Kabbalah

Laws are not sentient. Laws are to rule people.

They are to be enforced on the world to hasten the arrival of moshiach.
However, when writing law you may remember history. This is lame, seriously lame.

They are not to be "enforced" until people willingly choose to submit after recognizing the benevolence of the Moshiach. Ignoring a basic tenet of a religion isn't argument, it is deliberate disingenuous behavior. You deliberately keep yourself in ignorance even when presented the actual Talmud to read you pretend that the only people with access to the "unexpurgated" version are those who fear it and preach against it.

You are deliberately keeping yourself in a prison of the mind. Let yourself free.
 
However, when writing law you may remember history. This is lame, seriously lame.

They are not to be "enforced" until people willingly choose to submit after recognizing the benevolence of the Moshiach. Ignoring a basic tenet of a religion isn't argument, it is deliberate disingenuous behavior. You deliberately keep yourself in ignorance even when presented the actual Talmud to read you pretend that the only people with access to the "unexpurgated" version are those who fear it and preach against it.

You are deliberately keeping yourself in a prison of the mind. Let yourself free.



You are deliberately distorting the teachings. They are to prepare the world for the arrival of moshiach. Preparation comes BEFORE, in case you forgot.
 
You are deliberately distorting the teachings. They are to prepare the world for the arrival of moshiach. Preparation comes BEFORE, in case you forgot.
No, it is distortion to take "prepare the world by acting morally" into "prepare the world" and then pretend that means by violence.

You take sites that deliberately distort the philosophy (not a religion itself BTW as you can be a Christian Kabbalist, Jewish, Muslim, or even Atheists) and then when others research other information pretend that theirs is the "wrong" information and the only "right" information is on conspiracy sites.

Here is what I found through active research on the subject of Kabbalism and the Universal Laws (Noachide Laws):

The word "noachide" itself only means "universal" and there are no punishments assigned to the "laws" any more than there are to the Law of Gravity and are given much the same weight by the Kabbalist. The only "punishment" one receives in Kabbalism for not following the "universal laws" is that they are now in dischord with the universe. There is no proscription for the death of anybody not following the laws, they are only said to be increasing the level of disorder rather than working in harmony with Creation. (I could see how this would be very much in alignment with many religions, including Buddhism.)

Judaism has 613 very specific rules, the Kabbalah only 7 wide-ranging rules. The Philosophy is much different than the religion of Judaism. While at the beginning all Kabbalists were Jewish, it is no longer the case. I don't see how Atheism fits but they even often accept even those Atheists who are "Kabbalists"...

They believe that consideration of each of the laws will reveal deeper secrets to the soul of the Kabbalist as they are layered and multi-faceted.

So far, each of the things you fear are shown to be ridiculous on its face. First that such laws will be forced on others, it is not part of the teaching or even of the Talmud. In the Talmud Jewish practitioners are told to go forth and prepare the world, but they are specifically told HOW to do this, they are told to go and "act morally" and to perform "charitable acts". In no way are they told to go forth and beat you into submission or to cut off heads.

By making it all "prepare the world" and removing the part about HOW they are to do it, you attempt to make it sound sinister and dangerous. You begin to exaggerate the "danger" and then "warn" people of how they believe the whole world will unite beneath a Moshiach (This is Judaism and not Kabbalism they are different things) and then everybody will be forced to follow these laws at danger of death.

This too is an exaggeration. They believe that all people will unite under the "universal laws" when humankind grows enough to live in Harmony rather than in dischord with Creation (Kabbalism) Those Kabbalists who are Jewish and believe that a messiah is coming (not all Jews subscribe to this belief) believe that he will be the sign that humankind is ready for this harmony and that they will accept him universally as a leader because of his benevolence and begin their study of the multi-layered laws which will reveal stuff to them.
 
No, it is distortion to take "prepare the world by acting morally" into "prepare the world" and then pretend that means by violence.
No. Many people consider religious laws to be moral. Religious people have been known to think violent theocracies are a divine vehicle of god.
You take sites that deliberately distort the philosophy (not a religion itself BTW as you can be a Christian Kabbalist, Jewish, Muslim, or even Atheists) and then when others research other information pretend that theirs is the "wrong" information and the only "right" information is on conspiracy sites.

Here is what I found through active research on the subject of Kabbalism and the Universal Laws (Noachide Laws):

The word "noachide" itself only means "universal" and there are no punishments assigned to the "laws" any more than there are to the Law of Gravity and are given much the same weight by the Kabbalist. The only "punishment" one receives in Kabbalism for not following the "universal laws" is that they are now in dischord with the universe. There is no proscription for the death of anybody not following the laws, they are only said to be increasing the level of disorder rather than working in harmony with Creation. (I could see how this would be very much in alignment with many religions, including Buddhism.)

Judaism has 613 very specific rules, the Kabbalah only 7 wide-ranging rules. The Philosophy is much different than the religion of Judaism. While at the beginning all Kabbalists were Jewish, it is no longer the case. I don't see how Atheism fits but they even often accept even those Atheists who are "Kabbalists"...

They believe that consideration of each of the laws will reveal deeper secrets to the soul of the Kabbalist as they are layered and multi-faceted.

So far, each of the things you fear are shown to be ridiculous on its face. First that such laws will be forced on others, it is not part of the teaching or even of the Talmud. In the Talmud Jewish practitioners are told to go forth and prepare the world, but they are specifically told HOW to do this, they are told to go and "act morally" and to perform "charitable acts". In no way are they told to go forth and beat you into submission or to cut off heads.


Your dismissive and cursory analysis is laughable. keep it up, potzy.

I'm rootin for ya, little train that can't.
 
Damo and Theocracy, sitting in a tree, k.i.s.s.i.n.g..........
And now we know what level you "argue" to. Repeat something I already answered again... It makes it sound like you know what you are talking about and can actually understand things you read that don't agree with your current narrow and scared view of all those evil "Jews" studying to do magic...
 
No. Many people consider religious laws to be moral. Religious people have been known to think violent theocracies are a divine vehicle of god.



Your dismissive and cursory analysis is laughable. keep it up, potzy.

I'm rootin for ya, little train that can't.
Imagine, you had no words to actually bring forward a considered opinion so you resort to more childish ad hominem.

Continue removing portions of sentences then pretending that you have the whole of knowledge. Read more sites about how we are to "fear" the Kabbalist because they are going to beat us all into submission. Confuse again the meaning of noachide and present a "punishment" where none exists in the actual writing. All of these things are done by those alarmist sites you read to get your "information" on the philosophy.
 
http://www.noahide.org/article.asp?Level=173&Parent=166

note the many references to capital punishment.
The Seven Noahide laws are general commandments with many details. Transgressing any one of them is considered such a breach in the natural order that the offender incurs the death penalty. Apart from a few exceptions, the death sentence for a Ben Noach is Sayif, death by the sword / decapitation, the least painful of the four modes of execution of criminals (see the Rambam's Hilchos Melachim 9:14). (The four methods of capital punishment in Torah are: S’kilah - Stoning; S’rifah - Burning; Hereg - Decapitation; Henek - Strangulation.) The many formalities of procedure essential when the accused is an Israelite need not be observed in the case of the Noachite. The latter may be convicted on the testimony of one witness, even on that of relatives, but not on that of a woman. He need have had no warning from the witnesses; and a single judge may pass sentence on him (Sanhedrin 57a, b; Rambam, Hilchos Melakim 9:14).

Besides these seven major Mitzvos, Chazal received a tradition that there are other Mitzvos and prohibitions that are incumbent upon Benei Noach. The Beraisa in Sanhedrin 56b, notes certain Tana'im who rule that other prohibitions are incumbent upon Benei Noach. These prohibitions are:

Hebrew Transliteration English Translation Talmud
1 Dam Min ha'Chai not to eat blood that is taken from an animal when it is alive Rabbi Chananyah ben Gamliel said: Also not to partake of the blood drawn from a living animal
2 Sirus not to perform castration/emasculation Rabbi Chidka said, they are also forbidden to castrate
3 Kishuf witchcraft Rabbi Shimon said, also Kishuf (witchcraft /sorcery) is forbidden to them.
Rabbi Yossi said, everything in the Parshah of Kishuf is forbidden to them (Deut. / Devarim 18:10-11)

4 Harba'as Behemah mating different species of animals Rabbi Eliezer added Kilayim (forbidden mixture) in plants and animals. They are permitted to wear Sha'atnez - garments of mixed fabrics [of wool and linen] and sow diverse seeds together; they are forbidden only to hybridize heterogeneous animals and graft trees of different kinds.
5 Harkavas ha'Ilan grafting trees

The Amora'im add two more prohibitions:

1. Keeping Shabbos, that is, choosing a day of the week on which to refrain from work (Sanhedrin 58b).
2. Learning Torah other than the portions that deal with the seven major Mitzvos above (San. 59a).

The Rambam in Hilchos Melachim 8:11, writes that all Benei Noach who accept upon themselves the Seven Mitzvos and are careful to keep them and are precise in their observance are termed 'Chasidei Umos ha'Olam' מֵחֲסִידֵי אֻמּוֹת הָעוֹלָם ('the Pious Ones of the Nations') and they merit a share in the World to Come. However, they must keep these Mitzvos specifically because HaShem (G-d) commanded them in the Torah through Moshe Rabeinu (Moses). If they keep and perform these Mitzvos (laws) out of intellectual conviction and as logical guidelines for the survival of the world, they are not a resident alien (Ger Toshav), nor of the Pious among the Gentiles (Chasid Umot HaOlam), nor of their wise men.

When a Ben Noach fulfills a Mitzvah of the Torah that is not prohibited to him, he receives the reward of an 'Eino Metzuveh v'Oseh' - 'one who performs a Mitzvah in which he was not commanded.' This reward is less than the reward of one who performs Mitzvos in which he was commanded (Gemara Bava Kama 38a, Kidushin 31a).

According to the Rambam's Hilchos Melachim

Avodah Zarah - Idolatry - עבודה זרה

A gentile who worships false gods is liable to the death penalty, provided he worships them in the regular form in which that particular deity is usually worshiped. A gentile is executed for every type of foreign worship which a Jewish court would consider worthy of capital punishment. However, a gentile is not executed for a type of foreign worship which a Jewish court would not deem worthy of capital punishment. Nevertheless, even though a gentile will not be executed for these forms of worship, he is forbidden to engage in all of them. They are not allow them to erect a monument, or to plant an asherah, or to make images and the like, even though they are only for the sake of beauty.

Birchat HaShem - Blasphemy - ברכת השם

A gentile who curses God's Name, whether he uses God's unique Name or one of His other names, in any language, is liable to the death penalty. Blasphemy with one of the attributes of God's name is an action which, if committed by an Israelite, would not be regarded as criminal (Sanhedrin 56b).

Dinim - Justice - הדינים

The Noachidæ are required to establish courts of justice in every city and province; and these courts are to judge the people with regard to the six laws and to warn them against the transgression of any of them (Rambam, Hilchos Melakim 9:14, 10:11; comp. Nachmanides on Gen. 34:13, where the opinion is expressed that these courts should judge also cases other than those coming under the head of the six laws, as, for example, larceny, assault and battery, etc.). A gentile who transgresses one of these Seven Mitzvot shall be executed by decapitation. A gentile is executed on the basis of the testimony of one witness and the verdict of a single judge. No prior warning is required. Relatives may serve as witnesses. However, a woman may not serve as a witness or a judge for them.

Shefichat Damim - Murder - שפיכות דמים

A gentile who slays a human being, even a fetus in its mother's womb, must be executed in retribution for its death. Similarly, if he slew a person who would have otherwise died in the near future or killed a person whose life is despaired of, or tied up and placed someone before a lion , or starved a person to death, he should be executed , for he has committed murder in one manner or other. Similarly, a pursuer should be executed if he kills the person he is chasing when he could have saved the latter's potential victim by maiming one of the attacker's limbs. Under the same circumstances an Israelite would not be executed. (Sanhedrin 57b; Rambam, Hilchos Melakim 9:4; comp. Kesef Mishneh, ad loc.).
 
You are once again confusing Judaism with Kabbalism. What are you talking about here.

Kabbalism have the 7 Noachide laws and do not have punishment. The Jewish religion had, and has, punishments for breaking other laws.

Mixing the two and presenting it in a "sinister and dangerous" voice doesn't change that this site is mixings its metaphors, so to speak.

This is like reading the Old Testament and saying that all Christians want to kill people who hang out with their wives on their periods.
 
Imagine, you had no words to actually bring forward a considered opinion so you resort to more childish ad hominem.

Continue removing portions of sentences then pretending that you have the whole of knowledge. Read more sites about how we are to "fear" the Kabbalist because they are going to beat us all into submission. Confuse again the meaning of noachide and present a "punishment" where none exists in the actual writing. All of these things are done by those alarmist sites you read to get your "information" on the philosophy.


You can't argue with someone you must educate.
 
No. It means "relating to the covenant of noah, as alleged in the talmud".
It doesn't though. I accepted that meaning until I took your advice and actually educated myself on it. I suggest you educate yourself by visiting some sites other than the paranoid.
 
It doesn't though. I accepted that meaning until I took your advice and actually educated myself on it. I suggest you educate yourself by visiting some sites other than the paranoid.

Yes. It does though. Really really. It will mean universal if the plan succeeds and the the noahide laws do, in fact, govern the world, but you're not there yet, sparky, the mason. Right now it's just wishful thinking. ;)

You're good at helping prep the appropriate frames.
 
Linky...

A number of celebrities, notably Madonna, are embracing a religion called Kabbalah. Celebrities I say! That is all the endorsement I need. I decided it was time to look into it.

I started with Wikipedia. Here’s what I learned about Kabbalah:

1. It’s all very confusing.
2. No one is quite sure what it is, including the people doing it.
3. Old dead people are somehow to blame.
4. Mastering Kabbalah gives you insight into God, as far as you know.

To master Kabbalah, first you must learn to understand a special language called gobbledygook. For example, in Kabbalah-talk, the definition of tzimtzum goes like this:

“The act whereby God contracted his infinite light, leaving a void into which the light of existence was poured. The primal emanation became Azilut, the World of Light, from which the three lower worlds, Beriah, Yetzirah and Assiyah, descended.”

I’m sure you had the same reaction I did when I read about tzimtzum: “I must renounce my current beliefs and dedicate my life to Kabbalah!”

more at link...
Really interesting, *yawn, yawn, yawn* Sorry Damo.
 
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