white house asking union goons to silence opposition

The fallacy is that obstructionists think they need to be silenced in order for reform to become reality.

Americans across the country are demanding comprehensive health reform and cannot afford to wait any longer for compassionless conservatives to act.

Businesses and families are struggling as costs continue to skyrocket.

The glaring flaws in the health care system are apparent to all but the tiny, impotent GOP who continue to obstruct the will of the voters in exchange for insurance lobbyist's money.

President Obama has conclusively demonstrated the unacceptable costs of maintaining the status quo, the current system has failed millions of Americans and we must enact comprehensive health reform this year.
 
at 52 seconds in you can get a clear view of the front shirt of the man who knocked the minister to the ground.....now, again....are you denying that he was a union member?....

I saw the words "Health care 09" on the shirt. Is that the guy?

If it was a union member, what difference does it make? Nobody should have gotten violent. Why does it make it worse if the guy was union?
 
I saw the words "Health care 09" on the shirt. Is that the guy?

If it was a union member, what difference does it make? Nobody should have gotten violent. Why does it make it worse if the guy was union?

Perhaps because the union was there at the request of Obama?.....after all, as DNC said...

President Obama has conclusively demonstrated the unacceptable costs of maintaining the status quo
 
Not only has the president tried to bring the minority party on board, he is repulsed by the thuggish tactics of the insurance lobby, which seelk to discredit the reform movement by any means they can.

In fact. the Obama Administration has invited small business owners, rural Americans, physicians, and other key stakeholders to the White House for a series of roundtable discussions on health reform.

The Health Care Stakeholder Discussions bring together Administration officials and Americans from around the country to discuss their experiences with the health care system and the urgent need for health reform this year.
 
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/06/unions-to-take-on-conserv_n_252720.html

how 'bout Huffington?......"The nation's largest federation of labor organizations has promised to directly engage with boisterous conservative protesters at Democratic town halls during the August recess."

I read this before. It says nothing about Obama asking the unions to engage with protesters. Please don't come back with "it's implied".

I could stand off against protesters and it doesn't mean Obama made me do it.
 
Oh, but it's ok for all you guys to say that the protesters are being egged on by the Republican party.

or are paid mobs for the insurance companies...

get used to it, the Hugo sent out a email asking "his followers" to go out and GET INVOLVED to stop the spreading of Disinformation...

this guy that was hospitalized is the result of the Hugo..no ifs and or buts..
 
Oh, but it's ok for all you guys to say that the protesters are being egged on by the Republican party.

or are paid mobs for the insurance companies...

get used to it, the Hugo sent out a email asking "his followers" to go out and GET INVOLVED to stop the spreading of Disinformation...

this guy that was hospitalized is the result of the Hugo..no ifs and or buts..

The guy wasn't hospitalized. He got up and walked away, and later on went to get examined.
 
I read this before. It says nothing about Obama asking the unions to engage with protesters. Please don't come back with "it's implied".

I could stand off against protesters and it doesn't mean Obama made me do it.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jlMpJGn28kqCcgU-aGcYE_ZHW-ywD99TO8MO2

...White House aides David Axelrod and Jim Messina traveled to the Capitol for their presentation to Democratic senators. Senators saw videos of disruptions at events held by House members, and were told to organize their events more carefully as well as work with labor unions and other friendly groups to generate enthusiasm....
Axelrod invented both term and tactic of astroturfing.
 
Thank you for being reasonable.

did you catch that taichi and darla?

I catch you trying to delude yourself to thinking you're smarter than everyone else. Let me dumb it down for you:

1) To date YOU cannot provide evidence beyond a reasonable doubt that supports your subject title for this thread.

2) To date, the video DOES NOT verify that a union man started the fight, or was responsible for the downed victim.

3) To date, there is NO audio proof of the N word being thrown about. Also, no mention by you or any of the astro turf'er supporters that a black man is clearly stating that he was hit by another black man....so the charge of "racism" is not only nullified, but void.

4) The question you put to Christie is circumspect, but it does NOT change these facts: the people who showed up for the express purpose of being against a townhall meeting arrived at the direction of the groups I sourced earlier. Astro-turf'ers by association, as it were.

5) Why hasn't the GOP leadership organized their own town hall's to address healthcare concerns? If the astro turf tactics are distasteful, why no public denouncement of them from the GOP leadership en masse?
 
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"This term has actually been floating around for a while. Word Spy dates its first appearance in print back to 1986, when Senator Lloyd Bentsen of Texas was quoted in the National Journal explaining that "grass roots" letter campaigns were "AstroTurf in many cases, artificial turf."

http://vintage-vocabulary.blogspot.com/2009/04/splendor-in-fake-grass.html

I still don't get what the problem is. Why shouldn't labor unions and friendly groups attend the events if they support the agenda?

"Senators saw videos of disruptions at events held by House members, and were told to organize their events more carefully as well as work with labor unions and other friendly groups to generate enthusiasm."
 
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Annie, please provide the quote from your source that has Axelrod coining the tmer and the paragraph(s) of him "inventing" the tactic....because I must have missed it.

Common knowledge in Chicago and other informed sources:

http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/content/mar2008/db20080314_121054.htm

BW CHICAGO March 14, 2008, 4:20PM EST
The Secret Side of David Axelrod
The Obama campaign's chief strategist is a master of "Astroturfing" and has a second firm that shapes public opinion for corporations

By Howard Wolinsky

David Axelrod has long been known for his political magic. Through his AKP&D Message & Media consultancy, the campaign veteran has advised a succession of Democratic candidates since 1985, and he's now chief strategist for Senator Barack Obama's bid for President. But on the down low, Axelrod moonlights in the private sector.

From the same address in Chicago's River North neighborhood, Axelrod operates a second business, ASK Public Strategies, that discreetly plots strategy and advertising campaigns for corporate clients to tilt public opinion their way. He and his partners consider virtually everything about ASK to be top secret, from its client roster and revenue to even the number of its employees. But customers and public records confirm that it has quarterbacked campaigns for the Chicago Children's Museum, ComEd, Cablevision, and AT&T.

ASK's predilection for operating in the shadows shows up in its work. On behalf of ComEd and Comcast, the firm helped set up front organizations that were listed as sponsors of public-issue ads. Industry insiders call such practices "Astroturfing," a reference to manufacturing grassroots support. Alderman Brendan Reilly of the 42nd Ward, who has been battling the Children's Museum's relocation plans, describes ASK as "the gold standard in Astroturf organizing. This is an emerging industry, and ASK has made a name for itself in shaping public opinion and manufacturing public support."...
 

Okay, but it wasn't stated in the original article. And although Axelrod is a master, I believe the origin of the term was given to the late Sen. Bensten of Texas.

First off I noticed that NONE of Wolinsky's reports has Axelrod offices orchestrating groups of people to invade town hall meetings for the sole purpose of disrupting/halting a discussion. The original "astroturfing" had to do with the old "back room" funding of groups who lobby and make PR campaigns in favor of a candidate or cause. http://www.ehow.com/facts_5017251_definition-astroturf-lobbying.html
Political chicanery to be sure...and both Dems and Repubs have been guilty over the years.....but let's get real....this is the first time it's devolved to yahoo status we are seeing post-Shrub years...which goes somewhat beyond the pale of what Axelrod's firm does.
 
Okay, but it wasn't stated in the original article. And although Axelrod is a master, I believe the origin of the term was given to the late Sen. Bensten of Texas.

First off I noticed that NONE of Wolinsky's reports has Axelrod offices orchestrating groups of people to invade town hall meetings for the sole purpose of disrupting/halting a discussion. The original "astroturfing" had to do with the old "back room" funding of groups who lobby and make PR campaigns in favor of a candidate or cause. http://www.ehow.com/facts_5017251_definition-astroturf-lobbying.html
Political chicanery to be sure...and both Dems and Repubs have been guilty over the years.....but let's get real....this is the first time it's devolved to yahoo status we are seeing post-Shrub years...which goes somewhat beyond the pale of what Axelrod's firm does.
We'll know if the accusation of astroturfing was true when we see the 2010 results. If the folks are real at these meetings, the ones that are being barred from being heard, there will be problems in the coming months.

Truth is, the 'right' has never been good at turning out crowds, certainly not to protest. Mistakenly they've held onto some idea that if they hold true to values, that it will work out. Now, I'm not referring to the Republican Party, so don't go that way. Talking about those that are truly for a federal government that is relegated to the issues that cannot be done by more local government or the individual. People who believe that the government should get out of the way, it's the problem not the solution.

For a long time, from both parties these folks are losing. So why suddenly have they started to join together to be heard? Bush. Obama.
 
We'll know if the accusation of astroturfing was true when we see the 2010 results. If the folks are real at these meetings, the ones that are being barred from being heard, there will be problems in the coming months.

Please. These teabaggers at these town halls number a few dozen or a few hundred middle aged, cranky, under educated white people. There's nothing that looks like "america" in them, in america's broadest sense. I don't see any brown, black, young, or asian. I don't even think I saw anyone under the age of 55.

There's nothing remotely grass roots about it, that I can see. A few dozen, old, angry white people is not a grass roots movement. Bill Maher says it perfectly:

Bill Maher says we live in a stupid country; wingnuts flip out

And before I go about demonstrating how, sadly, easy it is to prove the dumbness dragging down our country, let me just say that ignorance has life and death consequences. On the eve of the Iraq War, 69% of Americans thought Saddam Hussein was personally involved in 9/11. Four years later, 34% still did. Or take the health care debate we're presently having: members of Congress have recessed now so they can go home and "listen to their constituents." An urge they should resist because their constituents don't know anything. At a recent town-hall meeting in South Carolina, a man stood up and told his Congressman to "keep your government hands off my Medicare," which is kind of like driving cross country to protest highways.

I'm the bad guy for saying it's a stupid country, yet polls show that a majority of Americans cannot name a single branch of government, or explain what the Bill of Rights is. 24% could not name the country America fought in the Revolutionary War. More than two-thirds of Americans don't know what's in Roe v. Wade. Two-thirds don't know what the Food and Drug Administration does. Some of this stuff you should be able to pick up simply by being alive. You know, like the way the Slumdog kid knew about cricket.

Not here. Nearly half of Americans don't know that states have two senators and more than half can't name their congressman. And among Republican governors, only 30% got their wife's name right on the first try.

Sarah Palin says she would never apologize for America. Even though a Gallup poll says 18% of Americans think the sun revolves around the earth. No, they're not stupid. They're interplanetary mavericks. A third of Republicans believe Obama is not a citizen,


ANNIE: Truth is, the 'right' has never been good at turning out crowds, certainly not to protest. Mistakenly they've held onto some idea that if they hold true to values, that it will work out. Now, I'm not referring to the Republican Party, so don't go that way. Talking about those that are truly for a federal government that is relegated to the issues that cannot be done by more local government or the individual. People who believe that the government should get out of the way, it's the problem not the solution.

For a long time, from both parties these folks are losing. So why suddenly have they started to join together to be heard? Bush. Obama.


I have never gotten this recent dissertation that there is this vast legion of "principled conservatives" who "never supported Bush".

It really sounds to me like embarrased republicans who, belatedly, don't want to be associated with Bush/Cheney/Palin.

Bush spent most of his two terms, with overwhelming, and at times nearly universal support, from self-identified "conservatives" in every national poll taken.

To this day, numerous conservatives vainly try to defend their secret hero Bush, on message board forums.

Look, there is no groundswell of legions of americans who want to privitize social security, eliminate medicare, and trust corporations to protect the environment.

Annie: People who believe that the government should get out of the way, it's the problem not the solution.

This was actually the funniest, and most ironic thing you said.

After we just got fucked by wall street, after Enron raped california to the tune of 20 billion dollars, and after Halliburtion milked the taxpayer out of billions of dollars, while electrocuting american soldiers, I am actually astonished that rightwingers would even bother trotting out this shop-worn slogan
 
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