Confucianism takes on Buddhism & Daoism

AssHatZombie said:
stripping out all the bullshit, here is how the two faiths differ in relieving personal suffering.

confucianism: follow the rules, do as your told. it's not about you. suffering what?

buddhism: most of your suffering comes from clinging to made up stories in your head, and from the belief that suffering can be avoided by following rules.
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Your knowledge of Confucianism is extremely limited, misinformed, and based on caricature.

Confucians did not believe in blind obedience and submission.

Remonstrance is at the heart of Confucian ethics. If a ruler was corrupt or openly unethical, the Confucian has an obligation to speak truth to power, correct him, and if necessary remove him. The mandate of heaven is a very powerful concept in Confucian thought --> The Confucians believed in the mandate of heaven, and that a corrupt leader would lose the mandate of heaven to rule
 
Dutch Uncle said:
The Analects of Confucius assembled around his death 479 BCE.

12.2 Zhonggong asked about ren. The Master said, “When you go out your front gate, continue to treat each person as though receiving an honored guest. When directing the actions of subordinates, do so as though officiating at a great ritual sacrifice. Do not do to others what you would not wish done to you.
Then there can be no complaint against you, in your state or in your household.”
Zhonggong said, “Although I am not quick, I ask to apply myself to this.”
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Thanks, I did not see your response to Matt until now.

I was always struck by how similar this was to the Christian statement of the golden rule, almost an exact word for word carbon copy.
 
Cypress said:
Thanks, I did not see your response to Matt until now.

I was always struck by how similar this was to the Christian statement of the golden rule, almost an exact word for word carbon copy.
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Perhaps the creator of the world instilled his precepts into all cultures.
 
Cypress said:
Thanks, I did not see your response to Matt until now.

I was always struck by how similar this was to the Christian statement of the golden rule, almost an exact word for word carbon copy.
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Since it had been around for about 500 years before Christ (BC for Matt), It's likely Jesus picked it up on his travels.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
So no need for Jesus?
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Yet another illogical leap by you. <yawn>

1LrQNcB.jpg
 
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Matt Dillon said:
Perhaps the creator of the world instilled his precepts into all cultures.
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I don't know about a creator, but I think there is a kernel of truth that by virtue of being human we tend to be directed towards some type of universalism in ethics. And this is reflected in human metaphysical constructs such as The Dao, natural law, Dharma, the Five Vows, the Eightfold Path etc.
 
Cypress said:
I don't know about a creator, but I think there is a kernel of truth that by virtue of being human we tend to be directed towards some type of universalism in ethics. And this is reflected in human metaphysical constructs such as the Dao, natural law, Dharma, etc.
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Ayep. :)
 
Cypress said:
Your knowledge of Confucianism is extremely limited, misinformed, and based on caricature.

Confucians did not believe in blind obedience and submission.

Remonstrance is at the heart of Confucian ethics. If a ruler was corrupt or openly unethical, the Confucian has an obligation to speak truth to power, correct him, and if necessary remove him. The mandate of heaven is a very powerful concept in Confucian thought --> The Confucians believed in the mandate of heaven, and that a corrupt leader would lose the mandate of heaven to rule
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see, confucianism is about ruling.

buddhism says go fishing.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
Such as?

Why do you believe the Golden Rule isn't practical advice for your social interactions with your friends and family?
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I love the golden rule.

THere are good things in confucianism.

this thread was conceived as "take on" so that's where i've gone with it.

the thread should really be called,"Buddhism drinks Confucianisms's Milk Shake" tho
 
Dutch Uncle said:
Such as?

Why do you believe the Golden Rule isn't practical advice for your social interactions with your friends and family?
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I see Confucianism vs Buddhism as kinda sorta like an Eastern version of Stoicism vs Epicureanism.

A type of civic-minded, sober engagement with this world vs a detached pursuit of individually-directed liberation.
 
Cypress said:
I see Confucianism vs Buddhism as kinda sorta like an Eastern version of Stoicism vs Epicureanism.

A type of civic-minded, sober engagement with this world vs a detached pursuit of individually-directed liberation.
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wrong.
epicureanism is basically hedonism.

The buddhist would say that the gluttony might create and attachment that could lead to suffering if you someday cannot afford lavish banquets.

i'd say the buddhist is the stoic, and the confucian is a totalitarian.

civic minded social engagement, lol.

totalitarians blowing smoke up their own asses.
 
AssHatZombie said:
wrong.
epicureanism is basically hedonism.

The buddhist would say that the gluttony might create and attachment that could lead to suffering if you someday cannot afford lavish banquets.

i'd say the buddhist is the stoic, and the confucian is a totalitarian.

civic minded social engagement, lol.

totalitarians blowing smoke up their own asses.
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No, you don't understand Epicureanism either. You just read on some blog what partying fraternity boys were claiming about Epicureanism.

Epicurus was never about wanton hedonism and unrestrained indulgence.

^ that is an anachronistic interpretation of Epicureanism by 21st century frat boys throwing a kegger party.

Self control and moderation were part and parcel of the Epicurian creed.
 
Cypress said:
No, you don't understand Epicureanism either. You just read on some blog what partying fraternity boys were claiming about Epicureanism.

Epicurus was never about wanton hedonism and unrestrained indulgence.

^ that is an anachronistic interpretation of Epicureanism by 21st century frat boys throwing a kegger party.
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no it wasn't.

it's accurate.
 
Cypress said:
I see Confucianism vs Buddhism as kinda sorta like an Eastern version of Stoicism vs Epicureanism.

A type of civic-minded, sober engagement with this world vs a detached pursuit of individually-directed liberation.
Click to expand...

Different paths of which neither is necessarily better than the other. All have proved to work as social philosophies.

Not an expert, but application of any philosophy needs to fit the circumstances. A "read the room" type situation where introducing any new idea, be it Stoicism or Confucianism, must take into consideration the current social philosophy in order to be successfully spread throughout a society.

The reaction of the Chinese Confucianists to Buddhism being the thread example.

How many times in history have The Powers That Be (TPTB) attempted to stomp out ideas? Restrict knowledge from those under them? China screens Google. Stalin and Mao both attempted to stomp out religion. Even now both countries prosecute and attempt to erase the existence of different ideas.

In the Antebellum South it was illegal to teach a slave to read. Why? Knowledge is power. New ideas scare old ideas and old thinking people.

https://americanexperience.si.edu/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Literacy-as-Freedom.pdf
The Alabama Slave Code of 1833 included the following law “[S31] Any person who shall
attempt to teach any free person of color, or slave, to spell, read or write, shall upon conviction
thereof by indictment, be fined in a sum of not less than two
hundred fifty dollars, nor more than five hundred dollars.” At
this time, Harpers Weekly published an article that stated “the
alphabet is an abolitionist. If you would keep a people
enslaved refuse to teach them to read.” There was fear that
slaves who were literate could forge travel passes and escape.
These passes, signed by the slave owner, were required for
enslaved people traveling from one place to another and
usually included the date on which the slave was supposed to
return. There was also fear that writing could be a means of
communication that would make it easier to plan
insurrections and mass escapes.
 
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