When Will We Recover From The Civil War? Now Is The Time.

Hello Dutch Uncle,

Dutch Uncle said:
Disagreed that my post was meaningless or off topic.



According to you Israel didn't become a country until it was recognized by others. Since Palestine was never recognized as a country, then you agree it was never a country and the whining of Palestinians is bullshit.
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'According to me' can be found in my posts, not yours.

I am not accountable for what you write. If you want to know my views, they are found in my posts. 'According to you,' and 'So you are saying' are ways of trying to put words into the mouths of others.

If you are making counter arguments, fine. Take credit for them. Make them good and I will acknowledge it. Leave holes in them and I will find them. That works both ways.
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello Dutch Uncle,



The south was fighting the progress of the nation.

DT fans are fighting the progress of the world.

Doomed causes, both.

One may as well try to hold back a mighty river in extreme flood stage with a sand dike as the rain continues unabated.
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So killing almost 700,000 Americans, about 2% of the population, was done for "progress" just like Stalin killed 39M Russians for the same reason?
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello Dutch Uncle,



'According to me' can be found in my posts, not yours.

I am not accountable for what you write. If you want to know my views, they are found in my posts. 'According to you,' and 'So you are saying' are ways of trying to put words into the mouths of others.

If you are making counter arguments, fine. Take credit for them. Make them good and I will acknowledge it. Leave holes in them and I will find them. That works both ways.
Click to expand...

Yes. You wrote "You are not a country unless most of the world recognizes you as one". Since Palestine was never recognized as a country before Israel was recognized as one, they didn't exist.
 
Hello Triplelefthook,

Triplelefthook said:
PoliTalker -

I can happily abide by those rules and I have really enjoyed your posts so far, mostly only had time to read them in this thread.

Full disclosure - I am white, British immigrant to the USA, parents are English (father) and Irish (mother) and I have no accent so I sound as American as they come. My parents have never faced any discrimination in this country, neither have I.

My father was once speeding with his friend in Scotland and they were beaten up by the cops for being English and my mother was hated in England for years until she lost her Irish accent and pretended to be English. That's it tho, that;s the extent of my hardships.

That being said my parents in this country had a variation of that 'talk.' The talk was to be respectful, careful and compliant with police because they have the capacity to abuse their power and you cannot give them any excuse to abuse that power.

If no one is breaking the law, don't black americans have every opportunity that white americans do? I feel like this is a lot more alongg the lines of poverty and class rather than race.
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So glad you found us. I am always happy to discuss politics on an academic level. Correct, theoretically, nothing is holding anyone back. Anyone who is determined enough can make it if they are of a mind to, and strive unrelentingly toward their goals. But it is harder for blacks to do that than it is for whites.

Some black people can and do excel in the USA. But they are more the exception than the norm. The reason is racism. Whites are more likely to get the benefit of the doubt whether it comes to policing or opportunity. The American confederacy fought to continue the dying limited slave economy which produced few paying jobs and very little opportunity. The rich and powerful few did not wish to give up their position, so they refused to admit that slavery was wrong, that they were wrong to perpetuate it. They lied to themselves when they believed that blacks could not learn to read nor write. They knew it was a lie because they forbade teaching blacks nor allowing them to attend school. The war took their power to continue slavery, but did not take their power to wage racism. Their insolence has been handed down generation to generation, just as the hopelessness of poverty has.

We face a massive challenge to try to reverse these long standing trends.

You take a white kid from a successful family and compare to a black kid born into poverty and the white kid is more likely to succeed. The parents know how to succeed and they pass that knowledge on. The impoverished parents have no such knowledge to pass on, if they are even together. Single parenthood is more predominate in poverty just as cohesive functional family structure is more predominate with comfortable (not great) wealth. Upward mobility in the USA is falling, has fallen for quite some time. Working one's way up from poverty does not happen as much as it once did. Cruel forces of wealth and power act to prevent success. Consider 'Buy Here Pay Here' car lots and 'Payday Loan' joints. Both seek to lock low earners into permanent indebtedness which prevents upward mobility. That is just one egregious example. These forces which prevent success are a more present roadblock for blacks than for whites.

White families in America benefited greatly from government rebuilding programs after WWII where blacks were prevented. The GI bill allowed many whites to get college paid for. Redlining prevented blacks from getting home mortgages. Home ownership was / is the major method of wealth accumulation which delineates the middle class from poverty. Whites got homes, blacks did not. Whites saw those homes appreciate in value, and with it, their wealth rose. Blacks were locked out of this. Whites had the baby boomer generation. New cars, homes, success and opportunity were all readily available for whites, unattainable for most blacks.

Racism has been a national shame. It is time we work to turn that around.
 
Triplelefthook said:
PoliTalker -

I can happily abide by those rules and I have really enjoyed your posts so far, mostly only had time to read them in this thread.

Full disclosure - I am white, British immigrant to the USA, parents are English (father) and Irish (mother) and I have no accent so I sound as American as they come. My parents have never faced any discrimination in this country, neither have I.

My father was once speeding with his friend in Scotland and they were beaten up by the cops for being English and my mother was hated in England for years until she lost her Irish accent and pretended to be English. That's it tho, that;s the extent of my hardships.

That being said my parents in this country had a variation of that 'talk.' The talk was to be respectful, careful and compliant with police because they have the capacity to abuse their power and you cannot give them any excuse to abuse that power.

If no one is breaking the law, don't black americans have every opportunity that white americans do? I feel like this is a lot more alongg the lines of poverty and class rather than race.
Click to expand...

The abuse of black people is systemic and historical. The cops have abused blacks since the civil war and still are. We have 2 school systems, the black one is far inferior. and lacks equipment. Blacks have been prevented from buying homes in many white areas. It is called redlining. Blacks get pulled over driving a lot more. It is called "driving while black' When the economy tightens its belt, blacks are the first notch. Blacks get longer sentences for the same crimes whites commit.Cops are far more abusive to them. The Repubs still try to prevent blacks from voting. They have lots of systems in place to prevent their vote.
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello Triplelefthook,



So glad you found us. I am always happy to discuss politics on an academic level. Correct, theoretically, nothing is holding anyone back. Anyone who is determined enough can make it if they are of a mind to, and strive unrelentingly toward their goals. But it is harder for blacks to do that than it is for whites.

Some black people can and do excel in the USA. But they are more the exception than the norm. The reason is racism. Whites are more likely to get the benefit of the doubt whether it comes to policing or opportunity. The American confederacy fought to continue the dying limited slave economy which produced few paying jobs and very little opportunity. The rich and powerful few did not wish to give up their position, so they refused to admit that slavery was wrong, that they were wrong to perpetuate it. They lied to themselves when they believed that blacks could not learn to read nor write. They knew it was a lie because they forbade teaching blacks nor allowing them to attend school. The war took their power to continue slavery, but did not take their power to wage racism. Their insolence has been handed down generation to generation, just as the hopelessness of poverty has.

We face a massive challenge to try to reverse these long standing trends.

You take a white kid from a successful family and compare to a black kid born into poverty and the white kid is more likely to succeed. The parents know how to succeed and they pass that knowledge on. The impoverished parents have no such knowledge to pass on, if they are even together. Single parenthood is more predominate in poverty just as cohesive functional family structure is more predominate with comfortable (not great) wealth. Upward mobility in the USA is falling, has fallen for quite some time. Working one's way up from poverty does not happen as much as it once did. Cruel forces of wealth and power act to prevent success. Consider 'Buy Here Pay Here' car lots and 'Payday Loan' joints. Both seek to lock low earners into permanent indebtedness which prevents upward mobility. That is just one egregious example. These forces which prevent success are a more present roadblock for blacks than for whites.

White families in America benefited greatly from government rebuilding programs after WWII where blacks were prevented. The GI bill allowed many whites to get college paid for. Redlining prevented blacks from getting home mortgages. Home ownership was / is the major method of wealth accumulation which delineates the middle class from poverty. Whites got homes, blacks did not. Whites saw those homes appreciate in value, and with it, their wealth rose. Blacks were locked out of this. Whites had the baby boomer generation. New cars, homes, success and opportunity were all readily available for whites, unattainable for most blacks.

Racism has been a national shame. It is time we work to turn that around.
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how. what's the plan, retard?
 
Dutch Uncle said:
At least being unemployed allows you to study more on the internet but I think you just spend your time trolling message boards and jerking off to free porn.
Click to expand...

no pro globalism arguments?

tell me about "comparative advantage" or a "consumer" or "post-industrial" "new normal", fuckface.
 
Triplelefthook said:
...Full disclosure - I am white, British immigrant to the USA, parents are English (father) and Irish (mother) and I have no accent so I sound as American as they come. My parents have never faced any discrimination in this country, neither have I....
Click to expand...
You'll find a lot of people like you....just a hundred or more years since their parents immigrated.

You'll find many Americans with a heritage like this:

45g11j.jpg


The "talk" advice is good all over the world. I used to have a lead foot (until I finally learned it's never good to be the first one at the scene of an accident....but I beat the EMTs by 30 minutes!!). Whenever I was stopped it was car off, keys on dash, music off (if it's still running), sunglasses off, registration and ID's ready with hands on steering wheel, all "sirs" or "ma'ms", be honest. 9 out of 10 times I got off with a warning. Having a military ID helped.
 
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Nordberg said:
The abuse of black people is systemic and historical. The cops have abused blacks since the civil war and still are. We have 2 school systems, the black one is far inferior. and lacks equipment. Blacks have been prevented from buying homes in many white areas. It is called redlining. Blacks get pulled over driving a lot more. It is called "driving while black' When the economy tightens its belt, blacks are the first notch. Blacks get longer sentences for the same crimes whites commit.Cops are far more abusive to them. The Repubs still try to prevent blacks from voting. They have lots of systems in place to prevent their vote.
Click to expand...

That's inaccurate. Housing restrictions are illegal. What you are addressing is economic disparities. As noted below, schools are primarily funded locally with State and county funds. It's why parents, if able, will move to a "better school district" usually meaning better funded. When a city "gentrifies" an area, it usually means taxes are raised to a level above anyone in the lower income brackets or on welfare. They are forced out and the middle-class and higher move in regardless of race.

http://www.ascd.org/publications/ed...qual-School-Funding-in-the-United-States.aspx
Public school funding in the United States comes from federal, state, and local sources, but because nearly half of those funds come from local property taxes, the system generates large funding differences between wealthy and impoverished communities. Such differences exist among states, among school districts within each state, and even among schools within specific districts.

https://www.the74million.org/articl...istrict-lines-here-are-some-ways-to-fix-that/
Smith-oped.jpg
 
A white kid from middle class suburbia has a better chance to achieve the American Dream than a black kid from a low income area.

The white kid is frequently descendant from a family which fought in WWII, took advantage of the GI Bill, and built wealth through home ownership unavailable to blacks who also fought in WWII.

-Because of the redlining which was common in the 1950's.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
We're living in a time when both parties have moved to extremes.
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I must vehemently disagree with this as it reveals a parochial perspective.

The American Democratic Party is lightyears to the RIGHT of the UK's TORY Party, for example.

We are the only developed nation in the world without socialized medicine, and the Republican-Lite half of the Democratic Party, Sleepy Joe Biden included, still opposes it.

With this in mind, one cannot say that both parties have gone to extremes without admitting that the American CENTER is nothing short of feudal in its social regressiveness.

We are the oldest continually functioning democracy on the planet, although the democracy part is collapsing, so what might once have been called progressive is now hopelessly obsolete.
And was it really ever progressive when it began with slavery?

As in 2016, I will be forced to vote for a Democratic nominee whom I'd really rather pummel with a baseball bat because the only other viable opponent is nothing short of Hitlerian in character.
Just agree on no murder and rape and work the rest of the stuff out?
Sorry, but my absolute minimal standards are much higher than that.

America is an anachronism.
The Blue States must form something much better, because the red state populations have simply not evolved to the current standards of humanity and must now be considered a lesser species.
A kinder person than I might be able to tolerate them, but I viscerally hate them and make no effort to hide that fact anymore. They're just too repugnant.
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello NiftyNiblick,



No.

We are stronger together.

1/2 of the USA could not have won WWII.

1/2 the USA could not win the next big challenge.

And the last thing we want is another country right next door that opposes everything we do, everything that is good.

No!

The Union must be preserved. That is the vision of the founders and that is what we must fight for.

The responsibility to preserve the Union falls upon our shoulders.

If the Constitution is valid then we must endure 100%.

If we have to break up the Union that means the Constitution is a failure, that the very idea of a United States is a failure.

We must not accept failure.

No.

We shall fight for endurance.

The worthy and just commitment was made before any of us was born. It falls upon us to live up to it and keep it going.

That is not pollyanish.

That is fortitude.
Click to expand...

I find your standards to be much too low, Politalker.
What you accept is what I regard as a life not worth living.
We have no more in common with one another than we do with the red state fascists.

I have a right to be incensed. I'm forced to vote for Joe Fucking Biden when I'd rather kick his socially regressive ass.
 
NiftyNiblick said:


I must vehemently disagree with this as it reveals a parochial perspective.

The American Democratic Party is lightyears to the RIGHT of the UK's TORY Party, for example.

We are the only developed nation in the world without socialized medicine, and the Republican-Lite half of the Democratic Party, Sleepy Joe Biden included, still opposes it.

With this in mind, one cannot say that both parties have gone to extremes without admitting that the American CENTER is nothing short of feudal in its social regressiveness.

We are the oldest continually functioning democracy on the planet, although the democracy part is collapsing, so what might once have been called progressive is now hopelessly obsolete.
And was it really ever progressive when it began with slavery?

As in 2016, I will be forced to vote for a Democratic nominee whom I'd really rather pummel with a baseball bat because the only other viable opponent is nothing short of Hitlerian in character.
Just agree on no murder and rape and work the rest of the stuff out?
Sorry, but my absolute minimal standards are much higher than that.

America is an anachronism.
The Blue States must form something much better, because the red state populations have simply not evolved to the current standards of humanity and must now be considered a lesser species.
A kinder person than I might be able to tolerate them, but I viscerally hate them and make no effort to hide that fact anymore. They're just too repugnant.
Click to expand...

you're a brainwash victim. snap out of it, putzo.
 
PoliTalker said:
A white kid from middle class suburbia has a better chance to achieve the American Dream than a black kid from a low income area.

The white kid is frequently descendant from a family which fought in WWII, took advantage of the GI Bill, and built wealth through home ownership unavailable to blacks who also fought in WWII.

-Because of the redlining which was common in the 1950's.
Click to expand...

PoliTalker -

But what about A black kid from middle class suburbia vs. a white kid born in poverty? who has the advantage there>?

What about a black kid in poverty vs. a white kid in poverty?

I understand and accept the argument that black people have been set back due to the redlining in the 50's, Segregation etc... my in-laws are in their 70's and grew up in this America so we are not that far removed from it now.

But where is the racism now? Discriminatory housing practices are illegal (as mentioned in this thread), there are affirmative action programs that arguably give black people an advantage over white people, there are hate crime laws, vast amounts of pressure to be politically correct and sensitive to racial issues...

Is this a race issue anymore? Or is it a poverty issue? And if there are more black people in poverty today because of the sins of the past - what is the solution there? The War of Poverty was a huge failure, and arguably made the problem worse (despite what i see as good intentions) so what is the answer?

Hasn't Trump helped the black community with his Opportunity Zone and First Step initiatives?
 
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