What kind of "Christian values" do Conservatives want?

[christiefan915]

Homophobia isn't a Christian value. "Love the sinner, hate the sin."

"The simple fact that we label the person we are talking about as a “sinner” indicates that we do not have love for them in the first place. To label someone a “sinner” is to imply that they are outside of God’s grace and unless they clean up their act, cannot be forgiven.

To label someone a “sinner” reveals an “us vs. them” mentality, where you are the “righteous” person looking down your nose at the poor, wretched, ignorant “sinners” down below who just cannot get their act together. If only they would listen to what you tell them to do…"

 

[StoneByStone]

Nice try but no cigar. When a man ejaculates the sperm that don't fertilize an egg run it's life cycle and die naturally, The exact same with a woman's egg. That is the menstrual cycle. These actions are totally natural.
(this is a simplified version as I'm not an MD.)

You may be interested to know generally a miscarriage is natures abortion. That does not include outside injuries that also can cause a miscarriage. (Again a simplified version.)

So are you saying that sex isn't "natural" if it can't potentially result in childbirth?
That would mean that any kind of sex between infertile people is unnatural.

 

[StoneByStone]

Killing fags has always been around in every society, some for rape, pedophilia, theft, and hair cutting. So, what's your point, other than you want to prove the millionth time that you're a fcking moron.

#triggered

 

[Bobb]

Look at it like this. There was no internet porn in ancient times. However, because Judaism, Christianity, and Islam teach that lust and masturbation are sins, we can logically deduce that internet porn is a sin in these religions.
So while guns weren't around in Biblical times, we know Jesus would be against owning a gun because its use is for something he considered a sin.

You are an incredibly iognorant fckling moron. Jesus ordered his followers to carry swords (the equal of guns in that day). And, porn has always existed, moron. Being on the internet doesn't change the nature of porn.

 

[MAGA MAN]

"The simple fact that we label the person we are talking about as a “sinner” indicates that we do not have love for them in the first place. To label someone a “sinner” is to imply that they are outside of God’s grace and unless they clean up their act, cannot be forgiven.

To label someone a “sinner” reveals an “us vs. them” mentality, where you are the “righteous” person looking down your nose at the poor, wretched, ignorant “sinners” down below who just cannot get their act together. If only they would listen to what you tell them to do…"

Let's say Ben is your brother and his partner Jerry want to come visit in your home. They are “married” and proclaim their gay lifestyle openly. They expect to be welcomed as family members, to stay in the guest room together and you're supposed to act as if this is perfectly normal. But let's say you have a houseful of children, and you are doing your best to bring them up to understand what a true Catholic understanding of marriage is. You've taught them that Ben and Jerry's relationship is not that. So what are you going to do?

You have to choose between two goods.

Sometimes the best way to love the sinner and hate the sin is to speak clearly to the sinner about the situation and warn him.
The good of preserving your children's understanding of Christian marriage without confusion or compromise is a greater good than being nice to Ben and Jerry. After all, Ben and Jerry are not members of your immediate family, and although you might want to be nice to them, your duty to your children comes first. This is no different than any number of other choices we make between two goods. I want to take my kids on a grand European vacation, but I also want to pay for their college education. I choose the college education.

Therefore in the wish to be nice to everyone and love the sinner while hating the sin sometimes the sinner is going to get knocked. It can't be helped.

...

Finally, true love for the sinner is to see them for who they really are and to see past whatever problem, addiction, brokenness or confusion they suffer from and to wish God's perfect healing love to be active and fruitful in their lives. We're all a mess, and the sooner we realize it the better, and the person who is most compassionate is the one who realizes what God's amazing grace has done for them and how they have been rescued and to wish that same deliverance for others.

So it is first in our own conversion and the long, hard road of repentance, reconciliation and renewal that true love for the sinner and hatred of sin is fostered. Hatred of sin because we see how it has destroyed our own lives, and love for the sinner because we can see what they might be and who they could become if they were only to yield to that amazing grace.

That's why St Julian of Norwich writes that God looks on us with pity not with blame. His mercy is everlasting. He loves the sinner because he sees what that fallen, broken child could become, and he hates the sin because he sees how it has diseased and deformed the child.

When we begin to have those kind of everlasting eyes we can begin to hate the sin and love the sinner.

Everything else is either sentimental clap trap, wishful thinking or do-goodism.

https://www.catholiceducation.org/e...the-sin-love-the-sinner-how-do-i-do-that.html

 

[MAGA MAN]

Which part?
Do you not agree that the Right has been forced to accept gay marriage?

No one has forced me to accept it.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

The Right often talks about how things would be so great if America just embraced Christian valued like we supposedly did in the past. I know two Christian values they want to bring back are homophobia and a ban on abortion, but is that it? What else do you guys want to do to make America more Christian?

Those aren't Christian values. Those are lip-service christian RWNJ values. If you don't like it, then one of them will call you a "demmycunt".

 

[Dutch Uncle]

"The simple fact that we label the person we are talking about as a “sinner” indicates that we do not have love for them in the first place. To label someone a “sinner” is to imply that they are outside of God’s grace and unless they clean up their act, cannot be forgiven.

To label someone a “sinner” reveals an “us vs. them” mentality, where you are the “righteous” person looking down your nose at the poor, wretched, ignorant “sinners” down below who just cannot get their act together. If only they would listen to what you tell them to do…"

All Christians believe everyone is a sinner. They also believe only God can judge. It's the RWNJs who, like Trump, wrap themselves in a flag and carrying a Bible, who are seeking to use the Federal government to oppress other Americans.

 

[StoneByStone]

There's a colossal stigma against mental illness, but no one is particularly proud of it, though,

Yes, but mentally ill people weren't persecuted like gays in America. Don't get me wrong, America has a despicable history of refusing to help the mentally ill and sometimes ignoring violence against them. But it was never illegal to be bipolar like it was illegal to be gay. Nobody accused bipolar people of choosing to be mentally ill. Nobody accused bipolar people of being child molesters or Devil worshipers.
So it's just a very apples and oranges situation.

 

[StoneByStone]

No one has forced me to accept it.

I don't mean you, I mean the political Right.
Bush was able to use homophobia and the fear of gay marriage to get reelected. The reason Trump didn't do that is because it would never work today. Today's average American isn't homophobic, so the Republicans have been forced to accept that gay marriage is just a part of America.

 

[BattleofHodow]

Yes, but mentally ill people weren't persecuted like gays in America. Don't get me wrong, America has a despicable history of refusing to help the mentally ill and sometimes ignoring violence against them. But it was never illegal to be bipolar like it was illegal to be gay. Nobody accused bipolar people of choosing to be mentally ill. Nobody accused bipolar people of being child molesters or Devil worshipers.
So it's just a very apples and oranges situation.

I disagree, Mentally Ill tend to suffer the most in America.

Although it used to be a lot worse, when they were in padded cells mistreated with shock therapy.

None the less, a lot of people don't understand the mentally ill, and don't want to understand them.

Absolutely, a lot of people do think that mental illness is fake.

Mental Illness makes people miserable, to make matters worse, most of them can't work, and therefor get chump change through Social Security Disability.

 

[StoneByStone]

Probably Anton LaVey.

Christianity and Satanism were both created by a Jew.

Is that irony?

 

[MAGA MAN]

I don't mean you, I mean the political Right.
Bush was able to use homophobia and the fear of gay marriage to get reelected. The reason Trump didn't do that is because it would never work today. Today's average American isn't homophobic, so the Republicans have been forced to accept that gay marriage is just a part of America.

Interesting theory. But seriously, no one cares.

The official position of the political right is, and always was, that FedCo shouldn't be involved in marriage at all. It shouldn't be part of the tax code, or anywhere.

 

[Charoite]

They think guns and Capitalism are compatible with Christianity, but they don't claim that these things are Christian values.
That's what makes me so curious about what they mean when they say we need "Christian values." They never actually explain what those are. If they actually do mean guns and kicking people off food stamps, that just makes them even more ignorant of their own religion.

No, the extortionist fake Christian Televangelists got many of them going on that God finds wealth and status as Christian doctrine. It's commendable and part of being holy so buy me... I mean buy us that private jet. Those poor saps.

 

[StoneByStone]

That kind of sounds like the media, on Whites vs non-Whites, oh the Whites already have rights, the non-Whites need extra rights.

The difference is that Whites don't already have full rights, in fact they have less rights than non-white people. So the media is lying when they say this.
However, gays actually are still an oppressed minority. When the first Gay Pride parade was held, homosexual relations were still illegal in some states, so it meant a lot for gays to be able to march in the streets. Today there is a lot less homophobia, but that's because so many brave people came out of the closet in a very public way.

When should we start having Schizophrenia pride parades, or Fat pride parades?

We should start the Fat Pride parades as soon as possible. Maybe if they do some walking, they'll lose some weight.

But really, I'm all for normalizing getting help for mental illness. I don't think people with schizophrenia should have to hide in the shadows out of fear and shame.

 

[BattleofHodow]

The difference is that Whites don't already have full rights, in fact they have less rights than non-white people. So the media is lying when they say this.
However, gays actually are still an oppressed minority. When the first Gay Pride parade was held, homosexual relations were still illegal in some states, so it meant a lot for gays to be able to march in the streets. Today there is a lot less homophobia, but that's because so many brave people came out of the closet in a very public way.



We should start the Fat Pride parades as soon as possible. Maybe if they do some walking, they'll lose some weight.

But really, I'm all for normalizing getting help for mental illness. I don't think people with schizophrenia should have to hide in the shadows out of fear and shame.

That's true, however Gays are missing what rights now-a-days in this country, anyways?

Maybe you are targeting the wrong countries, maybe you should ask Muslims why they mistreat Gays so much more than Christians?

 

[AProudLefty]

To make America more Christian, free abortion for all the Jews. If we go with mandatory abortion, we should make them pay for it, because we wouldn't need "free" as an incentive. Alternatively, we could send all their children to mandatory boarding schools where the kids would learn not to be fcking Jews, a socialist idea Jews very much want to impose on everyone else.

If you want a more abortion-based program, I won't oppose you.

Go back to Stormfront.

 

[StoneByStone]

Interesting theory. But seriously, no one cares.

The official position of the political right is, and always was, that FedCo shouldn't be involved in marriage at all. It shouldn't be part of the tax code, or anywhere.

Nope. At one point, the political Right wanted homosexuality to remain illegal in America. However, as time went on, the Overton Window moved. So the Right went from "gay relations should be illegal" to "gay people shouldn't be allowed around children" to "gay marriage shouldn't be recognized."
Basically, the only reason you said no one cares is because you know I'm right. America has continually moved to the Left on gay rights, so the Right has been forced to move their goalposts.
Eventually you'll do the same thing with trans rights.

 

[MAGA MAN]

Nope. At one point, the political Right wanted homosexuality to remain illegal in America. However, as time went on, the Overton Window moved. So the Right went from "gay relations should be illegal" to "gay people shouldn't be allowed around children" to "gay marriage shouldn't be recognized."
Basically, the only reason you said no one cares is because you know I'm right. America has continually moved to the Left on gay rights, so the Right has been forced to move their goalposts.
Eventually you'll do the same thing with trans rights.

You may be able to find a few that can be described by your theory, but no one that I know thinks that way. And unlike you, I'm actually part of the "club".

 

[AProudLefty]

The Right often talks about how things would be so great if America just embraced Christian valued like we supposedly did in the past. I know two Christian values they want to bring back are homophobia and a ban on abortion, but is that it? What else do you guys want to do to make America more Christian?

Listen to Ted Cruz's father explaining the Christian values.