

I was asking what factors you consider that the CoC doesn't.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Now.....here is the clincher.....one of the best reasons to let the South secede. Each year we could have the North/South annual GM, Bank of the South, Cheeze Wiz Blood Bowl for the college football championship. No more of the BCS bullshit of handing national championships to the SEC most every year.