Michigan: Right to Work defeats Right to Pork

Althea said:
I've seen that argument made before. Rents are cheaper, etc. What about when a new right to work state doesn't have the lower cost of living yet? Do you think rent will magically lower itself? Do you think that the smaller pool of expendable income is going to help, or hurt the local economies?
Click to expand...


Thats the beauty of capitalism.....an empty, high rent apartment doesn't do the landloard any good does it....an overprised auto that sits unsold in the showroom doesn't pay the light bill, overprised food at an empty resturant won't pay the owners heating bill, etc.....

I even remember when a doctors office visit was within the means of just about everyone, untill the deep pockets of gov. and insurance companys started paying the bills.
Cause and effect....or ...cause and consequence refers to the philosophical concept in which an action or event will produce a certain response to the action in the form of another event ..... as in....welfare causes dependence......
 
Last edited:
bravo said:
Thats the beauty of capitalism.....an empty, high rent apartment doesn't do the landloard any good does it....an overprised auto that sits unsold in the showroom doesn't pay the light bill, overprised food at an empty resturant won't pay the owners heating bill, etc.....
Click to expand...
That's one side of the coin. The other, is that in the face of 10 years of nobody paying taxes, local govts. are raising property taxes. The homeowners are getting hammered at every turn. The same applies to landlords. An empty apt. is not as bad as renting to someone who can't pay whatever rent you are charging. Taxes/insurance, etc do not magically go down just because of right to work status.
 
christiefan915 said:
Sure they can negotiate. But somehow I think the average sweathog has less to bargain with than the MBA looking for a management position. After all, sweathogs are interchangeable.
Click to expand...

The lesson to be learned....don't strive to be a sweathog....

Burger flippers get paid a burger flippers wages.....and has little bargining power.....

Lesson 2:
Work very hard, get a decent education, do on honest days work, save, etc....and then watch the government confiscate a disproportionate portion of your earnings to give to others...
Is that your "philosophical concept" of justice and freedom ?
 
Last edited:
Althea said:
This claim cannot be substantiated.
Click to expand...

shouldn't be that difficult to substantiate......here is substantiation for 23 of them in SE Indiana in 2012....
E&H Tubing joins a long line of companies that have made plans to locate or grow their operations in southeast Indiana in 2012. Uni-Ref, Hitachi Powdered Metals (USA), Seymour Tubing, Master Power Transmission and Cummins are some of the 23 companies that have committed to creating a cumulative 3,580 projected new jobs and invest $689.9 million in their southeast Indiana operations this year.
Click to expand...
http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/newsitem.asp?ID=56964
 
Althea said:
I've seen that argument made before. Rents are cheaper, etc. What about when a new right to work state doesn't have the lower cost of living yet? Do you think rent will magically lower itself? Do you think that the smaller pool of expendable income is going to help, or hurt the local economies?
Click to expand...

do you assume in your argument that wages are magically going to drop the moment Michigan passes its right to work law?.........
 
bravo said:
Except for the FACT he isn't dealing with a Republican Congress....idiot.
Click to expand...

He's dealing with the obstructionists, the neanderthals in Congress known as Republicans. Well, he has been for the last 2 years. We'll see how they behave themselves now.

And people wonder why I usually go into such detail in my posts. Instead of looking for ways to deliberately distort the meaning of my post do try to comprehend. :palm:
 
bravo said:
The lesson to be learned....don't strive to be a sweathog....

Burger flippers get paid a burger flippers wages.....and has little bargining power.....

Lesson 2:
Work very hard, get a decent education, do on honest days work, save, etc....and then watch the government confiscate a disproportionate portion of your earnings to give to others...
Is that your "philosophical concept" of justice and freedom ?
Click to expand...

When a person can't work very hard because of illness or can't afford an education or can't do an honest day's work because they don't have a job or can't save money because they don't have any to save then, yes, tax those who can and do accomplish those things so as to help the less fortunate. But you and the Repubs will never understand that until you're both relegated to the dust heap.

It's truly amazing you've learned nothing from the election. It's like you have a mental block. It just doesn't get through to you.
 
apple0154 said:
When a person can't work very hard because of illness or can't afford an education or can't do an honest day's work because they don't have a job or can't save money because they don't have any to save then, yes, tax those who can and do accomplish those things so as to help the less fortunate. But you and the Repubs will never understand that until you're both relegated to the dust heap.

It's truly amazing you've learned nothing from the election. It's like you have a mental block. It just doesn't get through to you.
Click to expand...

This nation has the best entrepreneurial spirit in the world. We are not a European style welfare state that you wish us to be (though we unfortunately are making some attempts to go that route). We have a safety net for those in need. But this wishful thinking that the free market and Republicans are going to disappear isn't going to happen.
 
cawacko said:
This nation has the best entrepreneurial spirit in the world. We are not a European style welfare state that you wish us to be (though we unfortunately are making some attempts to go that route). We have a safety net for those in need. But this wishful thinking that the free market and Republicans are going to disappear isn't going to happen.
Click to expand...
I don't know. The Republican coalition of free market plutocrats and ignorant red necks doesn't appear to be a very sustainable model to me.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
I don't know. The Republican coalition of free market plutocrats and ignorant red necks doesn't appear to be a very sustainable model to me.
Click to expand...

All I can say is the Republicans had this hubris in the early 2000's that they were going to have this permanent majority in Congress and the Presidency was theirs going forward. Seems some Democratic supporters are imbibing those same feelings today.
 
cawacko said:
This nation has the best entrepreneurial spirit in the world. We are not a European style welfare state that you wish us to be (though we unfortunately are making some attempts to go that route). We have a safety net for those in need. But this wishful thinking that the free market and Republicans are going to disappear isn't going to happen.
Click to expand...

Obama, Pelosi, and Reid are doing a wonderful job of suppressing jobs. Democrats always get excited with holiday hiring and have no concept of what a good job is.
 
cawacko said:
This nation has the best entrepreneurial spirit in the world. We are not a European style welfare state that you wish us to be (though we unfortunately are making some attempts to go that route). We have a safety net for those in need. But this wishful thinking that the free market and Republicans are going to disappear isn't going to happen.
Click to expand...

In my opinion ObamaCare is better than raising/adjusting welfare or extending UI or any other single safety net/social program. The main benefit, or consequence in Repub parlance, is as people are diagnosed with illnesses that are a result of poor nutrition or lack of medication these things will come to the fore and be addressed. Are welfare recipients receiving sufficient funds to maintain health? If people can't afford medication and are filling up hospital beds it will become obvious it would be a lot less expensive to ensure people have sufficient medication.

See where it's going? Other countries that have government medical have used the trial and error method and learned on the way. As ObamaCare becomes more of a government program, which it will, those changes will untimately take effect as they are logical. If the expense of taking care of a stroke or heart attack victim can be prevented by ensuring one has $25.00 worth of pills a month the solution is a no-brainer. So, the hidden benefits of ObamaCare will untimately mean a better life for many while not making the US a welfare state.

As they say the fun has just begun. But, in all seriousness, I'm sure you see the logic behind it all.
 
apple0154 said:
In my opinion ObamaCare is better than raising/adjusting welfare or extending UI or any other single safety net/social program. The main benefit, or consequence in Repub parlance, is as people are diagnosed with illnesses that are a result of poor nutrition or lack of medication these things will come to the fore and be addressed. Are welfare recipients receiving sufficient funds to maintain health? If people can't afford medication and are filling up hospital beds it will become obvious it would be a lot less expensive to ensure people have sufficient medication.

See where it's going? Other countries that have government medical have used the trial and error method and learned on the way. As ObamaCare becomes more of a government program, which it will, those changes will untimately take effect as they are logical. If the expense of taking care of a stroke or heart attack victim can be prevented by ensuring one has $25.00 worth of pills a month the solution is a no-brainer. So, the hidden benefits of ObamaCare will untimately mean a better life for many while not making the US a welfare state.

As they say the fun has just begun. But, in all seriousness, I'm sure you see the logic behind it all.
Click to expand...

That's right, Apple. There's no going back. This is the first step towards inevitable single-payer health care. Let the unevolved knuckledraggers seethe; it won't stop the wheels that are now - gratefully, finally - in motion
 
Rune said:
Starglazer? Why do you hate fair wages?

Are you jealous that you couldn't qualify for a union job?
Click to expand...
What is the qualification for a union job?
Knowing the right person?
I've been unionised, years ago.
I was ejected from laborers local 223because I was English, 223 apparently is an Irish union.
Of course the Irish owned company I worked for, rehired me in a management role.
Doubled my income by getting out of the union trap!!
Best thing that ever happened to me!
 
apple0154 said:
In my opinion ObamaCare is better than raising/adjusting welfare or extending UI or any other single safety net/social program. The main benefit, or consequence in Repub parlance, is as people are diagnosed with illnesses that are a result of poor nutrition or lack of medication these things will come to the fore and be addressed. Are welfare recipients receiving sufficient funds to maintain health? If people can't afford medication and are filling up hospital beds it will become obvious it would be a lot less expensive to ensure people have sufficient medication.

See where it's going? Other countries that have government medical have used the trial and error method and learned on the way. As ObamaCare becomes more of a government program, which it will, those changes will untimately take effect as they are logical. If the expense of taking care of a stroke or heart attack victim can be prevented by ensuring one has $25.00 worth of pills a month the solution is a no-brainer. So, the hidden benefits of ObamaCare will untimately mean a better life for many while not making the US a welfare state.

As they say the fun has just begun. But, in all seriousness, I'm sure you see the logic behind it all.
Click to expand...

I wasn't talking about just health care but since you are I'll address the topic. In all seriousness I do not believe in the logic behind Obamacare and think it is going to make our health care system even worse. To start with our healthcare system (pre Obamacare) was just riddled with crony capitalism. Healthcare should have free prices and normal competition based on price and service. That has largely been eliminated. Now the government wants to step in and while claiming "competition" basically select a couple of companies that will give set plans to people on a national basis. That is not competition and the end result is going to be a lowering of care and a lowering of services for all except the rich who will be able to afford it on the side.

Maybe that is considered "compassionate" to some but it isn't in my book.
 
Bijou said:
That's right, Apple. There's no going back. This is the first step towards inevitable single-payer health care. Let the unevolved knuckledraggers seethe; it won't stop the wheels that are now - gratefully, finally - in motion
Click to expand...
Have you ever experienced the reality of government controlled healthcare?
 
Bijou said:
That's right, Apple. There's no going back. This is the first step towards inevitable single-payer health care. Let the unevolved knuckledraggers seethe; it won't stop the wheels that are now - gratefully, finally - in motion
Click to expand...

That's interesting your take that those who believe the free market and competition are what the health care industry needs are 'unevolved knuckledraggers'. To each his own but with that type of mindset this country would never have been founded.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top